Approved for License/Handgun permit but denied purchase?

[thewarrenterror 0]

Hello everyone. Several months ago I submitted all the paperwork for a firearm license and a handgun permit here in NJ. After being fingerprinted, having a background check run, and whatever else it is they do, I was finally approved! Last month I got my license. I got my permit.

 

Fast forward to last week - I went to purchase a gun. Delay on the NCIS check. Okay, could be because I have the same name as my father and grandfather - whatever.

 

But today I get the news - I was denied. I don't have the best criminal history (a couple of DUIs, last one was 4 years ago), but it's certainly not the worst, and I am positive that there are people with worse criminal records than me out there purchasing guns.

 

So what's the deal? How can I have a background check run through and approved after several months of investigation, but then be denied at the moment I'm about to purchase a gun after just a few days of investigation? I haven't had any legal trouble in the last four years, much less the last MONTH since I was approved..

 

If anyone has any insight at all on this, I would very much appreciate it.

 

Also, some internet sleuthing has made me a little paranoid about the cops suddenly busting down my door because of the denial - like maybe just the act of trying to purchase a gun was somehow illegal because I was denied.. any thoughts on this?

 

Thanks!

[johnp 45]

Did you ask the dealer the reason NICS denied you?

 

Having the same name as your father shouldn't be a problem, seeing as how you have different SSN's.

[alec.mc 180]

Did you ask the dealer the reason NICS denied you?

 

Having the same name as your father shouldn't be a problem, seeing as how you have different SSN's.

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but isnt SSN optional when doing paper work when buying a firearm? Maybe he excluded and had to go with just the name that maybe raised some red flagson the nics?

[joshroz2 4]

If you have a good PD call the person who issued it to you and see what they say about it.

 

Just a couple of DUI's should not be a NCIS Disqualifier. But either way the PD messed up or NCIS messed up.

 

If NCIS messed up then you might need to contact them somehow to straighten it out. People do get denied by mistake.

[tj462nj 32]

a dealer doesn't find out the reason for denials, NICS doesn't tell us, the dealer can give you a denial request form which you can mail in and receive a written reason for denial from the state

[Maksim 1,504]

I am thinking multiple same names. Did you give them your social? If your dad/grandpa had any issues that would disqualify him... I would want to use my social to differentiate myself.

[johnp 45]

Correct me if I am wrong, but isnt SSN optional when doing paper work when buying a firearm? Maybe he excluded and had to go with just the name that maybe raised some red flagson the nics?

 

Everytime I've bought something through a dealer and they called nics, (nics) asked for my SSN. It says it's optional on the COE, when you buy a firearm FTF.

 

So technically I'm not sure if you have to give it for a nics check, but it makes the process easier so why not.

[tj462nj 32]

I am thinking multiple same names. Did you give them your social? If your dad/grandpa had any issues that would disqualify him... I would want to use my social to differentiate myself.

any time I've had a same name NICS check, they may ask for additional ID, they sometimes find out something that was not found on the permit process, specially 3 days later

[thewarrenterror 0]

I am thinking multiple same names. Did you give them your social? If your dad/grandpa had any issues that would disqualify him... I would want to use my social to differentiate myself.

 

Yeah, I did give them my social.. it took three days (five counting the weekend) for them to come back with the denial. My father and grandfather were both licensed gunowners when they were alive, so I don't think they had any disqualifying issues. All I can think is that somehow the DUIs are grounds for considering me some kind of habitual alcohol abuser? I honestly just don't know.

[thewarrenterror 0]

any time I've had a same name NICS check, they may ask for additional ID, they sometimes find out something that was not found on the permit process, specially 3 days later

 

This is helpful.. do you know how the permit process (which includes a background check and fingerprinting) differs from the NICS check?

[thewarrenterror 0]

If you have a good PD call the person who issued it to you and see what they say about it.

 

Just a couple of DUI's should not be a NCIS Disqualifier. But either way the PD messed up or NCIS messed up.

 

If NCIS messed up then you might need to contact them somehow to straighten it out. People do get denied by mistake.

 

The PD is my town's chief of police, I guess.. it's his signature on the permit. What does the NCIS check that the issuing PD doesn't? Shouldn't they come up with essentially the same info?

[PK90 3,570]

FYI, it is NICS (National Instant Criminal Background Check System)

 

More is checked in a few minutes than the PD can do in a few months in some cases. That is why the permit/FPID system is a waste of time.

 

Although New Jersey is a Point of Contact State, this video explains the NICS process >

 

[mcbethr 42]

I wouldn't worry too much about the police busting down your door. If you are a prohibited person... well, the system worked as it should. If you aren't a prohibited person, the system failed, and it can fail.

 

You can appeal your NICS decision:

 

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/appeals/nics_appeals_brochure_eng

 

It's a pain, but you can take it from there. You've come too far to turn back.

[joshroz2 4]

The PD is my town's chief of police, I guess.. it's his signature on the permit. What does the NCIS check that the issuing PD doesn't? Shouldn't they come up with essentially the same info?

 

It shouldn't matter who would find more or less.

Have you disclosed everything here and to the police dept.? Its just DUI's right? That should not disqualify you.

 

NICS does sometimes deny people by mistake. I remember seeing a stat on it somewhere and it was surprising.

[thewarrenterror 0]

It shouldn't matter who would find more or less.

Have you disclosed everything here and to the police dept.? Its just DUI's right? That should not disqualify you.

 

NICS does sometimes deny people by mistake. I remember seeing a stat on it somewhere and it was surprising.

 

It is just the DUIs.. but after some research it seems NJ has an additional prohibition on top of what is considered federally prohibited: "

an alcoholic, habitual drunkard, drug dependent person" is prohibited. Maybe the DUIs are grounds for considering me as such? I haven't had a drink in 3 years. Probably more. But my DMV abstract might tell a different story..

[thewarrenterror 0]

I wouldn't worry too much about the police busting down your door. If you are a prohibited person... well, the system worked as it should. If you aren't a prohibited person, the system failed, and it can fail.

 

You can appeal your NICS decision:

 

http://www.fbi.gov/a...ls_brochure_eng

 

It's a pain, but you can take it from there. You've come too far to turn back.

 

You're right. i think I will appeal. Just not sure if directly through the FBI or through NJ state police...

[joshroz2 4]

It is just the DUIs.. but after some research it seems NJ has an additional prohibition on top of what is considered federally prohibited: "

an alcoholic, habitual drunkard, drug dependent person" is prohibited. Maybe the DUIs are grounds for considering me as such? I haven't had a drink in 3 years. Probably more. But my DMV abstract might tell a different story..

 

 

 

You don't fall under that. That disqualification refers to current not past alcohol and drug users. If it has been years you are surely in the clear.

[PK90 3,570]

As tj462nj has stated, you appeal through the NJSP.

[Sigman 41]

Do you have any restraining order issues?  It doesn't matter how old, they need to be closed.  You can call NICS and find out what you were denied for.

[ALAN553 27]

A couple of DUI's??? Maybe that is two too many when it comes to this.

[woodentoe 14]

Troll.

 

Either the Reviewing agency says it's too many or they don't. That's why they write laws and place restrictions. Not so you can cast aspersions. Obviously, opinions are like assholes. Weve all got them.

 

I would say contact NICS and get a clear explanation why you were denied. Then, if you are really serious, appeal the decision.

 

If you lose your appeal, it wasn't meant to be.

[alec.mc 180]

Nothing is stopping you from buying a handgun used on a face to face sale, you have all the proper credentials ( no nics check on independent sales )

[bry@n 195]

A couple of DUI's??? Maybe that is two too many when it comes to this.

 

Don't be a douche. The guy has admitted his faults and if he is not on the wagon now, he should be able to buy a gun. Now, I will admit that a pattern has been set in his past, but people can reform themselves.

[bry@n 195]

Nothing is stopping you from buying a handgun used on a face to face sale, you have all the proper credentials ( no nics check on independent sales )

 

 

That is correct!

[PK90 3,570]

See the attached Appeal Form

NICS Denial Request Form.pdf

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Nothing is stopping you from buying a handgun used on a face to face sale, you have all the proper credentials ( no nics check on independent sales )

 

If he has a 4-part hand gun permit in-hand, he can purchase from a non-FFL literally right across a kitchen table!

 

IANAL but I would check into the denial. Could be something as simple as an incorrect SSN entered into the system. Or a sign of attempted identity fraud? Check your cc statements to make sure and get a look at your credit history to make sure that someone cutting bad checks isn't trying to use your SSN or something like that......

[ALAN553 27]

 

 

Don't be a douche. The guy has admitted his faults and if he is not on the wagon now, he should be able to buy a gun. Now, I will admit that a pattern has been set in his past, but people can reform themselves.

 

Don't be a douche?? Drinking driving and guns, and now a reformed drinker, is there anything fair or logical about any of the laws or processes that we have to endure in order to maintain our second amendment rights?? The law does not leave room for evaluating the change in people, it's has no heart.

[bry@n 195]

Don't be a douche?? Drinking driving and guns, and now a reformed drinker, is there anything fair or logical about any of the laws or processes that we have to endure in order to maintain our second amendment rights?? The law does not leave room for evaluating the change in people, it's has no heart.

 

Just because he has had dui's, does not make him a drunk. It makes him dumb at deciding to drive drunk a few times. Do I like the idea the guy made the mistake at all? no. I think twice is at least once too many in MY opinion, but who am I to judge. I have done plenty of things in my past that could have gone the other way and didn't. Had one went bad, I woulda been in a cell. Instead, I have my freedom and my rights intact. Doesn't make me better than him, just luckier.

 

My point is, the guy comes on here asking for help and there is no need to judge him any further than he has been judged already. No need to kick him while he is already down, unless that is in your character...................

[Barms 98]

PAGE 113 of the Nappen book says contact an attorney right now.. State police could be looking for you because of the denial..

 

(don't flame me.. i'm just reading from the book).

[johnp 45]

Just because he has had dui's, does not make him a drunk. It makes him dumb at deciding to drive drunk a few times. Do I like the idea the guy made the mistake at all? no. I think twice is at least once too many in MY opinion, but who am I to judge. I have done plenty of things in my past that could have gone the other way and didn't. Had one went bad, I woulda been in a cell. Instead, I have my freedom and my rights intact. Doesn't make me better than him, just luckier.

 

My point is, the guy comes on here asking for help and there is no need to judge him any further than he has been judged already. No need to kick him while he is already down, unless that is in your character...................

 

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