Not a good day at Garden State in Lakewood.

[myhatinthering 462]

Don't blame the press on this one. Completely ridiculous that this happened by an employee at a range.

 

I posted in a dupe thread:

I believe this type of carelessness cost a life at the range in PA of an employee. How is it that people don't know that guns are all loaded or should at least be handled as if they are. Checking before storage and checking when retrieving is basic safety.

no i agree, i just look at the reporting as sensationalism. 

[silverado427 10,676]

Was the firearm discharged in the showroom.

[Shane45 807]

Some thoughts for consideration. My buddy has been to many track days and has completed a number of riding schools. By all accounts a very accomplished rider. So when it reached me that he had been killed on his bike, I thought for sure someone took him out. I persisted in asking how it happened and finally found out that indeed he made a mistake. It cost him his life. But the fact of the matter is that we are engaged in activities that come with inherent risk. We all strive for safety perfection. But keep in mind that is a goal. There will always be the human element. If you ride, sky dive, shoot etc etc you accept an elevated risk. Otherwise stick to knitting. From the gunshop all the way up to the USSS, there have been and will continue to be accidents. We all do our best to prevent them. It is my opinion that GSSC tries very, very hard to prevent accidents. But handle tens of thousands of customers and guns a year, there will be a risk. I am 100% confident they will analyze the incident and make changes where appropriate.

[AverageJoe 95]

There were multiple points of failure here, but in the end if we follow the "3 ALWAYS" this type of incident won't happen. 

[Shane45 807]

[paulnj088 9]

hiccup  

[High Exposure 5,661]

[Newtonian 453]

So you want to take away many gun range's primary source of income?

This again? Last time around you guys had GFH pushing more Korean immigrants through their doors than all the kimchee restaurants in Fort Lee.

 

Rentals should be legal because we have a right to shoot. Who gets to rent should be decided by the renter and the range. NDs are 100% the responsibility of the person holding the gun.

 

That being said fatal NDs are dark clouds over our hobby. 

[Avalanche 42]

I expected as much, I respect the vehiment opposition to the idea, but just airing an opinion. 

[remixer 1,645]

Without knowing all the details i would put blame on the person who checked in the gun after its rental and the person who checked out the gun for the new rental.

 

You had 2 chances to stop this from happening.

[Slab Sides 20]

Definitely not removing blame for basic gun safety, but...

 

I'm a member there and can tell you the counter where you sign in/out and walk by to get in/out of the range is the same counter they rent pistols from.  It gets pretty hectic in that area when it's busy.  IMO, they should move the rental counter so the employee can focus on the rental.

[Jpknj 6]

"It gets pretty hectic in that area when it's busy.  IMO, they should move the rental counter so the employee can focus on the rental."

 

​I agree the last two weeks is so over crowded. Move the rental counter would be a great start. 

[Zeke 5,504]

2 types of pilots

Old pilots

Bold pilots

 

There are no old bold pilots.

[Screwball 483]

Definitely not removing blame for basic gun safety, but...

 

I'm a member there and can tell you the counter where you sign in/out and walk by to get in/out of the range is the same counter they rent pistols from. It gets pretty hectic in that area when it's busy. IMO, they should move the rental counter so the employee can focus on the rental.

Maybe they should have done that instead of taking D/Ls for range use... and not talking about renting only. That actually turned me off, especially considering they make a copy of your D/L when you fill out the waver. Turned me off even more when I questioned it (they used to not do that), guy behind the counter got snippy with me.

 

While they are leaps and bounds past Brick Armory... I hope they do the right thing when they find out who is at fault. Don't know who the injured employee was, but there should be some other repercussion than a hurt hand. It should be instinct to pick up a gun and check it. Lucky it was only an isolated injury... but could have been a lot worse.

[YankeeSC 1,204]

I've taught my family from day 1 that the very first thing you do whenever taking possession of a firearm is you never assume a firearm is unloaded, and you check. No exceptions.  I don't see how this incident has anything to do with rentals, how busy the range was, or anyone other than the employee that shot himself.

[Screwball 483]

I don't see how this incident has anything to do with rentals, how busy the range was, or anyone other than the employee that shot himself.

Someone put the gun away with a live round in the chamber... while the injured guy was at fault for not checking, shouldn't have been a round in there.

 

What happens if someone pulled that gun out and handed to a new shooter... not familiar with gun safety? Should have been checked, but people get comfortable very easily.

[rscalzo 3]

The issue of rentals was the reason that smith and wession closed their public range on the manufacturing property.

 

 

SPRINGFIELD, MA (WSHM) -

The shooting range at Smith & Wesson is closed as the company looks into the complexities of running a public shooting range. This comes after law enforcement officials said four convicted felons wanted for violent crimes did their own training at the range.

 

Renting firearms has it's own set of issues. How do you hold someone responsible for the basic safety areas when they have zero experience?  As in the case with S&W, what does the range owners do if it's found they transferred a gun to a felon ? They have a significant investment in that facility and having an employee screw up can doom them.

 

For years, Sig academy has make it mandatory that ANYONE taking a course on their property have a current state criminal background check on file, be law enforcement or a current carry permit. Many private clubs are going the same route.

[AverageJoe 95]

This was not a gun rental issue, this was gun handling fundamentals 101 issue. 

[Zeke 5,504]

This was not a gun rental issue, this was gun handling fundamentals 101 issue.

It's between you and HE for the trophy on this.

 

I still like his " I should be able to put 1000 loaded guns on the rental table and not have an nd"

[Newtonian 453]

Not a very good testimonial for this place. Gross employee carelessness, hectic atmosphere where guns are turned in. At least two points where the place fucked up. Glad I gave up on indoor ranges. 

[fatty 241]

This again? Last time around you guys had GFH pushing more Korean immigrants through their doors than all the kimchee restaurants in Fort Lee.

 

Rentals should be legal because we have a right to shoot. Who gets to rent should be decided by the renter and the range. NDs are 100% the responsibility of the person holding the gun.

 

That being said fatal NDs are dark clouds over our hobby. 

 

What's with you and your Korean references?  You have something against Korean people?

[AverageJoe 95]

What's with you and your Korean references?  You have something against Korean people?

He hates apples, pineapples, and pens.  

[Krdshrk 3,877]

He hates apples, pineapples, and pens.  

 

That guy's Japanese

[AverageJoe 95]

That guy's Japanese

Same difference lmao

[Newtonian 453]

What's with you and your Korean references?  You have something against Korean people?

Yes since Pearl Harbor and 9/11. Bastards. I hate Kalmyks even more.

[matty 810]

Its like that location is cursed or something......

[fishnut 2,358]

Without knowing all the details i would put blame on the person who checked in the gun after its rental and the person who checked out the gun for the new rental.

 

You had 2 chances to stop this from happening.

while I agree both people violated most of the basic rules to gun safety the guy who just ruined his hand for life is responsible for the gun going off. I put a loaded handgun away every morning when I go to work and take it out when I get home. Every time I leave my house I lock up my loaded handgun and take it out again when I get home. I've never had a ND and I won't ever have one because I follow the 4 rules.

[Shane45 807]

Everyone says they will never have one..... until they do!

[fishnut 2,358]

Everyone says they will never have one..... until they do!

very true but there has been plenty of gun owners who lived and died without ever having a ND. Some get complacent and some dont.

[Schrödinger's cat 87]

Yes since Pearl Harbor and 9/11. Bastards. I hate Kalmyks even more.

9/11 and Korea ? For that matter Pearl Harbor and Korea ?