Inexpensive handguns for the ladies? Something 'cute'

[Cereza 106]

My $.02

After shooting my S&W Shield 9mm, my daughter and daughter in law both went out and bought one (they shoot regularly).

 

I've read several articles about the great differences between what a man thinks a female wants in a gun and what the lady actually wants....don't make any assumptions - there are legal issues you should also be aware of if you buy your wife a gun with your permit, could get ugly if she were to take it to a range without you, real ugly if she ever had the need to use it to defend herself.

 

Not to derail the thread, but this is something that I'd like clarification on. 

[Purple Patrick 638]

My $.02

After shooting my S&W Shield 9mm, my daughter and daughter in law both went out and bought one (they shoot regularly).

 

I've read several articles about the great differences between what a man thinks a female wants in a gun and what the lady actually wants....don't make any assumptions - there are legal issues you should also be aware of if you buy your wife a gun with your permit, could get ugly if she were to take it to a range without you, real ugly if she ever had the need to use it to defend herself.

After shooting my 686, shield, 1911, m &p pro, and Sig 226 all my girlfriend wants is a revolver. I would have pinned her to the 1911 but nope she loves the blastyNess off smaller frames shooting full house 357

 

this signature exceeds the 15 character capacity count

[n4p226r 105]

Not to derail the thread, but this is something that I'd like clarification on.

No clarification needed. Your wife cannot touch your handgun or you hers inside your home. It would be an illegal transfer. Now, would any issues arise if she used it to kill a home intruder, that's the 25-50 year question

[T Bill 649]

There are no provisions under NJ law allowing the temporary transfer of firearms to an adult at one's home or on property owned or leased. Temporary transfer can however be made to children  per 2C:58-6.1. More NJ gun law stupidity.

[Cereza 106]

No clarification needed. Your wife cannot touch your handgun or you hers inside your home. It would be an illegal transfer. Now, would any issues arise if she used it to kill a home intruder, that's the 25-50 year question

 

My husband isn't allowed to touch my Beretta anyway.   

 

 

 

There are no provisions under NJ law allowing the temporary transfer of firearms to an adult at one's home or on property owned or leased. Temporary transfer can however be made to children  per 2C:58-6.1. More NJ gun law stupidity.

 

2C:58-3.1-3.2 also apply, or rather, don't apply...    This state, ay, ay, ay… 

[Lambo2936 297]

My $.02

After shooting my S&W Shield 9mm, my daughter and daughter in law both went out and bought one (they shoot regularly).

 

I've read several articles about the great differences between what a man thinks a female wants in a gun and what the lady actually wants....don't make any assumptions - there are legal issues you should also be aware of if you buy your wife a gun with your permit, could get ugly if she were to take it to a range without you, real ugly if she ever had the need to use it to defend herself.

She obviously wouldnt have access to the firearm if i am not present, nor would it be a HD gun. I have a 12G and Glock set up for that. I'm not going to jail over a hobby

Again, it is exclusively to keep her entertained with something other than my 15-22 she picked out in 'pumpkin' finish, haha. The firearm is obviously mine and will be locked in my safe which she does not have access to.. Itll also allow me to hold it over her head when i want another firearm for myself

[45Doll 5,877]

No clarification needed. Your wife cannot touch your handgun or you hers inside your home. It would be an illegal transfer. Now, would any issues arise if she used it to kill a home intruder, that's the 25-50 year question

Not quite. NJ 2C:39-6e:

 

"e. Nothing in subsections b., c. and d. of N.J.S.2C:39-5 shall be construed to

prevent a person keeping or carrying about his place of business, residence, premises

or other land owned or possessed by him, any firearm, or from carrying the same, in

the manner specified in subsection g. of this section, from any place of purchase to his

residence or place of business, between his dwelling and his place of business, between

one place of business or residence and another when moving, or between his dwelling

or place of business and place where such firearms are repaired, for the purpose of

repair. For the purposes of this section, a place of business shall be deemed to be a

fixed location."

 

It does not say 'any firearm you purchased'.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Not quite. NJ 2C:39-6e:

 

"e. Nothing in subsections b., c. and d. of N.J.S.2C:39-5 shall be construed to

prevent a person keeping or carrying about his place of business, residence, premises

or other land owned or possessed by him, any firearm, or from carrying the same, in

the manner specified in subsection g. of this section, from any place of purchase to his

residence or place of business, between his dwelling and his place of business, between

one place of business or residence and another when moving, or between his dwelling

or place of business and place where such firearms are repaired, for the purpose of

repair. For the purposes of this section, a place of business shall be deemed to be a

fixed location."

 

It does not say 'any firearm you purchased'.

BRAVO!  Interpretation of common WRITTEN English is a talent in today's world!

 

When you die you can will firearms to kin OR friends OR strangers......NO PERMIT NEEDED for them to get the gun(s)!  Firearms are treated as TANGIBLE PERSONAL PROPERTY so long as they aren't subject to seizure through the commission of an illegal act and/or arrest.  Firearms can even be willed to Prohibited persons, who then, by law, have 180 days to dispose of them (w/ CLEO being notified)!

 

To my 45 years of firearm knowledge, there's never been a DA or Prosecutor in NJ looking to jam-up a family member / significant other for using a firearm that they don't OWN.  Is there a specific EXEMPTION and/or EXCEPTION that one can point to in the 2C firearm statutes?  NO (other than the one that's already printed HERE).  The totality of the circumstances also comes into play.  Can a wife bring a husband's hand gun to the range w/o the husband being along for the ride?  Sure she can, but technically in NJ she has to bury or cremate him first  (tangible personal property).  If I had a buck for every time it took place in NJ, I could buy a yaht, as it happens on a DAILY basis, since couples treat their property (including, God forbid, FIREARMS!) as having JOINT CUSTODY........

[45Doll 5,877]

Thank you .50. I'll take my bows later.

 

I would only add that as long as we're not discussing prohibited persons or weapons, or illegally acquired weapons, all residents of a dwelling are permitted to handle and carry any firearm in that dwelling. And to use if legally appropriate.

 

I resurrected that section about willing firearms without permits too while I was hunting down the other. We just put a specific firearm clause into our wills to meet both state and federal inter-state requirements.

[InFamous 311]

Thank you Smokin .50 and 45Doll. This has always my interpretation of the law also. I have never once worried about handling my wife's Pavona or her touching any of my handguns. I certainly wouldn't hesitate shooting someone threatening me or my family with hers just because it was "purchased with her permit"

 

Not that hers is the most accessible one anyway

[45Doll 5,877]

The only time possession by residents in a dwelling would be an issue would be at the Federal level with Title II weapons. But since we don't have those in New Jermany the point is moot.

 

When I get to PA there's a gun trust in my future, for that exact reason.

[Ricky_Bobby 130]

I saw the topic title and knew it was Lambo lol.

 

Let her pick her own pistol - it's a very personal choice as is, and double for a woman.

 

For example my wife likes the extra few oz of my PPQ for recoil as opposed to my Glock 26. Sometimes they prefer more standard sized pistols as opposed to the pocket pistols we think they would like

[T Bill 649]

Well, Nappen's interpretation of possession / temporary transfer is directly opposite as stated on the bottom of his book on Page 82.  Not going to debate the issue just citing my source.

[n4p226r 105]

That kind of contradicts everything about temporary transfers. Maybe the law is worded incorrectly or correctly but according to this part of the law,how would it not be an illegal transfer.

 

 

(UPDATED THROUGH P.L. 2016, ch.23, and JR 1 of 2016)

TITLE 2C THE NEW JERSEY CODE OF CRIMINAL JUSTICE

2C:58-3.1. Temporary transfer of firearms

2C:58-3.1. Temporary transfer of firearms

1. a. Notwithstanding the provisions of N.J.S.2C:39-9, N.J.S.2C:58-2, N.J.S.2C:58-3 or any other statute to the contrary concerning the transfer or disposition of firearms, the legal owner, or a dealer licensed under N.J.S.2C:58-2, may temporarily transfer a handgun, rifleor shotgun to another person who is 18 years of age or older, whether or not the person receiving the firearm holds a firearms purchaser identification card or a permit to carry a handgun. The person to whom a handgun, rifle or shotgun is temporarily transferred by the legal owner of the firearm or a licensed dealer may receive, possess, carry and use that handgun, rifle or shotgun, if the transfer is made upon a firing range operated by a licensed dealer, by a law enforcement agency, a legally recognized military organization or a rifle or pistol club which has filed a copy of its charter with the superintendent and annually submits to the superintendent a list of its members and if the firearm is received, possessed, carried and used for the sole purpose of target practice, trap or skeet shooting, or competition upon that firing range or instruction and training at any location.

 

A transfer under this subsection shall be for not more than eight consecutive hours in any 24-hour period and may be made for a set fee or an hourly charge.

 

The firearm shall be handled and used by the person to whom it is temporarily transferred only in the actual presence or under the direct supervision of the legal owner of the firearm, the dealer who transferred the firearm or any other person competent to supervise the handling and use of firearms and authorized to act for that purpose by the legal owner or licensed dealer. The legal owner of the firearm or the licensed dealer shall be on the premises or the property of the firing range during the entire time that the firearm is in the possession of the person to whom it is temporarily transferred.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

The only time possession by residents in a dwelling would be an issue would be at the Federal level with Title II weapons. But since we don't have those in New Jermany the point is moot.

 

When I get to PA there's a gun trust in my future, for that exact reason.

EXACTLY!  Otherwise there would be laws on the books stating we had to park our sedans in our living rooms and use securely tied packages OR place yer Rod in yer car trunk .

 

^^^^Obviously it's sarcasm folks, but it makes you THINK!  There aren't ANY mandatory storage laws for firearms on the books 'cept for kids access laws......  So if I leave my loaded OR unloaded hand gun laying on a night table & my wife spills coffee on it & wants to clean the mess before I get home, is she a felon for picking-up and clearing the piece and cleaning the spilled coffee and reassembling everything (including my hand gun) to make it look like nuthin' happened?

 

NJ Politicians are a bunch of out-of-work, out-of-touch Lawyers w/o a lick of common sense.  They would use a ream of paper to tell you how to wipe yer ass (or drive your gun to the range or other EXEMPT location, lol) and at what angle the wipe must take place, lol!  So ask yourselves a question:  Why when it comes to storage and access in dwellings (where multiple humans reside) did these Ass-hats neglect to write a SINGLE WORD?  Eh?

[Cereza 106]

That kind of contradicts everything about temporary transfers. Maybe the law is worded incorrectly or correctly but according to this part of the law,how would it not be an illegal transfer. 

 

 

Ill-conceived, poorly worded NJ law? I'm stunned, stunned I tell you… 

[InFamous 311]

EXACTLY!  Otherwise there would be laws on the books stating we had to park our sedans in our living rooms and use securely tied packages OR place yer Rod in yer car trunk .

 

^^^^Obviously it's sarcasm folks, but it makes you THINK!  There aren't ANY mandatory storage laws for firearms on the books 'cept for kids access laws......  So if I leave my loaded OR unloaded hand gun laying on a night table & my wife spills coffee on it & wants to clean the mess before I get home, is she a felon for picking-up and clearing the piece and cleaning the spilled coffee and reassembling everything (including my hand gun) to make it look like nuthin' happened?

 

NJ Politicians are a bunch of out-of-work, out-of-touch Lawyers w/o a lick of common sense.  They would use a ream of paper to tell you how to wipe yer ass (or drive your gun to the range or other EXEMPT location, lol) and at what angle the wipe must take place, lol!  So ask yourselves a question:  Why when it comes to storage and access in dwellings (where multiple humans reside) did these Ass-hats neglect to write a SINGLE WORD?  Eh?

 

Cause my wife should be allowed to touch my gun or even shoot an intruder with my own weapon? What's hers is mine after all...in EVERY State, not just those...ya know Free ones...

[fishnut 2,358]

Let her choose the gun, you probably have no idea what she likes. I figured my wife would like my Walther pp .22 because its small so it fits her hand and its a .22, well........I was wrong. Her handgun of choice is my 1911, I was way off lol. Also my wife has access to an AR, mossberg 500 and a J frame 357. All are in my name and I don't really care if it's an illegal transfer or not if someone breaks in my home she is going to grab a gun and defend her life and our child's life. illegal transfer or not she will be alive.

[Lambo2936 297]

I saw the topic title and knew it was Lambo lol.

 

Let her pick her own pistol - it's a very personal choice as is, and double for a woman.

 

For example my wife likes the extra few oz of my PPQ for recoil as opposed to my Glock 26. Sometimes they prefer more standard sized pistols as opposed to the pocket pistols we think they would like

Yeahhh yeaahhhh...

I would let her pick one but my LGS and most others wont let her touch them as she has no FID. Such BS....

So what i might like she probably wont. I think Branchburh Heritage was ok with it, but Rahway gave me the nastiest look when i even dared ask, as though shed try and kill them right then and there. Otherwise i wouldnt even ask.. i may have to go to Easton or Branchburg for her to hold something.

[45Doll 5,877]

That kind of contradicts everything about temporary transfers. Maybe the law is worded incorrectly or correctly but according to this part of the law,how would it not be an illegal transfer.

It's really pretty simple. The statute you and others cite is talking about the possession and handling of firearms in New Jersey overall. Or to be more precise, anywhere that is not your dwelling.

 

The statute I cited covers a tiny subset of all New Jersey space, namely your home. And within that space you as a non-prohibited person are free to handle any legally acquired, non-prohibited firearm. The concept of transfer does not apply to residents of a dwelling.

 

I pointed this out to Nappen at one of his seminars.

[n4p226r 105]

so you are in agreement with those that say your wife cannot take your handgun to the range without you being there with her?

[45Doll 5,877]

so you are in agreement with those that say your wife cannot take your handgun to the range without you being there with her?

Yes. That is true. And that is a practice we have followed. Outside your home the concepts of transfer apply.

 

When your friend visits your house and you hand over your new pistol to examine, that's a transfer too. He or she is not a resident.

[n4p226r 105]

thanks.  ill make sure to update my mental library of insanely stupid NJ laws to spread correct info. 

[45Doll 5,877]

It's easy to get caught in the paranoia. That's what got me started reading the actual statute text.

[DeerSlayer 241]

Its not a HD gun; i have my glock 19 with a surefire weapon light on it for that. This is exclusively for shooting paper when we go to the range. Id probably keep a loaded mag in it in the safe in case, but that is far from its real purpose. Id consider a .22, but she knows how to shoot firearms. Maybe not as well as me, but she shot when she was younger as a lot of her family has guns.. im the 1st generation (and only one) to be armed in my family, other than a few up in Israel.

I had a lengthy discussion about it with my father on the way to the airport. Im fairly sure he now understands why ive been stocking up.

He believes that with enough terrorist attacks here in NJ theyll loosen the laws like Israel did to encourage people to open carry to deter rogue attacks.. what he didnt understand was the mentality here is to blame the weapon, not the terrorist..

 

Anywho, im going to visit heritage with her sometime this week to look around. She shot my 45 so 9 or 380 would be fine. A 22 would be cool since i have tons of 22 anyways, but i dont know if shed be into them as most are fairly fugly.

 

I just want suggestions so i know what to look at at heritage rather than any gun they have thats colorful, which is what she tends to do while im doing my own shopping..

The Walther P22 is a great choice for a woman's hand. Mrs. DeerSlayer digs on my Sig .22/1911. That's the only gun I own she likes to shoot. And I've got a lot of choices, she's shot about 15 of my other handguns, and always goes back to the .22/1911.

[DeerSlayer 241]

Yeahhh yeaahhhh...

I would let her pick one but my LGS and most others wont let her touch them as she has no FID. Such BS....

So what i might like she probably wont. I think Branchburh Heritage was ok with it, but Rahway gave me the nastiest look when i even dared ask, as though shed try and kill them right then and there. Otherwise i wouldnt even ask.. i may have to go to Easton or Branchburg for her to hold something.

Go to RTSP one afternoon, and rent. They have over 100 guns she can fondle, and shoot before buying something she's not happy with.

[Cereza 106]

It's really pretty simple. The statute you and others cite is talking about the possession and handling of firearms in New Jersey overall. Or to be more precise, anywhere that is not your dwelling.

 

The statute I cited covers a tiny subset of all New Jersey space, namely your home. And within that space you as a non-prohibited person are free to handle any legally acquired, non-prohibited firearm. The concept of transfer does not apply to residents of a dwelling.

 

I pointed this out to Nappen at one of his seminars.

 

Yes, but what did he say when you pointed this out? The current edition of New Jersey Gun Law (thank you T. Bill for the page number) states explicitly that there is no exemption for spouses, only minors.

 

Applying common sense, the situation is similar to a husband or wife driving a car (requires a license, potentially dangerous) registered in the other's name, but this is NJ…

 

 

 

Yeahhh yeaahhhh...

I would let her pick one but my LGS and most others wont let her touch them as she has no FID. Such BS....

So what i might like she probably wont. I think Branchburh Heritage was ok with it, but Rahway gave me the nastiest look when i even dared ask, as though shed try and kill them right then and there. Otherwise i wouldnt even ask.. i may have to go to Easton or Branchburg for her to hold something.

 

Why not take her to a local range and rent? She doesn't need an FID for that and she'll be able to shoot what she's interested in, which is better than just holding it in a store.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Yes, but what did he say when you pointed this out? The current edition of New Jersey Gun Law (thank you T. Bill for the page number) states explicitly that there is no exemption for spouses, only minors.

 

Honestly - that book is a lawyer's interpretation on the most successful way to keep yourself from getting arrested.  Nappen suggests not transporting loaded mags.  If you get jammed up for a loaded mag that's kept separate from the gun and someone says it's a firearm, it's going to get tossed out in court.

 

Do what you have to to defend yourself - worry about the aftermath later.

[10X 3,296]

Help her get a cute FID and a cute P2P in her own name, then take her to a store, preferably with a rental range, where she can pick out a cute gun to purchase using her cute permit.

 

This avoids all of the potential legal problems cited previously in this thread.

[n4p226r 105]

Honestly - that book is a lawyer's interpretation on the most successful way to keep yourself from getting arrested.  Nappen suggests not transporting loaded mags.  If you get jammed up for a loaded mag that's kept separate from the gun and someone says it's a firearm, it's going to get tossed out in court.

 

Do what you have to to defend yourself - worry about the aftermath later.

 

 

 

isn't that what you want though?   I'm sure you could ignore any of the things he says you "should" do in his book and he will gladly accept your $ and do his best to try to get you out of trouble, but had you listened to him to start, you wouldn't be in trouble to begin with.