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Supreme Court Takes First 2A Case in a Decade

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9 minutes ago, Displaced Texan said:

I don’t think Gov. Bucky intends to comply with the SCOTUS ruling. So I imagine it will be a long row to hoe before any CCW permits in NJ get approved. 
 

Sorry to be a Debbie downer in the short run, but I do believe it will happen. Eventually. 

Right and on other comments re obstruction…right.  They will create endless hoops and restrictions that will require another lawsuit.  Like… can’t carry with 15 miles of any public or private school.  

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3 hours ago, gunforhire said:

You know we will now reactivate the three cases! 2 carry and 1 15 round mag!

Those cases will be remanded by next week! shhhhhh

Biden, Murphy, Hochul, and Adams are deeply unhappy and concerned today. Too bad, all I ever wanted for me and my family is the same level of protection that we pay for them to have 24/7!

 

16 minutes ago, marlintag said:

Hi Anthony, good to see you on the forum again. Thanks for all that you have done and continue to do!

Group Effort!

21 minutes ago, marlintag said:

When on this very forum I stated repeatedly that one day NJ will get CCW, I was taunted and mocked with snide and negative comments. When I told active NJ law enforcement that one day I/we will get conceal carry, I received smirks, eye rolls, and laughs. Today, after the ruling those individuals laugh no longer! It's a new age folks! A new dawn! Let's put the "never gonna happen" and "your dreaming" nonsense behind us and get on with the business of getting our permits. I will be making a phone call this weekend to the local PD to inquire about dropping off a CCW application. We need three references, a training cert, and letter stating, "All legal purposes in accordance with state law", is there something else I am missing? 

Same here! 

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3 hours ago, JimB1 said:

Even better, keep reading. Thomas flat out says 2a laws must be judged using the 2a text and history and cannot use any other criteria to determine if it is constitutional. So if 2a doesn’t say magazines can only be 10 rounds and there is no historical context for the limits, those laws are gone too… amazing ruling!

That is mostly consistent with my reading of his opinion. He strongly implies (he may state this outright in some part of the opinion I have yet to read) that any firearm available today that is popular, and/or analogous to what was permitted at the time of the 2nd or 14th A must be currently permitted under 2A. That would clearly include an AR or AK type rifle with at least a 15 round mag (and also all of the "choose only one" features that Jersey now heavily regulates). I'm not so certain how well my BMG 50 sniper rifle meets those tests. It certainly isn't in "common use". I imagine analogy could be made to some weapons that were in use in the Revolutionary War and for a few decades after, but it might be a bit more of a stretch. Phil Van Cleave, who is the director of Virginia Citizens Defense League (and the architect of the Viginia Second Amendment County movement of a couple of years back) likes to point out that ordinary citizens were allowed to own cannon during the Revolutionary period (to rebut a claim made by gun-grabber TIm Kaine), but I don't really expect private ownership of mortars, howitzers, and AA guns to be deregulated legal anytime soon. Much as I'd like my 50 to remain unregulated, if losing that is part of the price for Bruen eliminating stupid carry restrictions nationally, I guess I could live with that.

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40 minutes ago, Kevin125 said:

Right and on other comments re obstruction…right.  They will create endless hoops and restrictions that will require another lawsuit.  Like… can’t carry with 15 miles of any public or private school.  

I’m still reading through the entire text of the ruling, but I’ve heard others who are further along than I comment that this was anticipated in the decision. And specifically called out that it was not constitutional.

When I find that text I’ll copy/paste. 
 

Not that Gov. Bucky intends to comply anyways…

 

Here is the text from Thomas:

Consider, for example, Heller’s discussion of “longstand- ing” “laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings.” 554 U. S., at 626. Although the historical record yields rela- tively few 18th- and 19th-century “sensitive places” where weapons were altogether prohibited—e.g., legislative as- semblies, polling places, and courthouses—we are also aware of no disputes regarding the lawfulness of such pro- hibitions. See D. Kopel & J. Greenlee, The “Sensitive Places” Doctrine, 13 Charleston L. Rev. 205, 229–236, 244– 247 (2018); see also Brief for Independent Institute as Ami- cus Curiae 11–17. We therefore can assume it settled that these locations were “sensitive places” where arms carrying could be prohibited consistent with the Second Amend- ment. And courts can use analogies to those historical reg- ulations of “sensitive places” to determine that modern reg- ulations prohibiting the carry of firearms in new and analogous sensitive places are constitutionally permissible.

Although we have no occasion to comprehensively define sensitive places” in this case, mve places,” and it is likewise true that law enforcement professionals are usually presumptively available in those locations. But expanding the category of “sensitive places” simply to all places of public congregation that are not isolated from law enforcement defines the cat- egory of “sensitive places” far too broadly. Respondents’ ar- gument would in effect exempt cities from the Second Amendment and would eviscerate the general right to pub- licly carry arms for self-defense that we discuss in detail below. See Part III–B, infra. Put simply, there is no his- torical basis for New York to effectively declare the island of Manhattan a “sensitive place” simply because it is crowded and protected generally by the New York City Po- lice Department.

 

Bold is my emphasis. 

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1 hour ago, DirtyDigz said:

Holy crap, the lawyers who argued for NYSRPA in Bruen are effectively pushed out of their firm:

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/06/23/lawyers-gun-rights-supreme-court-00041909

 

 

The isn't the first that I've seen evidence of a large law firm with an anti-2A bias. It's also becoming all too common an attitude among other corporations. Are any of the gun rights orgs tracking which business are anti-2A so that we can boycott them whenever possible? That is something that I very much think needs to be done. 

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1 hour ago, marlintag said:

I will be making a phone call this weekend to the local PD to inquire about dropping off a CCW application. We need three references, a training cert, and letter stating, "All legal purposes in accordance with state law", is there something else I am missing? 

The current standard is not for training, it is for a qualification with the actual handgun to be carried, just like LE.

However, most folks require a certain amount of training in order to qualify on an LE course of fire. 

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1 hour ago, KurtC said:

The current standard is not for training, it is for a qualification with the actual handgun to be carried, just like LE.

However, most folks require a certain amount of training in order to qualify on an LE course of fire. 

I have a holster draw qualification where an NRA certified instructor signed off, is that not sufficient?

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I joined this forum almost ten years ago. I always felt that we would get concealed carry here at some point. Once Trump got to pick SCOTUS judges I knew it was only a matter of time.

Petty tyrant Murphy is going to drag his feet and make it as annoying as he possibly can while staying within the bounds of the order we got today, but at the end of the day, NJ will effectively be shall issue.

I am now researching for a solid carry firearm.

I am assuming we won't be able to use hollow point based on NJ's moronic hollow point regulations. Gonna have some penetration implications.

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5 minutes ago, Albanian said:

I joined this forum almost ten years ago. I always felt that we would get concealed carry here at some point. Once Trump got to pick SCOTUS judges I knew it was only a matter of time.

Petty tyrant Murphy is going to drag his feet and make it as annoying as he possibly can while staying within the bounds of the order we got today, but at the end of the day, NJ will effectively be shall issue.

I am now researching for a solid carry firearm.

I am assuming we won't be able to use hollow point based on NJ's moronic hollow point regulations. Gonna have some penetration implications.

Hornady Critical Defense or similar. 

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4 hours ago, JackDaWack said:

If I recall Ant, you already have the staff needed to satisfy NJ state training requirements? We just need some dates for classes!!!! Let's gooooo!!! Can you sense my excitement?

"All of our high-level courses are taught by experienced professionals with the credentials to prove it. They are all trained and certified by the N.J. Police Training Commission, N.J. Department of Criminal Justice, and possess Federal Law Enforcement Instructor Certifications. They are experts in N.J. Use of Force Policies, and are always updating the course material with the latest use of force guidelines and case law."

 

 

Does the training taken when I got my non resident Florida CCW qualify for the training requirement?

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6 minutes ago, supranatural said:

Does the training taken when I got my non resident Florida CCW qualify for the training requirement?

Not that I'm aware. That's a pretty low bar considering NJs statute. Also, NJ requires the training or quals to be "current", so I would guess within 6 months or less.

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Stop your orgasms.  Just remember.   It aint over till the fat lady sings. Also remember. We should all be constitutional carry.   Its a win. But a far cry from the constitution as written if we still have to jump through hoops and fill out alot of paperwork to have our God given right for the pursuit of happiness 

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11 hours ago, 45Doll said:

Hochul rushed right to her podium and announced they're working on other steps, like requiring training for CCW.

That's how stupid she is, they already do require training.

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1 hour ago, marlintag said:

I have a holster draw qualification where an NRA certified instructor signed off, is that not sufficient?

It depends.  A normal qualification is around 50-60 rounds, distances of 1 foot to 25 yards.  Both tactical and magazine save reloads.  It also has to be recent, like within 6 months of the application.  You definitely need to have the serial number, make and model of the handgun on the paperwork.

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45 minutes ago, Golf battery said:

When they make these stringent rules.  How many of you will actually qualify.   And re qualify?   Dont kid yourselves thinking it will be that easy.  

Murphy isn't going to be Governor forever.

We may get a republican governor worth a damn someday, especially after eight years of hatchet face and 4 years of Biden. 

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2 hours ago, Golf battery said:

For nra pistol instructor class.  We have to shoot 18 of 20 rds in about an 8” circle.   At 20 yards. Practice on that

Appendix A on page 35 has a typical New Jersey qualification course of fire.

https://nj.gov/lps/dcj/pdfs/dcj-firearms.pdf

While the course of fire is described using a semi-auto, you can easily meet the same time requirements using a revolver.  I've done it many times.

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