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Cheflife15

Trigger recommendation

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Looking for a single stage trigger. Would like something with a light clean break.  I would like the pull weight between 3.5 to 4 lbs. 

I'm currently debating between these 2 but all recommendations are welcome.  

RISE Armament RA-535 Advanced-Performance Trigger 

Timney Triggers AR-15 Competition Trigger 

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27 minutes ago, silverado427 said:

The best bang for your buck is a La Rue MBT two stage. 

So I was looking at single stage triggers. I'm not quite sure I see the advantage in a 2 stage. Why would you pick that over a one stage? 

 

 

 

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I just shoot more accurate with a two stage. I just sold off my single stage triggers, they were 3 gun triggers.

Between the first and the second stage there is a wall, you pull through the first stage and you reach like a mini speed bump.( the wall)

At the wall you will get the same trigger pull every time, some explain the brake  as a glass rod snappish or a candy cane

you also have the option just pulling through the trigger           jmho opinion

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2 hours ago, silverado427 said:

The best bang for your buck is a La Rue MBT two stage. 

Negative. Best bang for the buck is the ALG ACT single stage. It’s a tuned and coated mil-spec trigger with a smooth and crisp single stage that you can usually find for about 1/2 the price of the MBT.

13 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

If you spent enough time and effort you can adapt to any trigger 

This.

Most people would be better served by spending their $$ on ammo and training. Shoot your carbine until the trigger is the limiting factor to how accurate you can be first. Then buy a new trigger.

I didn’t upgrade a trigger until I had been shooting for quite a few years and when I started, I was shooting ~ 6-8k rounds a year in classes and training. 

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17 minutes ago, High Exposure said:

Negative. Best bang for the buck is the ALG ACT single stage. It’s a tuned and coated mil-spec trigger with a smooth and crisp single stage that you can usually find for about 1/2 the price of the MBT.

Agreed.  Throw some JP Enhanced reliability springs on it too and it's even nicer.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1003366096

 

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3 hours ago, High Exposure said:

Negative. Best bang for the buck is the ALG ACT single stage. It’s a tuned and coated mil-spec trigger with a smooth and crisp single stage that you can usually find for about 1/2 the price of the MBT.

This.

Most people would be better served by spending their $$ on ammo and training. Shoot your carbine until the trigger is the limiting factor to how accurate you can be first. Then buy a new trigger.

I didn’t upgrade a trigger until I had been shooting for quite a few years and when I started, I was shooting ~ 6-8k rounds a year in classes and training. 

I'm not a Commando, special operator, SEAL, or any of that.

I've been in the position of, "Here's this M16.  Go into battle with this".  I survived.

If you're talking about gun games pursue whatever your conscience and wallet can survive.

Slightly OT but I have a Taurus 669, 4", 357 I bought in 1988.  The trigger is not a S&W but I have no reservations about using it in a fight.

SGT York didn't select his trigger for his rifle.  Audie Murphy didn't tune his M1 carbine or M2 50 caliber.

Too many get wrapped up in what can be considered software.

The hardware is between your ears.

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9 hours ago, High Exposure said:

Negative. Best bang for the buck is the ALG ACT single stage. It’s a tuned and coated mil-spec trigger with a smooth and crisp single stage that you can usually find for about 1/2 the price of the MBT.

Definitely agree on the ALG-ACT!  I replaced all my mil-spec triggers with them. Smooth as  silk!

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6 hours ago, GRIZ said:

I'm not a Commando, special operator, SEAL, or any of that.

I've been in the position of, "Here's this M16.  Go into battle with this".  I survived.

If you're talking about gun games pursue whatever your conscience and wallet can survive.

Slightly OT but I have a Taurus 669, 4", 357 I bought in 1988.  The trigger is not a S&W but I have no reservations about using it in a fight.

SGT York didn't select his trigger for his rifle.  Audie Murphy didn't tune his M1 carbine or M2 50 caliber.

Too many get wrapped up in what can be considered software.

The hardware is between your ears.

Most of us don't get to shoot enough to find out how much the trigger pull weight on their AR matters.  Using the Mantis Blackbeard on my AR - holy cow my trigger finger gets tired after pulling that trigger a few hundred times with the standard mil-spec trigger.  I originally thought the mil-spec trigger was fine but now I do wanna get better triggers for all of my ARs that have mil-spec's.

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If it’s good enough for uncle sam it’s good enough for you!!! Fuck that noise. Shit triggers are good for learning techniques to deal with shit triggers and that’s about it. With the milspec triggers you can get a nice broken in one that was pretty nice and is a pretty smooth 4.5lb. Or you can get something that feels like it’s made of gravel and is closer to 12. I’ve gone through the litter more than a few times and the odds of getting the good one is basically zero. My experience is you get something about 7-8lbs and fairly rough. 
 

Which sucks. 
 

So what to get. If you don’t have a big budget or don’t know what you like and want to have something around as you buy and sell the expensive ones until you find just right, there’s the alg coated trigger with the jp springs as mentioned in the thread. It’s basically a worked mil spec trigger without having to pay someone to do the work. This is what I have in my “take a noob to the range” ar. 
 

Personally I would not buy the jp trigger. At this point the level of diy to get it set up is just unnecessary with the drop in kits. As on tolerance stacking and the peak performance may not be there with both safety and reliability. And frankly pound for pound of pull, the drop in modules go lower without being as easy to ad. To get the lighter pulls you are dialing out seat engagement.  I’ve done a few of them and continue to not like them personally, but more importantly is the effort to set them up and that for the work I’ve gotten ~3.75lb-5lb when set up to pass my standard safety check. I haven’t met their drop in module. 

If you want good and not a drop in module buy geissele. After a bunch of use my sd3g pulls about 2.25lb. Their two stage isn’t bad either. Zero dicking around with adjustments, and I’ve run them in multiple lowers with very similar results.

If you want a 2stage, the hiperfire hipertouch is pretty much the best. You can go really light with really reliable ignition and a positive reset. You can catch some really good sales on these to make them pretty competitive price wise too.

If you want single stage, the top of the line elftman trigger is it. Get out your wallet. Pretty much everything they make is made well, but their budget triggers aren’t good relative value to the competition.

Then there’s the 1.5 stage/1911 style triggers. They usually have a very short, very light first stage. Then a light second stage. 

The ar gold trigger was the first of there and is good. I don’t like the very narrow trigger, and it’s a bit floppy feeling from a resting position. But it’s a good trigger and probably one of the better ones for precision shooting imo. 

Then there’s my personal favorite. Triggertech. Of any ar trigger, this one has the most positive wall of any trigger I’ve ever met. There’s short, very light take up, a positive wall, and a glass rod break. It also has a positive reset. I’ve got the adjustable that goes down to 2.5lb according to the label, but it’s really more like 2.75 in my gun. I love them, and if you are of the light is dangerous crowd, it adjusts up to 5lb. You will not find a nicer feeling 5lb trigger imo. 
 

That being said there is now the triggertech Diamond ar trigger. It goes down to 1.5lb, and i don’t think I’ve seen a drop in that will be lower. The timer calvin is also 1.5.  That being said i have not met one in person. However I’ve seen a lot of complaints of it being kind of mushy and having a weak reset. If you need the lightest for an ar you want to shoot like a precision bolt gun, the timney Calvin is in theory it. 

If you have a budget, the cheap rise armament drop in isn’t too bad, and occasionally I’ll see the larue 2 stage is pretty regularly available at $99 and is a solid implementation of an old school national match 2 stage design.  
 

We honestly have more really good ar triggers than we had options for stripped lowers when i started building ars in 2001. The choice for decent drop ins is just insane now. 

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On a recommendation from a board member here I purchased the LaRue MBT-2s tactical trigger for an M&P 15-22, very nice trigger, maybe not high end but, it was like night and day compared to the stock trigger it came with, for $107 shipped, I would purchase another if I was in need of a trigger.

Im just a plinker but the trigger made a world of difference.

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13 hours ago, Krdshrk said:

Most of us don't get to shoot enough to find out how much the trigger pull weight on their AR matters.  Using the Mantis Blackbeard on my AR - holy cow my trigger finger gets tired after pulling that trigger a few hundred times with the standard mil-spec trigger.  I originally thought the mil-spec trigger was fine but now I do wanna get better triggers for all of my ARs that have mil-spec's.

Maybe you need to build up your hand and  finger muscles.  Get a hand exerciser.  Do it both ways (vee up by your trigger finger, vee down by your pinky finger).  You can do this whilst your driving or on the train or bus commuting or watching TV.  Before long you will see results.  This will help your handgun shooting too.  Sport specific prep.

Several hundred rounds?  Is this a casual range session?  If so you're more concerned with sending lead downrange than developing your technique.

A friend of mine (a true precision shooter) and I meet up several times a year.  I worked with him.  We spend 5 or 6 hours at the range.  Intermixed with shooting (usually rifles), bs, and reminiscing.  We go through 200-300 rounds over 5-6 hours.

 

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30 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Maybe you need to build up your hand and  finger muscles.  Get a hand exerciser.  Do it both ways (vee up by your trigger finger, vee down by your pinky finger).  You can do this whilst your driving or on the train or bus commuting or watching TV.  Before long you will see results.  This will help your handgun shooting too.  Sport specific prep.

Several hundred rounds?  Is this a casual range session?  If so you're more concerned with sending lead downrange than developing your technique.

A friend of mine (a true precision shooter) and I meet up several times a year.  I worked with him.  We spend 5 or 6 hours at the range.  Intermixed with shooting (usually rifles), bs, and reminiscing.  We go through 200-300 rounds over 5-6 hours.

 

I knew someone would remark on that...  Hand/finger strength isn't an issue for me (piano player, and frequently on computers/gaming/etc).  

I'm talking about say 500 trigger pulls in less than 30 minutes time.  It adds up fast when you've got a 8lb pull weight vs a 4lb.  Because yes, the Mantis Blackbeard does reset the trigger that fast.

Not sure if you ever played any of the Time Crisis arcade/Playstation video games - I meant like whanging away on the trigger like that... 

 

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29 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

I knew someone would remark on that...  Hand/finger strength isn't an issue for me (piano player, and frequently on computers/gaming/etc).  

I'm talking about say 500 trigger pulls in less than 30 minutes time.  It adds up fast when you've got a 8lb pull weight vs a 4lb.  Because yes, the Mantis Blackbeard does reset the trigger that fast.

Not sure if you ever played any of the Time Crisis arcade/Playstation video games - I meant like whanging away on the trigger like that... 

 

You're talking keyboards. No resistance. What's the press on a piano or keyboard?

Wtf are you doing 500 trigger pulls in 3o minutes? Seems to me your just sending lead downrange.

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36 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

You're talking keyboards. No resistance. What's the press on a piano or keyboard?

Wtf are you doing 500 trigger pulls in 3o minutes? Seems to me your just sending lead downrange.

He’s using a self resetting laser trainer. I can attest the trigger pulls add up fast when you aren’t paying for any ammo. 

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6 minutes ago, raz-0 said:

He’s using a self resetting laser trainer. I can attest the trigger pulls add up fast when you aren’t paying for any ammo. 

But he's not building muscle in the rest of his hand.  That's why his trigger finger gets worn down.

But wtf do I know.  Been using ARs since 1968 and been a firearms instructor since 1976.

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On 6/5/2022 at 11:04 PM, High Exposure said:

Best bang for the buck is the ALG ACT single stage. It’s a tuned and coated mil-spec trigger with a smooth and crisp single stage that you can usually find for about 1/2 the price of the MBT.

 

This. 

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6 minutes ago, silverado427 said:

Why limit yourself to a trigger that's a little better that mil spec.  I had a ACT with JP springs it was ok , I sold it and got something better.

 

What would you suggest? I would like all options on the table.

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ALG ACT and  BCM  PNT are good single stage triggers. Both are superior to gritty creepy mil-spec.

I like the PNT best, take-up is smooth, consistent all the way to the wall.  The ACT seems to have a tiny amount of creep towards the end of a press, and pull weight is progressive, which makes it less predictable.  In spite of my nitpicking on the ACT, it's still much better than any basic trigger group.

Though I have no personal experience, I've heard many times that Ruger's "Elite" trigger is excellent.  It's worth watching some YT video reviews, on any trigger you are considering.

 

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On 6/7/2022 at 4:38 PM, Cheflife15 said:

What would you suggest? I would like all options on the table.

B.L.U.F.:
Best Value: ALG- ACT
Best Trigger: Geissele SSA

Keep in mind, I look at everything through the lens of “social” interaction ie: defensive use. My priority is not gaming or shooting from a bench. There may be better 3Gun or bench triggers out there, but I won’t use them because they don’t meet my primary need of reliability. My Carbines get used rough and often and I take a lot of training classes, so my equipment choices tend toward reliability and function above all else.

Now, if cost is not an option….

I have seen a lot of different aftermarket and stock OEM triggers in ARs. I have seen a lot of aftermarket triggers fail in high round/multi day training events during my career. IMO - the Geissele SSA is the ultimate “duty” trigger. They are reliable and consistent and many “special” people that I know that are more experienced than me and carry rifles into harms way for a living vouch for them - that counts for a lot in my book.

I have 4 “go to” carbines, each of them have Geissele SAA triggers. They are smooth and crisp enough to enhance my abilities, both in close and at distance, but are not so touchy that I have to worry about the safety of my trigger control or an ND.

Almost all the rest of my carbines have the ALG ACT - Something to note: ALG is Bill Geissele’s wife’s company - that’s a clue.

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