Braced Other, what will happen?

[leo-польд 18]

I am at big question on buying other firearm at this point, thousands already been sold in NJ made by Troy, LWRC etc. What will happen if ATF will ban braces? 

[Screwball 483]

They aren’t per say banning braces... they are considering their status as shouldering devices is certain situations. That is being based on a lot of BS characteristics... which they really didn’t say what exactly means what.

If it comes down to it, I believe they will turn into SBRs. Stock/shouldering device makes it as such... unless they allow OAL to be a qualifier for the brace (having two hands might also be another thing, again ambiguity). So, can’t really answer your question with what we know now.

I’m actually more interested it if TAC-14s and Shockwaves will be included... and then if they will become SBS or AOW. Other firearms like Troy’s should fit in a similar situation... just swap SBR with SBS.

Living outside of NJ, I’m also not too keen on SBRing all my braced pistols, since now they are on a registry. Yes, could be saving $1,200 in stamps, and would be able to actually put stocks on them... but sort of a back door registration program. Just keeps reminding me of Gun Control in the Third Reich (by Stephen Halbrook). Now, I really need to research on whether NFA items can be easily confiscated (legally, not physically)... or if there is any mention of it in the NFA. That will be my deciding factor.

[leo-польд 18]

9 hours ago, Screwball said:

They aren’t per say banning braces... they are considering their status as shouldering devices is certain situations. That is being based on a lot of BS characteristics... which they really didn’t say what exactly means what.

If it comes down to it, I believe they will turn into SBRs. Stock/shouldering device makes it as such... unless they allow OAL to be a qualifier for the brace (having two hands might also be another thing, again ambiguity). So, can’t really answer your question with what we know now.

I’m actually more interested it if TAC-14s and Shockwaves will be included... and then if they will become SBS or AOW. Other firearms like Troy’s should fit in a similar situation... just swap SBR with SBS.

Living outside of NJ, I’m also not too keen on SBRing all my braced pistols, since now they are on a registry. Yes, could be saving $1,200 in stamps, and would be able to actually put stocks on them... but sort of a back door registration program. Just keeps reminding me of Gun Control in the Third Reich (by Stephen Halbrook). Now, I really need to research on whether NFA items can be easily confiscated (legally, not physically)... or if there is any mention of it in the NFA. That will be my deciding factor.

Not clear, we got many thousands of Other firearms sold in NJ, what should we do with it? SBR is not allowed in NJ I believe.

[JackDaWack 2,580]

10 hours ago, leo-польд said:

. What will happen if ATF will ban braces? 

Then they will be banned.... take the brace off and its still a legal "other"... even the ATF as of now considers them to be removable accessories. 

[leo-польд 18]

10 minutes ago, JackDaWack said:

Then they will be banned.... take the brace off and its still a legal "other"... even the ATF as of now considers them to be removable accessories. 

and do what with it?

[JackDaWack 2,580]

Just now, leo-польд said:

and do what with it?

Put it with your 15 round magazines.

[leo-польд 18]

1 minute ago, JackDaWack said:

Put it with your 15 round magazines.

It would be funny if not thousands of others already sold, some people got 2-3 of them already etc

[JackDaWack 2,580]

Just now, leo-польд said:

It would be funny if not thousands of others already sold, some people got 2-3 of them already etc

Use it on a rifle if its considered a stock. This has always been a matter of question since they sold the first "brace", and the risk then is no different now. 

[Krdshrk 3,249]

I think they're specifically targeting "pistols" that have braces just to skirt the SBR laws by being a "pistol".  For example a Springfield Saint "pistol" or a DDM4 PDW "pistol"

 

An "other" AR is designed to be fired with 2 hands.   Only time will tell but the sheer numbers of "Others" out there (especially in CT where that's the only way to get a non-fixed mag AR) and states that don't allow for SBRs would be a huge infringement.  

[always_an_eagle 145]

Its all too ambiguous. Non NFA OTHERS such as the troy may be affected. 

[njJoniGuy 1,917]

ATF agents (and especially the higher-ups) should all join Marshall Applewhite's Heaven's Gate cult.

The USA would be a better place.

[leo-польд 18]

I mean time looks like NJ dealers and stores stop offering them already, don't know either because of covid no guns is available story or because of this new ATF thing on braces. They are gone and that is not funny!

[0Jeep4 87]

13 hours ago, leo-польд said:

It would be funny if not thousands of others already sold, some people got 2-3 of them already etc

This is why it was smart to build your “others” and not buy a traceable one. 

[ChrisJM981 906]

1 hour ago, 0Jeep4 said:

This is why it was smart to build your “others” and not buy a traceable one. 

Luckily they're modular. "I took it apart and sold the non-compliant parts out of state." So screw you,  Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco Firearms Explosives Confusion Entrapment and Subjugation (BATFECES) 

Edited December 18, 2020 by ChrisJM981
Edited for acronym clarification.

[0Jeep4 87]

51 minutes ago, ChrisJM981 said:

Luckily they're modular. "I took it apart and sold the non-compliant parts out of state." So screw you,  Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco Firearms Explosives Confusion Entrapment and Subjugation (BATFECES) 

I’m sure we all know we make this sound way worse, lol. There isn’t a task force set up to come and find this stuff. YET!

[ChrisJM981 906]

9 minutes ago, 0Jeep4 said:

I’m sure we all know we make this sound way worse, lol. There isn’t a task force set up to come and find this stuff. YET!

I wouldn't put it past our Glorious Supreme Kommander, Komrade Phildo and his two puppets Generalnyi prokuror Grewal & Obergruppenfuhrer Callahan.

What I wrote was an example if what would be communicated to the Dept. of Confiscation..err.. ATF.. should they contact me regarding the other I posted a picture of on this forum. YMMV. 

 

[JackDaWack 2,580]

2 hours ago, 0Jeep4 said:

I’m sure we all know we make this sound way worse, lol. There isn’t a task force set up to come and find this stuff. YET!

Tell that to Wako... and that was how many years ago? 

Those alphabets can assemble a task force over night if they want by simply dropping what ever other useless things they were doing. 

[Porthole 12]

I thought this video was informative.

 

Same guy another video on the ATF and 80% lowers.

 

[leo-польд 18]

10 hours ago, Porthole said:

I thought this video was informative.

 

Same guy another video on the ATF and 80% lowers.

 

Does he say anything about Other firearms?

[vladtepes 1,060]

I do not think that "other" is out of the cross hairs.. their opinion is that SBRs are being made by people using braces.. 

an AR pistol.. and "other" is by all practical purposes a SBR... we all know it.. yes I agree that all gun laws are infringement.. I agree that its ridiculous.. but it is what it is.. 

upfront.. the ATF wants registration of guns with braces.. that in itself is not banning.. 
NJ COULD in theory retain their position on other firearms.. while the federal level cracks down.. that is absolutely a possibility.. 

you will choose to do what you want and I will certainly not tell you what to do.. but I have one registered SBR.. and 2 brace equipped guns.. if this nonsense goes through I am more than likely going to register them... I am interested to see if they receive the same classification as a SBR.. if they do then great.. I had anticipated registering them in that way anyway at some point.. and at this time the tax is being waived... 

that is just what I have seen so far.. 

[n4p226r 105]

18 hours ago, vladtepes said:

 if this nonsense goes through I am more than likely going to register them... I am interested to see if they receive the same classification as a SBR.. if they do then great.. I had anticipated registering them in that way anyway at some point.. and at this time the tax is being waived... 

that is just what I have seen so far.. 

this is the worst part.  and I don't blame you.   but if people get a free tax stamp for something it'll do two things

1. make the people happy, they really wanted the stamp but didn't want to pay the $200

2. make it seem like people are complying and then they can force the next thing down our throats

[PK90 3,448]

I also look at it this way, in 1990, NJ allowed it's peasants to register their "assault weapons". Had you'd done this, you could have an AK47, AR15, M1 Carbine, etc, with none of the restrictions. You also could have unrestricted magazines for them.

ETA: As of yet,  no LEA has aggressively gone after them.

[always_an_eagle 145]

1 hour ago, PK90 said:

I also look at it this way, in 1990, NJ allowed it's peasants to register their "assault weapons". Had you'd done this, you could have an AK47, AR15, M1 Carbine, etc, with none of the restrictions. You also could have unrestricted magazines for them.

ETA: As of yet,  no LEA has aggressively gone after them.

But how many people registered them? Not many people want to register their guns and get special permission to travel to move.

[Sparda81 0]

This is all for symbolic political victories. It is impractical for anyone to "go after" this stuff. You scare some people into submission, make a show of it, and tick a box that a promise to voters has been fulfilled. I'm not saying we shouldn't keep an eye on this and take unnecessary risks, but I don't believe there is going to be mass-mobilization to drive the point home. 

[vladtepes 1,060]

5 hours ago, Sparda81 said:

This is all for symbolic political victories. It is impractical for anyone to "go after" this stuff. You scare some people into submission, make a show of it, and tick a box that a promise to voters has been fulfilled. I'm not saying we shouldn't keep an eye on this and take unnecessary risks, but I don't believe there is going to be mass-mobilization to drive the point home. 

again just to be clear.. for me everything is risk reward... 

I had considered getting a stamp for both of these guns anyway.. 
YES the optics of it are "the gov bullied me the gun owner into registration" and to be really blunt.. I dont care.. registration is not my personal breaking point.. its not my line in the sand.. if it was I would have never registered an actual SBR with the atf... 

so while I appreciate the fight some people want to have (not you.. just in a general sense)... the whole "will not comply" crowd... my argument to them is they are already complying.. or they would be drilling third pin holes in ARs.. 

the government being annoying.. the government requiring registration.. honestly.. I just dont care.. the government taking guns away.. banning.. thats what I have a problem with.. for me there is a very thin line between being a law abiding citizen.. and preserving 2A rights.. 

 

[tony357 386]

9 hours ago, PK90 said:

I also look at it this way, in 1990, NJ allowed it's peasants to register their "assault weapons". Had you'd done this, you could have an AK47, AR15, M1 Carbine, etc, with none of the restrictions. You also could have unrestricted magazines for them.

ETA: As of yet,  no LEA has aggressively gone after them.

The Sargent Major registered my M-1 Garand with state police when i purchased it through DCM,  44th Infantry Fort Dix. I was not Happy.  @ 165.00 delivered to my door i did not argue with him. 

[leo-польд 18]

This thread is about - what do we do with existing Others on hands. Stores and dealers already stop selling them as I know. We need someone to clarify this for us, it is crazy!

[Screwball 483]

1 hour ago, leo-польд said:

This thread is about - what do we do with existing Others on hands. Stores and dealers already stop selling them as I know. We need someone to clarify this for us, it is crazy!

As it sits right now, it is business as usual. The proposal clearly states that it does not hold the weight of law.

ATF has that proposal up for review/comments. Will be open until 01/04/2021. After that, will depend on how much interest is shown.

As of now, 21,444 comments on braces.

Example... which I’m getting from Mrgunsngear’s video that was released tonight. When 7N6 was on the chopping block, a similar proposal had less than 5,000 comments.

Similar time period, another one came up for M855 to be banned. That one had 80,000 comments. If ammo was in stock right now... which of the two could you buy today?

I feel if the comments get over 100,000... we have a shot of the ATF blinking on this. They could say the hell with it and do it... but if a minimum of 100,000 people commented... that is 100,000 people likely to flip them the bird on it.

[Bully 749]

5 hours ago, leo-польд said:

This thread is about - what do we do with existing Others on hands. Stores and dealers already stop selling them as I know. We need someone to clarify this for us, it is crazy!

Start looking for a stock, barrel and handguard.  

Switch out everything that makes it "questionable" and throw it all in the back of the safe.  

[Krdshrk 3,249]

Leave your comments here:

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2020/12/18/2020-27857/objective-factors-for-classifying-weapons-with-stabilizing-braces

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https://beta.regulations.gov/document/ATF-2020-0001-0001/comment