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PolishPete

First rifle - what to look for.

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I’ve started looking into buying a rifle and would appreciate others’ opinions on what to look for when picking one. I am currently using the following criteria:

- primary use is home defense

- secondary use is range training (I’m in Sussex county, considering rtsponline.com as training facility)

- ease of acquiring and cost of ammunition

 

The first thing that popped up for me was AR 15 (and variants), since I’d imagine that is a very common rifle. Are there additional details I should be considering when picking a rifle? All comments and suggestions will be much appreciated.

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Absolutely an AR15.  Don't buy junk. There is tons of information on buying your first AR if you search for it.  If you are handy, build your own AR15 with quality parts, you will know and understand your rifle better if you built it!  Good luck. :)

"ease of acquiring and cost of ammunition" You're a little late for that one!:lol:

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ARs are great, no doubt. Now go back in time and buy 5k rounds. :)

The only thing I would say is that at least with a .22LR you can get more trigger time in.  Yes, ammo is insanely priced right now, but at least you get more trigger pulls for your dollar.    As for home defense, any firearm is better than no firearm. 

I know I don't want to take a .22LR round.  Not to mention, you get yourself a Ruger 10/22 you can accessorize it to your hearts content.

 

 

 

 

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47 minutes ago, PolishPete said:

The first thing that popped up for me was AR 15 (and variants), since I’d imagine that is a very common rifle. Are there additional details I should be considering when picking a rifle?

You'll hear "AR15" from lots of folks, just because.... But, I wouldn't rule out pistol caliber carbines, maybe in 9mm or .40. One nice thing with them, you can share ammo with any handguns you might have. Plus, many can be modified or have fun stuff added to them, like a AR9.

2 minutes ago, Malsua said:

I know I don't want to take a .22LR round.  Not to mention, you get yourself a Ruger 10/22 you can accessorize it to your hearts content.

This too.

A 10/22 can be also turned into a AR22 style. Not sure if I'd make that my first choice for H.D., but they're a hell of a lot of fun to shoot. And yes, cheaper to "feed". too.

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Obviously AR-15 if the main purpose is home defense. .223/5.56 will be easier to get than most calibers, though it's a bad time to just get into shooting as there are shortages with the high demand. Easy to fire, recoil isn't much.

1 hour ago, Sniper said:

But, I wouldn't rule out pistol caliber carbines, maybe in 9mm or .40. One nice thing with them, you can share ammo with any handguns you might have.

This is a good, different way of going about it if you don't want to go the standard .223/5.56 route. 9mm, .40, 5.56, .22lr, don't want to get shot by any of them. And unless an invader has body armor, which doesn't seem likely for the average break in, they'll all do the job.

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Agree with most above:  start with an AR platform if your use is HD and training.

 While you said this will be your first rifle, you didn’t say I’d you had other firearms/experience. Is having common calibers important to you?  If not then go with a 5.56/223 AR. Otherwise go with a 9mm or whatever caliber you already have as Sniper suggested. 

Since this will be your first rifle I’d go with something like the M&P Sport.  It’s a decent starter rifle and you can upgrade parts as you learn what you like.  There are other similar options too. Shop around.  PSA has sales on complete entry-level rifles sometimes. 

Availability of the rifle and ammo is going to be a problem.  But a rifle in hand is better than one in the cart waiting to go on sale. 

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6 hours ago, voyager9 said:

 While you said this will be your first rifle, you didn’t say I’d you had other firearms/experience. Is having common calibers important to you?  If not then go with a 5.56/223 AR. Otherwise go with a 9mm or whatever caliber you already have as Sniper suggested. 

Since this will be your first rifle I’d go with something like the M&P Sport.  It’s a decent starter rifle and you can upgrade parts as you learn what you like. 

I do have a 9mm handgun, but common-caliber is not a hard requirement. Many thanks for your input.

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10 hours ago, PolishPete said:

Many thanks for all the input. Currently checking out this M4 classic kit as a starter. 

PSA doesn't seem to ship complete AR receivers to N.J. (or complete AR/AR rifles) that kit includes a complete upper receiver. https://palmettostatearmory.com/help-center/terms-and-conditions.html#warranty-policy

Other vendors will not ship any AR parts to N.J. 

IMO for starters I'd get a complete M4 16" AR rifle.

S&W M&P sports don't have a chrome lined barrel. Their carry handle models do and are closer to Mil-spec. https://www.gunbroker.com/item/889598666

Or just bite the bullet and go with a new Colt CR6920 since everything is crazy expensive now and it has decent resale value. https://www.gunbroker.com/item/889572171

Oh, and don't forget standard AR's will need to be made N.J. compliant before your FFL can transfer it to you. http://www.monmoutharms.com/gun-smith-services/ 

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I'm actually going to counter some of what's above . . . I would actually recommend NOT going with a 9mm and instead adding a .223/5.56 AR platform instead.  Make sure that the barrel you will run both.

The advantage?  9mm is and will likely remain difficult to get.  You can, with an easily installed kit, run .22LR through the AR which lets you blast away all that you want with the cheapest of rounds. 

This gives you the options of .22, .223, 5.56 and 9mm ammo for home defense.  You should almost always be able to buy at least one of those at any time.

So . . . I would say a 16" AR in 5.56 or .223 Wylde and a bolt and magazine for .22LR.

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1 hour ago, Bomber said:

PSA doesn't ship complete AR receivers to N.J. (or complete AR/AR rifles) that kit appears to include a complete receiver. https://palmettostatearmory.com/help-center/terms-and-conditions.html#warranty-policy

That kit is missing the lower. He would need to pick up a stripped lower from his LGS in NJ.

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7 hours ago, JohnnyB said:

That kit is missing the lower. He would need to pick up a stripped lower from his LGS in NJ.

Yeah, but the way PSA's policy seems to read they don't ship complete receivers (upper or lower) to N.J. 

Anyway, by time he pieced together a complete rifle the price will approaching a factory built item, plus the labor, no warranty and limited resale value. 

 

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11 minutes ago, Bomber said:

Anyway, by time he pieced together a complete rifle the price will approaching a factory built item, plus the labor, no warranty and not the best resale value. 

I thought that was the whole point. You build your own AR with fun parts, just because...

....then post it on the "Show Us Your AR" thread here, right?

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11 minutes ago, Bomber said:

Yeah, but the way PSA's policy seems read they don't shipped complete receivers (upper or lower) to N.J. 

Anyway, by time he pieced together a complete rifle the price will approaching a factory built item, plus the labor, no warranty and not the best resale value. 

 

FYI, I have purchased a couple complete uppers and trust me, they ship to NJ.  Lower receivers no.

I agree on buying a complete rifle but there is something to be said for the familiarity gained by assembling your rifle.

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24 minutes ago, JohnnyB said:

FYI, I have purchased a couple complete uppers and trust me, they ship to NJ.  Lower receivers no.

I agree on buying a complete rifle but there is something to be said for the familiarity gained by assembling your rifle.

Man, all of the comments are really helpful and insightful, thank you all!

Will chapter 13 have the pertinent details as to what modifications need to be made to the components in order for them to be NJ legal?

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no one should be doing business with a company that restricts like that, I mean the entire gun community should band together and shun companies that engage in this behavior.

That said, do NOT buy a AR in 9mm.  Talk about a waste of receiver space.  You are better off buying a sig 320 and getting a Roni or CAA kit and have far more utility

Buy an AR, learn to shoot, it's not a brutal platform to learn on.  If you prefer something lighter, take up knitting.  I mean that nicely. 

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Almost all guns and ALL common ammo calibers are hard to find right not.

AR15s are great but you aren't going to be able to find 223/5.56 ammo right not any easier than you can find 9mm ammo.

If you have a sufficient quantity of 9mm you may want to look at something like the Ruger PCR (Pistol Caliber Rifle) or any pistol caliber rile in 9mm from a reputable manufacturer.

If you want a semi auto but don't want something "tactial", look at the Ruger Mini 14s.  Also chambered in 223/5.56 (and other calibers) but doesn't look like an "evil, scary black rifle".  

Good luck.  It's slim pickings out there.

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6 hours ago, PolishPete said:

Will chapter 13 have the pertinent details as to what modifications need to be made to the components in order for them to be NJ legal?

To make a standard configuration M4 AR N.J. compliant it would need a pinned and welded muzzle brake in place of the A2 flash hider, bayonet lug removed, the collapsible stock pinned into a fixed position (or replaced with a fixed stock) and 10 rd. magazine.   

 

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28 minutes ago, Bomber said:

To make a standard configuration M4 AR N.J. compliant it would need a pinned and welded muzzle brake in place of the A2 flash hider, bayonet lug removed, the collapsible stock pinned into fixed position (or replaced with a fixed stock) and 10 rd. magazine.   

 

Thanks, found that here (Definitions 2(i), page 4), too. Thank you!

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2 hours ago, RUTGERS95 said:

That said, do NOT buy a AR in 9mm.  Talk about a waste of receiver space.

 

5 hours ago, EdF said:

I would actually recommend NOT going with a 9mm and instead adding a .223/5.56 AR platform instead. 

Why all the lack of love on the pistol caliber carbines? They offer a great shooting experience, and when you can share existing ammo with a handgun, it's a better bang for the buck.

What I see is the herd mentality, that it's a AR15 or nothing... Kinda like, if you don't buy a AR, you're a second class citizen.  Crazy stuff...  it's like a cult or something..

For a H.D. situation that the OP is looking for, a pistol caliber carbine in 9mm or .40 will get the job done just as well as a .223. Having both platforms available, my go to for first choice is my Beretta CX4 versus the AR15.

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42 minutes ago, Sniper said:

 

Why all the lack of love on the pistol caliber carbines? They offer a great shooting experience, and when you can share existing ammo with a handgun, it's a better bang for the buck.

What I see is the herd mentality, that it's a AR15 or nothing... Kinda like, if you don't buy a AR, you're a second class citizen.  Crazy stuff...  it's like a cult or something..

For a H.D. situation that the OP is looking for, a pistol caliber carbine in 9mm or .40 will get the job done just as well as a .223. Having both platforms available, my go to for first choice is my Beretta CX4 versus the AR15.

Because they suck

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58 minutes ago, RUTGERS95 said:

Because they suck

Wow, rough crowd...

45 minutes ago, Bomber said:

He is looking for his first battle rifle.

Do you remember the first battle rifle? I'm sure a PCC beats this, right?

Springfield_Model_1861_Rifled_Musket.jpg

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I'm going to create some further confusion for you.

An AR-15 is perfect for you on points one and two.  They are great for HD and fun to shoot at the range.  On point three, from what I understand, they are currently scarce and expensive, as is the ammo for them.  Many people like to build theirs from parts kits, and I guess it's great to customize one to your liking, but for me, it was a lot easier to grab one off the shelf (Stag Arms, model 2), and several years later, I have no regrets.

A Ruger 10/22 or an S&W 15-22 are not ideal for HD, but they are a lot better than nothing.  They are also fun to shoot, and I believe that those guns and .22 LR ammo are more readily available.

A third possibility is to get a shotgun.  They are great for HD, and they are still fairly easy to obtain.  Also, 12 gauge ammo is still plentiful. OTOH,  most people don't find them to be a lot of fun at the range.  (I am a notable exception, as I love to shoot mine every chance I get.)

Good luck to you with whatever you choose.  Please report back on how it's working out for you.

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5 hours ago, Old Glock guy said:

A third possibility is to get a shotgun.  They are great for HD, and they are still fairly easy to obtain.  Also, 12 gauge ammo is still plentiful. 

 

Last time I checked HD or tactical style shotgun prices were crazy as well, along with 12 ga 00 buckshot ammo. 

Even beat up Remington 870 police trade-ins were selling on Gunbroker for big bucks with multiple bidders.

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22 minutes ago, Old Glock guy said:

A third possibility is to get a shotgun.  They are great for HD, and they are still fairly easy to obtain. 

This use to be the first suggestion as a HD long gun... Basic and easy to use.

Somehow, it's now gravitated to getting a full blown, kited out AR15 as your first...

My, how times have changed...

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5 minutes ago, Sniper said:

This use to be the first suggestion as a HD long gun... Basic and easy to use.

Somehow, it's now gravitated to getting a full blown, kited out AR15 as your first...

My, how times have changed...

Nobody above is recommending a “kitted out” AR.  There were recommendations for entry level off the shelf ARs or kits depending on what OP wanted.  

As for why times have changed:  existence of those entry level firearms/kits and the development of really good HD rounds make them affordable and comparable. 

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20 hours ago, Sniper said:

 

Why all the lack of love on the pistol caliber carbines?

I don't have a problem with a pistol caliber carbine at all . . . That wasn't the point of my statement.  

My entire post was about the idea of looking at what's available.  Keeping weapons that use a variety of calibers will better allow him to purchase what's available when it's available.

I'm also a little tired of hearing that you can't get guns or ammo or that everything is wildly over priced.  In the last six months, I've added two 9mm handguns, a .22 handgun, a shotgun and an AR along with a lot of ammo.  When I go out and look, I find what I need.  The AR that I bought is built on a Palmetto Arms lower and I paid about $650 all NJ legal.  I can find any ammo that want online, tonight.  

Now . . . All of this may change with the new administration but we are talking about today.

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