D.C. Revisited

[Newtonian 453]

We all knew it was too good to be true, didn't we?

 

http://bit.ly/1RqOcmP

 

Evidently the judge who ruled favorably on Washington DC carry has been summarily "disqualified."

 

In a five-page ruling from a three-judge panel at the U.S. Court of Appeals for D.C., the judges unanimously found that Judge Frederick Scullin went beyond the scope of his designation as a visiting judge in D.C. when he ruled on the case,Wrenn v. D.C., which was prompted by a February lawsuit filed by two D.C. residents seeking concealed carry permits.

"Although Judge Scullin had served under a properly issued designation, the difficulty in the present case is that designation was limited to specific and enumerated cases," wrote the judges in the decision, which was first spotted by the National Law Journal. "The present litigation is not one of those cases."

Thus, judicial remedies have failed both DC and NJ. 

 

What's on our agenda these days besides the impenetrable SAPPA proceedings, recalling our legislators one by one (thus inducing much self-soiling and hoarding of adult diapers), dissing the only possible person who could help us (Christie), stirring up a hornet's nest with no clear goal (Sweeney), acknowledging and supporting "justifiable need" by representing kidnap victims and owners of cash machines in seedy neighborhoods, and exposing delays by government agencies issuing gun permits that legally, constitutionally, and common-sense-ally should not be required in the first place?

 

We're our own worst enemies.

 

 

 

[n4p226r 105]

i don't know the legalities and case law surrounding stuff like this, but it reeks of horse shit

[njpilot 671]

Newtonian, you really believe that Christie will help you on guns? Seriously?

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

What's on our agenda these days besides the impenetrable SAPPA proceedings, recalling our legislators one by one (thus inducing much self-soiling and hoarding of adult diapers), dissing the only possible person who could help us (Christie), stirring up a hornet's nest with no clear goal (Sweeney), acknowledging and supporting "justifiable need" by representing kidnap victims and owners of cash machines in seedy neighborhoods, and exposing delays by government agencies issuing gun permits that legally, constitutionally, and common-sense-ally should not be required in the first place?

 

We're our own worst enemies.

 

So then what would you suggest we do?  Try to win the NJ Senate and Assembly?  Good luck with that.

 

I think we are f'd after Christie's term is up, maybe sooner if a Republican wins and he gets the AG spot that he appears to want.

[Newtonian 453]

Newtonian, you really believe that Christie will help you on guns? Seriously?

Oy vey we've been through this with at least 8-9 posts. 

 

We had a unique opportunity to force the hand, on a national stage, of a mostly anti-gun governor who was expecting to run in Republican presidential primaries. He would have been forced to say something, no matter how insincere, to show Republican voters that he was on the right side of the debate. He knew, everybody knew, that he wouldn't poll 5% if he didn't show his 2nd Amendment cred. That was months and months ago. At that point NRA, NJ2AS, ANJRPC, could have prevailed on him to keep his word. 

 

For example, posters a lot more knowledgeable than I believe that he could change substantial portions of NJ Administrative Code related to firearms, including justifiable need, on his own. To me that seemed like an opening, an opportunity. Not very likely to succeed but one that was definitely worth the minimal effort involved. Compare that to the initiatives many of you have recently embraced, at considerable cost of time and resources, which have failed miserably.

 

Engaging Christie could not have failed any worse. We now have two years left but the greatest opportunity has passed. With his presidential aspirations in the toilet, and no need now even to pretend he is something he is not, our governor is as likely to help us as he is to run a 100 yard dash in 9 seconds. We had a little hope and now we have zero but don't worry, we showed him!!! And I'm sure somebody somewhere is pooping in their drawers!!! That's the goal isn't it? Mass self-defecation. Or is it mass delusion?

 

So where are we now? What is next? Who is next? Will we ever have another opportunity like the one I describe however thin and tenuous? 

 

You'll have the answer in November, 2017. Then we'll see who goes running out for adult diapers.

[Newtonian 453]

So then what would you suggest we do?  Try to win the NJ Senate and Assembly?  Good luck with that.

 

I think we are f'd after Christie's term is up, maybe sooner if a Republican wins and he gets the AG spot that he appears to want.

I've already suggested things that nobody had any interest in, like trying to flip a few seats which was eminently possible. I've also been vocal w/ respect to our infatuation with proving that individuals indeed fulfill requirements for justifiable need instead of attacking that sick concept itself. I've spoken out against the preposterous notion of jury nullification, previously (supposedly, as described to me) a serious strategy for one of the state wide organizations. And you all know where I stood on the recall. 

 

Was I right or was I wrong? Was a "get out the vote" effort in a district where the Republican lost by 75 votes as stupid an idea as some of the initiatives I mentioned above? Do you seriously think it would have been harder than one particular effort that consumed so much of forum members' time and money?

 

We will only know how right I was in January, 2018. I think most of you already know though.

 

And you can pretty much forget Christie becoming AG. If he ever stated that that would be his ideal job then he was B.S.ing pure and simple. First of all he knows there will never ever be another Republican governor in this state. Second why actually go to work at his age when you can "write" "books," give "lectures," "consult," serve on corporate boards, grab a no-show job at some law firm, cash in on various and sundry past favors, etc. In other words not do a blessed worthwhile thing and still make $4 million per year? 

 

Sheesh.

[brucin 923]

NJ is a lost cause and not even worth arguing about. Flip one seat GOP and 4 go DEM. Some counties will remain red but the rest of the state is solidly blue and nothing will ever change that.

 

The best hope is to elect pro 2A Dem's if you can find them but they are out there.

[The brew guy 22]

Oy vey we've been through this with at least 8-9 posts. 

 

 

And yet, you insist there's hope for Christie...

 

You seem to have forgotten that Christie has been asked these questions a few times, and he's danced around with BS answers answers involving non-existent committees to re-evaluate existing laws and his hands are tied by the legislature. He talks a good game, but his record shows that he will not do a damn thing for us. You want to push for a change, great, but push where it might do some good. Find someone with a better record on 2A and push that person. It shouldn't be that hard to find someone with a better record, heck, even Obama has a better record than Christie when it comes to 2A. Maybe you should try asking Obama for help, you'd have a better chance than you do with Christie.

[The brew guy 22]

 

The best hope is to elect pro 2A Dem's if you can find them but they are out there.

I tried that line of thinking, it didn't go over well. Apparently most of the forum are not the one-issue-voters that they claim to be, they'll vote for any republican without checking to see if he's a gun-grabber first. That's how we got Christie.

Nobody wants to accept the fact that NJ is an affluent state and affluent states are always blue. Turning NJ red just isn't going to happen. There are plenty of blue states where the 2nd Ammendment is respected, and that's what we need to strive for. That's the only hope we've got.

[Newtonian 453]

 

And yet, you insist there's hope for Christie...

 

You guys don't f-ing get it. Do you actually read my posts or are you so caught up in retribution, spite, revenge, and ideologic purity that you've stopped thinking? And I thought that I was hot-headed and rash. Yikes.

 

CHRISTIE WAS ALL WE HAD. Get that into your skull. THERE IS NOBODY ELSE IN THE ENTIRE STATE GOVERNMENT, NOR WILL THERE EVER AGAIN BE who can or will possibly help.

 

At least he sometimes SAYS he's pro-2A. He's shown something. How many gun bills do you think Sweeney will veto? Hahaha you guys are amazing. "He wanted the assault rifle ban in 1993." Wow. 1993. 

 

The alternatives say "confiscate, confiscate." Really, you equate those two sentiments, no matter how insincere the first one may be?

 

It would have cost NOTHING AT ALL to push him a little, on a very different stage than a Trenton press conference. Maybe a 5% chance that something positive would occur. But as an investment of effort, time, and money a very good one indeed.

 

Now all we have are your pipe dreams and sour grapes. Enjoy them while you can and stock up on vaseline.

[The brew guy 22]

You just don't get it, Christie was never "ALL WE HAD" because we never had him in the first place. You don't have to go back to 1993 to find the proof, Have you forgotten about the .50 cal ban he vetoed in 2013? That was legislation that he REQUESTED, but only vetoed it after being told by the New Hampshire GOP big wigs that it would ruin his chances of national office. Christie is "confiscate, confiscate," he just has to hide it or the party will disown him. He's vetoed a few things, as little as he could, but he's never given us a damn thing and he's taken plenty away from us.

 

Remember when the CMP could send a rifle to you without going through a FFL? How is that going for you with Christie?

 

Christie will pardon a few high profile cases to make them go away, but never mentions changing the law. HE DOESN'T EVEN MENTION THE POSSIBILITY!!! Don't make the news and you don't get a pardon.

 

Any idea when that committee will be formed to look into fixing out broken system? Don't hold your breath.

 

Stop confusing "our only hope" and "hopeless." I agree with you that we need to find a course and do something, but beating your head against a brick wall is not my idea of "doing something."

[njpilot 671]

^^^This^^^

 

and don't forget the lawsuits against the state that Christie and his anti-gun AGs fought

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

CHRISTIE WAS ALL WE HAD. Get that into your skull. THERE IS NOBODY ELSE IN THE ENTIRE STATE GOVERNMENT, NOR WILL THERE EVER AGAIN BE who can or will possibly help.

 

 

 

Gotta agree with you there.  Gun laws have not gotten any better under him, although as he points out, he does not make the laws.

And things certainly would have been a lot worse under any of the Dems.

[bhunted 887]

Gotta agree with you there. Gun laws have not gotten any better under him, although as he points out, he does not make the laws.

And things certainly would have been a lot worse under any of the Dems.

He doesn't stop them either.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Newtonian 453]

You just don't get it, Christie was never "ALL WE HAD" because we never had him in the first place. You don't have to go back to 1993 to find the proof, Have you forgotten about the .50 cal ban he vetoed in 2013? That was legislation that he REQUESTED, but only vetoed it after being told by the New Hampshire GOP big wigs that it would ruin his chances of national office. Christie is "confiscate, confiscate," he just has to hide it or the party will disown him. He's vetoed a few things, as little as he could, but he's never given us a damn thing and he's taken plenty away from us.

 

Remember when the CMP could send a rifle to you without going through a FFL? How is that going for you with Christie?

 

Christie will pardon a few high profile cases to make them go away, but never mentions changing the law. HE DOESN'T EVEN MENTION THE POSSIBILITY!!! Don't make the news and you don't get a pardon.

 

Any idea when that committee will be formed to look into fixing out broken system? Don't hold your breath.

 

Stop confusing "our only hope" and "hopeless." I agree with you that we need to find a course and do something, but beating your head against a brick wall is not my idea of "doing something."

Again, you just don't get it. Read my goddamned posts and stop talking like a bratty teenager.

 

I hope your life is full of people who meet all your expectations all the time. I hope you never have to cajole or negotiate with people who are only out for themselves. Because otherwise you will be very, very unhappy.

[Newtonian 453]

You just don't get it, Christie was never "ALL WE HAD" because we never had him in the first place.

Who else or what else do you have?

 

Please name the people, organizations, or strategies capable of helping us more than the governor and I'll agree that I'm wrong. 

 

Just list them. I'm an honest guy. I'll admit I'm wrong as I have many times.

[JohnnyB 4,325]

If it benefited Christie's chances he would give us CCW or at least would have appointed 3 people to the commission he promised and never delivered on!

He lies when pressed on the EO option as he did on NJ101.5 meet the governor!!! I see Newtonian's point and the other side as well! There is no right

answer since we are not in Christie's head and do not know what he thinks! All we have to go on are his actions up until now! Has he helped our cause, YES!

Could he have done more, YES!!!! I have sent letters and emails and never NEVER got a single response from his office! What does that tell me??

 

I think Christie knows he is going nowhere in this election! He is in it for all the free hoagies and steak sandwiches he gets while out on the stump!

[The brew guy 22]

Again, you just don't get it. Read my goddamned posts and stop talking like a bratty teenager.

 

  

Who else or what else do you have?

 

Please name the people, organizations, or strategies capable of helping us more than the governor and I'll agree that I'm wrong. 

 

Just list them. I'm an honest guy. I'll admit I'm wrong as I have many times.

Roflmao... I haven't been called a bratty teenager since the 70's. OTOH, you certainly come off as a "the ornery old man, stuck in his ways." Yet I doubt you're that much older than I am.

I've read your posts, plenty of them, even the silly ones about how a conservative estimate would be 2.8 votes for your cause from a household with 2 voters that aren't "single issue voters." I've agreed with some of your thoughts and disagreed with others.

 

It's pretty clear that one of us is not paying attention. Your question "who else or what else..." shows an utter lack of understanding of the problem. The word "else" does not belong in the sentence. (Please read the following sentence carefully) Chris Christie is not on your side, never was, never will be.(now read it again to make sure you didn't miss anything).

 

Christie has thrown us a few crumbs. Those crumbs were for his benefit, not ours. I can't name one thing that has improved under his watch. Are you really ready to settle for "we lost less than we would have with someone else?"

[CMJeepster 2,777]

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/76758-federal-judge-grants-injunction-against-dc-good-cause-requirement/

[CMJeepster 2,777]

"New judge hearing challenge to D.C. gun law rules city can keep enforcing law" https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/new-judge-hearing-challenge-to-dc-gun-law-rules-city-can-keep-enforcing-law/2016/03/07/6c392198-e49d-11e5-bc08-3e03a5b41910_story.html

[Parker 213]

Christie's latest appoint to acting Attorney General (Lougy) is another ChristieBot, doing his bidding, and Lougy is not a gun-friendly attorney based on past cases he's been associated with in the state.  

[maintenanceguy 510]

I doubt that anyone is surprised.  Unfortunately, most judges have forgotten that they are to judge according to the law and not bend the constitution to fit their personal beliefs.

[bzer1 15]

You guys don't f-ing get it. Do you actually read my posts or are you so caught up in retribution, spite, revenge, and ideologic purity that you've stopped thinking? And I thought that I was hot-headed and rash. Yikes.

 

CHRISTIE WAS ALL WE HAD. Get that into your skull. THERE IS NOBODY ELSE IN THE ENTIRE STATE GOVERNMENT, NOR WILL THERE EVER AGAIN BE who can or will possibly help.

 

At least he sometimes SAYS he's pro-2A. He's shown something. How many gun bills do you think Sweeney will veto? Hahaha you guys are amazing. "He wanted the assault rifle ban in 1993." Wow. 1993. 

 

The alternatives say "confiscate, confiscate." Really, you equate those two sentiments, no matter how insincere the first one may be?

 

It would have cost NOTHING AT ALL to push him a little, on a very different stage than a Trenton press conference. Maybe a 5% chance that something positive would occur. But as an investment of effort, time, and money a very good one indeed.

 

Now all we have are your pipe dreams and sour grapes. Enjoy them while you can and stock up on vaseline.

Wasn't it Christie himself who said that he didn't think an executive order to change justifiable need would work? Right from the very beginning of his presidential run he tried to convince people that he was pro 2A, yet made no attempt to change anything, and just bitched about the legislature. A few well placed pardons was somehow supposed to convince people that he was not the anti that he professed to be. I hoped that he would feel forced to do something positive to convince the rest of the country, but he paid passing lip service which didn't convince anyone. The only thing that will stop the next set of bans and idiotic new restrictions is if the cost is so high that it completely breaks the state. I'm talking hundreds of billions just to fight the law suits. So much that there would be no money left for anything else. In other words, completely destroy the economy of the state. With Dildocrats in the majority, maybe, just maybe, enough people will have a moment of clarity long enough to realize that they need to be sent packing. Sorry to say but Christie had a chance to act, and decided that ideology trumped the 2nd amendment and the rights of the citizens of NJ. He never intended to do anything for us, and nothing was going to change that. As soon as he is replaced by a democrat, the hammer will come down. Again, he had plenty of opportunities to do something positive, and chose instead to do nothing, but point out the incredibly obvious. No help from Christie was ever coming, nothing was going to change that...

[Zeke 5,504]

Bzer, word on the street is mid March. Pass judgement after

[bzer1 15]

I'll believe it when I see it. Until then I will look at every politician with a jaundiced eye. I have been in this fight for the better part of 30 years, and have invested thousands in donations only to watch them spit in our faces. I vote in every election, and watch as every year fewer and fewer people vote. I'm convinced that guerrilla warfare is the only way to get anything done. That's what the enemy does, that's what we should do. If it doesn't work, then I think revenge law suits, and a scorched earth policy is the best alternative. That's what the leftists do, and it works for them. Just wait until they think they have no opposition, they will enact every piece of revenge legislation they can dream up.

[Zeke 5,504]

I'll believe it when I see it. Until then I will look at every politician with a jaundiced eye. I have been in this fight for the better part of 30 years, and have invested thousands in donations only to watch them spit in our faces. I vote in every election, and watch as every year fewer and fewer people vote. I'm convinced that guerrilla warfare is the only way to get anything done. That's what the enemy does, that's what we should do. If it doesn't work, then I think revenge law suits, and a scorched earth policy is the best alternative. That's what the leftists do, and it works for them. Just wait until they think they have no opposition, they will enact every piece of revenge legislation they can dream up.

Believe me, I understand. Its definitely broken.

[bzer1 15]

Bzer, word on the street is mid March. Pass judgement after

what's the street saying now? Still the same? I waiting for the "compromise".

[CMJeepster 2,777]

"U.S. judge strikes down D.C. concealed-carry gun law as likely unconstitutional"

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/us-judge-strikes-down-dc-concealed-carry-gun-law-as-likely-unconstitutional/2016/05/17/d36d35dc-1c49-11e6-8c7b-6931e66333e7_story.html

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

So requiring "good reason" is unconstitutional, but "justified need" is still OK.

[CMJeepster 2,777]

They're one in the same.  I just read most of the decision and the judge is basically saying that the Constitution and other sources allow for carry, with some restriction, but the "good reason" and "Justifiable need" type restrictions out there are unconstitutional because it puts the burden of proof on the citizen, whereas the burden of proof should be on the government.  At least that's what I got from it.  IANAL.  That pretty much falls into line with my thinking that one has natural rights and the only reason the government can restrict or suspend those individual rights in in the interest of a majority.

 

Think of it this way...  If the government restricted your natural right to have children (China), they better have a damn good reason.  Better yet, if the government decided that it was in society's best interest to remove every man's penis to avoid having a few criminals commit rape, they would do so.  Or the non-cringe worthy version that NJ goes by of it's illegal unless we grant an exception.