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Civilian, Non-Law Enforcement Carry Permit Aplication Help

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I am looking for someone who is in a legal profession, and has gone thru the process themselves, or as an advocate for a client, to help me with the application process. I figure it may increase my chances, however slim, if I was to consult someone with experience. If you have information on what works best please let me know. I know it's almost impossible to get one, so if you do not have anything more than that to add then please do not respond. I need constructive input, and solid advice.

Thanks in advance.

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With all due respect, a far less expensive and less timely option would be applying for an out of state permit such as Utah or Florida. You're pretty much guaranteed the permit and you could carry in PA with one of them. Yes, I know that doesn't mean NJ but look below in regards to that.

 

Unless you are bff's with a judge or some sort of very high ranking LEO official, your chances are slim to none. There have been cases where people have been kidnapped, their lives and families lives threatened, and they have been denied CCW's. 

 

IMO, it's just not worth the time, money, and effort. 

 

With all that said, if you do have all those three things, then I'd suggest contacting Evan Nappen as the first poster replied.

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With all due respect, a far less expensive and less timely option would be applying for an out of state permit such as Utah or Florida. You're pretty much guaranteed the permit and you could carry in PA with one of them. Yes, I know that doesn't mean NJ but look below in regards to that.

 

Unless you are bff's with a judge or some sort of very high ranking LEO official, your chances are slim to none. There have been cases where people have been kidnapped, their lives and families lives threatened, and they have been denied CCW's.

 

IMO, it's just not worth the time, money, and effort.

 

With all that said, if you do have all those three things, then I'd suggest contacting Evan Nappen as the first poster replied.

You can only carry in pa with the Utah permit now

 

 

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Perhaps if you could give us more specifics about your situation.

 

I believe at last count there were 1,600 carry permits issued to non LEO's in NJ although I've heard this number is now 1,800.  This number includes armed security and armored car guards.

 

The basic problem is that you have to have "justifiable need."  This was just upheld in federal court back in early August and enjoys something the court called "presumptive constitutionality" which basically means that this has been law for so long that they aren't even going to explore overturning it.  What you need is "urgent necessity for self-protection" and a general desire for self-protection or the carrying of large sums of cash do not meet this criteria.

 

Here's an example: Jeffery Muller was a pet shop owner who was kidnapped by a gang simply because he had the same name as a guy who stiffed them in a business deal.  After two years of legal battles, the state finally granted him a gun permit.  

 

Read this for more information:

http://blog.nj.com/njv_editorial_page/2011/03/in_this_case_a_well-earned_gun.html

 

Now if your case is similar to this man, you may have a chance.  Else, contact Evan Nappen.  I wish you the best of luck.  It's not impossible to get a carry permit in NJ, but I've been shooting for 25 years and I've never met anyone who had one.

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Move. That is what I did. I hear that you have a better chance of getting a carry permit posthumously in NJ than if you are alive. If you are looking for free and good advice you will get what you paid for. Someone just fought the battle up to the highest courts and lost so unless someone has demonstrated that they are trying to kill you with real attempts, do not waste your time.

 

Better to examine why you want to carry a gun so bad in the first place. The great majority of people in the U.S. die of natural causes. I survived until age 58 living in NJ without carrying a gun and I worked at piers, airport and trucking terminals, late at night. I worked in Newark, Jersey City and Hoboken until 2-3am. Just be smart and you will be OK. Carry what the law allows and be aware of your surroundings. For a fraction of what you would pay for legal bills to fight the State of NJ you can learn a martial art or perhaps hire a bodyguard.

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So i can carry in PA with my non resident Utah permit? Please say yes but only if its legal. I knew they stopped honoring the Fl non res permit.

 

   No its not impossible to get a NJ carry but it is very improbable. Save your time,money and energy

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What constitutes justifiable need???

There has to be a criteria written some where that is part of the law.

Judges are not kings and it seems in nj they are treated as such

 

there is no standard.... that is part of the problem.. 

 

the law is written the way it is for the following reason.... and it is honestly probably worse than just disallowing them all together...

the law is written so NO ONE can carry... but they leave the possibility to maybe get a permit is the need is justifiable.. this way if there is someone the government wants to have a gun.. they leave themselves that wiggle room... its not wiggle room for me.. or you.. or anyone else.... it is wiggle room for those with connections in place to obtain things like that.. and in that regard.. the system is VERY flawed.. 

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Nothing in NJ constitutes justifiable need unless you're working as an armed guard.  Then your permit limits you to carry on the job only.

 

According to the AG's supplimental brief in the Pisczatoski case, NJ has issued between 500 and 800 permits each year for the last 10 years.  That's one one hundredth of one percent of NJ residents.  PA issues CCW permits to just over 8% of PA residents and remember, PA is a state that allows open carry without a permit (except for in philly). 

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I am looking for someone who is in a legal profession, and has gone thru the process themselves, or as an advocate for a client, to help me with the application process. I figure it may increase my chances, however slim, if I was to consult someone with experience. If you have information on what works best please let me know. I know it's almost impossible to get one, so if you do not have anything more than that to add then please do not respond. I need constructive input, and solid advice.

Thanks in advance.

Welcome to the forum.

 

First you will be denied by the chief of police , then appeal and lose, then a Superior Court Judge.

 

Here is the constructive part of my post for you: Superior Court Judge is your friend.

 

 

Go see Nappen. He has experience with this. You pay him he ll help you file the application.

 

But if you dont have a Superior Court Judge that owes you a really big favour and will allow you your justifiable need you re out of luck and a lot of money.

 

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/05/sussex_county_judge_allows_kid.html

 

 

Just Curious?

Have you been shooting long? Have you ever had a legal problem?

Or are you thinking that your need will be so justifiable that they ll see the light because you read the law in a nice an innocent way?

 

.....i m not knocking you down...just wondering if you can provide more info?

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Honestly if a guy who restocks ATMs with lots of cash or a guy who got threats from Al-Qaeda can't get one, your chance is slim to none. But if you want to go through the exercise of applying you need the forms, a range qualification and training along with 3 references. The judge has the final say even if your police chief approves.

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Can't we request or have the nj2a file a petition to request the justifiable need from the state police

Does the open records law apply to these records if they black out the names

 

The justifiable need standard was explained like this by Evan Nappan on Gun for Hire Radio.  I'm paraphrasing here, but this is the gist:

 

Basically the judges looked for some kind of legal precedent for "Justifiable Need" or "Urgent Necessity."  They couldn't find one, but they did take a page out of the law code for when the use of deadly force is "Justifiable."  

 

In a nutshell, you are only justified to use deadly force when you have no other options because the actor is doing something so horrible that you must risk the actor's death or serious bodily harm to stop them.  That is the only time when deadly force is authorized.

 

So... logically if you "need" to carry a gun, it is because the state believes you are in such imminent peril that only the issue of a carry permit can stop this threat.

 

This is a pretty high standard.  As Nappan explained it, if someone is shooting at you *right now* you can qualify for a carry permit.  If they are not, then you have no justifiable need.

 

Remember Catch 22, that old book about Bomber Pilots during World War II?  The "Catch 22" in "Catch 22" was one of contradictory rules.  Basically, if you were a pilot and were crazy, you could be grounded.  All you had to do was ask.  But if you were sane enough to ask, then you weren't crazy, so you had to keep flying missions.

 

New Jersey's situation is similar to "Catch 22."  Yes, you will get a permit if you have Justifiable Need.  But you don't have Justifiable Need right now because you don't need to shoot anybody.  But the moment you need to shoot someone, you have Justifiable Need.

 

Now you said:

 

 

 

Judges are not kings and it seems in nj they are treated as such 

 

No, they are not kings.  They aren't acting as kings either.  They are just following the law.

 

NJ first went to a Carry Permitting system back in the 1920's.  Why?  Because NJ was in the perfect place for Prohibition Era gangsters to offload their cargo.  If you were a corrupt mayor who was on the take, you could ensure that the population of your town couldn't fight the gangsters who wanted to use a person's business or dockyard as a front for transferring alcohol.

 

So why does this system continue today, even though some 42 other states have "Shall Issue" laws?

 

Well, for the same reason we can't pump our own gas.  The law has been like this since the 1920's.  Entire generations have grown up not knowing anyone who carries a gun.  It's abnormal and a pretty big leap of faith.

 

There are people in this state who don't know anybody who even owns a gun, or who can't imagine why you would need one in the first place.  Maybe some of these people would begrudgingly admit that hunters and farmers need shotguns, or maybe... maybe a bodega owner or Jeweler.  But to physically take one out of the house!  Ludicrous!  Why would anybody need to do that?

 

Look, brother.  It's an uphill battle.  If you genuinely think you have a Justifiable Need, call Evan Nappan and start the process.  Else, join NJ2AS and let's work it through the courts.

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So in other words you have a better chance of hitting the lottery then you got of getting a ccw in nj

Seems kinda strange don't it I mean statistically speaking

Unfortunately this is a fairly accurate statement

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How hard is it to get one as a security guard? I know it is heavily restricted but I'm curious about that process.

 

My best friend went through that one a few years ago.  The process is pretty simple. You just need to be hired and receive a letter of need from your job.  Then you take that to your local PD and the chief signs off and passes it off to the judge, and voila you have a restricted permit good for 2 years.

 

That's all in theory.  However, my buddy was delayed for 3 months by the chief, then another month by the judge.  When he finally received the permit, he got a letter from the judge saying something to the effect of "I don't do this normally.  I hate doing this.  Don't f up.  If you f up, I will nail your balls to the wall and make an example out of you."

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Curious what people think: say hypothetically that someone had 50k to spend towards obtaining a nj ccp. Could one find a connected lawyer offer to pay him for his time for help with the application and agree to pay a 50k bonus if the application is granted. Let the lawyer worry about how it happens. I'm obviously not looking for suggestions but am curious as to whether people think such a thing might work in this wonderful state.

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Curious what people think: say hypothetically that someone had 50k to spend towards obtaining a nj ccp. Could one find a connected lawyer offer to pay him for his time for help with the application and agree to pay a 50k bonus if the application is granted. Let the lawyer worry about how it happens. I'm obviously not looking for suggestions but am curious as to whether people think such a thing might work in this wonderful state.

$50k might do it, but not in the way you describe.  It would be about $10k in legal fees and $40k+ in campaign donations, payola and other gratuities for officials at the local, county and state level.

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Why don't we just get like 100 guys to apply for permits and see what happens and when we all fail sue the state

 

We can also get 100 guys to bang their heads on a wall to see if that helps too.  Your efforts are better applied toward getting the fudge out of this crapstain of a state.

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