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NJ Handgun Carry Permit Application Experience

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PBA advocated for this, btw. If you listened to the hearing, they willingly sacrificed us so the retirees can keep their perk of being able to carry everywhere. I find the whole thing disgusting. The 2A is for everyone, not just retired police.

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9 minutes ago, RadioGunner said:

The 2A is for everyone, not just retired police.

While I don't like it, I understand it.  The PBA lobbyist has one job - to advocate for PBA members.  He's made the tactical decision that in this environment he can't advocate for us proles in order to give the "only ones" the best chance at what they want.

All the disparities end up helping us in the long run - the more inequalities of treatment/outcome, the more ammo for the court arguments.

 

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4 minutes ago, DirtyDigz said:

While I don't like it, I understand it.  The PBA lobbyist has one job - to advocate for PBA members.  He's made the tactical decision that in this environment he can't advocate for us proles in order to give the "only ones" the best chance at what they want.

All the disparities end up helping us in the long run - the more inequalities of treatment/outcome, the more ammo for the court arguments.

Oh I understand completely. But in NY, sheriffs are refusing to enforce their unconstitutional gun laws. We don't see that in NJ, partially because of the carve outs. 

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4 minutes ago, DirtyDigz said:

The PBA lobbyist has one job - to advocate for PBA members.

I think that's a rational take. Yes, it's their "job" ... and legally it will help us.

That said, I wonder if the BPA and their brethren are considering the public relations impact of this recent action? After all, in the recent "defund the police" era - when so much horrific scorn (and even violence) has been wrongly hurled against police - the sort of law-abiding citizen that applies for a carry concealed permit is very often the exact SAME sort of citizen that has been sticking up steadfastly for cops this entire time. How much sense does it make to stoke resentments amongst some of your biggest supporters, particularly when supporters seem to be few and far between these days? Perhaps it was a bit short-sighted from that perspective. It doesn't reduce my respect for the work they do one iota... but it will certainly dampen the enthusiasm of others. That's a shame.   

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19 minutes ago, RadioGunner said:

But in NY, sheriffs are refusing to enforce their unconstitutional gun laws. We don't see that in NJ, partially because of the carve outs.

Maybe if NJ police chiefs had to be elected like NY sheriffs, instead of being appointed, we'd see more advocacy from them.

10 minutes ago, Mrs. Peel said:

That said, I wonder if the BPA and their brethren are considering the public relations impact of this recent action?

Any PBA donation request I get is going straight in the trash next time they come around.

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1 hour ago, DirtyDigz said:

Maybe if NJ police chiefs had to be elected like NY sheriffs, instead of being appointed, we'd see more advocacy from them.

I was a Deputy Sheriff in another State for 7 years.  In most states, the state constitution names the sheriff as the Chief Law Enforcement Officer in their County and gives him his authority and responsibility.  Here is a quote from a Michigan Sheriff's website. 

 The Sheriff has Jurisdiction across his entire county and is said to be the Chief Law Enforcement Official of the county and having the ability to be the “Buffer” between the People and Government. While Upholding the rule of law for the government, the Sheriff also has the ability to uphold the Constitutional rights of the People to protect them from Government Over-reach on a Local, State and Federal Level.

 

In the PRNJ, the Chief LEO is the prosecutor.  According to the state of NJ:  Under New Jersey law, the county prosecutor functions as the chief law enforcement officer for the county.  Each county prosecutor is charged with the obligation to use all reasonable and lawful diligence in the detection, arrest, indictment and conviction of people who violate the criminal laws of New Jersey.

Also in PRNJ, the prosecutor is appointed by the Governor.     

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16 minutes ago, marlintag said:

Exactly, we were discussing this very issue on the other thread. Those of you that are devotees of law enforcement may want to re-think your position in light of what's happening. The PBA rep said that in the meeting that he supports wholeheartedly everything in the bill as long as he and other retired officers are not affected by any of it. Thats exactly what he said......It's a slap in the face for many in the 2A community that have always been steadfast supporters of those in uniform. I'm starting to understand why so many people are in support of the "defund the police" movement.

Unfortunately, Cops are some of the biggest tyrants there are. Alot of these unconstitutional laws are gladly enforced and encouraged by law enforcement. 

 

This comes from someone who is from a family of cops. 

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I can understand the frustration and anger towards the PBA and the guy that testified. But I am hesitant to paint all LEO with the same brush. Just like we do not want to be lumped in with the irresponsible gun owners. I'm not just talking about the prohibited people here either. What about the people who leave guns within easy access of children, or people in other States with a CCW and brandish it or worse over a parking space dispute, etc... 

As mentioned previously, a union's job is to their members first; that does not mean every member agrees with the union bosses or supports them. Teachers in NJ are required to be a union member or they don't have a job. Do you think they agree with every stance the union takes? I know there are many that don't.  Are cops required to be a PBA member? I don't know, but it wouldn't surprise me if they were.

Don't all LEO take an oath to uphold The Constitution? Doctors are punished if they violate their Hippocratic oath, don't they? Also, we have LEO on this forum. I've met at least one face to face, I truly believe he supports the 2A, us and our right to carry and defend ourselves. Should he and the others be put in the same group as the guy from the PBA? I don't put him there or judge him based on the PBA. 

Pick any profession, group, association, etc... there will always be good members and bad, it is human nature. As also mentioned above, maybe the members of the PBA will take notice, realize the potential for damage from a public relations standpoint and vote in better leadership. 

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8 hours ago, marlintag said:

Exactly, we were discussing this very issue on the other thread. Those of you that are devotees of law enforcement may want to re-think your position in light of what's happening. The PBA rep said that in the meeting that he supports wholeheartedly everything in the bill as long as he and other retired officers are not affected by any of it. Thats exactly what he said......It's a slap in the face for many in the 2A community that have always been steadfast supporters of those in uniform. I'm starting to understand why so many people are in support of the "defund the police" movement.

In other countries police lock up their guns in a locker at the station at the end of a shift. They don’t get to keep them after they leave and certainly not for retirement. I’m certain this bill was intended as a trial balloon to see if retired police would even notice. Eventually I know the state will target them. Only a matter of time. Today we the people are being sacrificed to keep the RPO perk, tomorrow it won’t be so easy.

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9 hours ago, Regular Guy said:

I was a Deputy Sheriff in another State for 7 years.  In most states, the state constitution names the sheriff as the Chief Law Enforcement Officer in their County and gives him his authority and responsibility.  Here is a quote from a Michigan Sheriff's website. 

 The Sheriff has Jurisdiction across his entire county and is said to be the Chief Law Enforcement Official of the county and having the ability to be the “Buffer” between the People and Government. While Upholding the rule of law for the government, the Sheriff also has the ability to uphold the Constitutional rights of the People to protect them from Government Over-reach on a Local, State and Federal Level.

 

In the PRNJ, the Chief LEO is the prosecutor.  According to the state of NJ:  Under New Jersey law, the county prosecutor functions as the chief law enforcement officer for the county.  Each county prosecutor is charged with the obligation to use all reasonable and lawful diligence in the detection, arrest, indictment and conviction of people who violate the criminal laws of New Jersey.

Also in PRNJ, the prosecutor is appointed by the Governor.     

What about in Florida where the department of agriculture issues permits?

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4 minutes ago, CMJeepster said:

All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others.

Indeed.

I have three friends in my 'inner circle' who are cops (one recently retired) and they're all honest enough to acknowledge that the rules that apply to the rest of us do not extend to them.

"Professional courtesy" gets them out of trouble with each other, and horseshit like 'disorderly conduct' or 'not following a lawful order' are used when they're interacting with someone who is "pissing them off" or being "rude or disrespectful".

Animal_Farm_Text_seperated.jpg?159381813

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I wonder how RPO's are going to like it when sone Karen calls the police when they see the RPO carrying? 

I'm sure it won't happen often because they will not have to use a bulky outside the waste band holster with a retention strap.

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Has anyone who applied for their CCW in Edison ever obtained the status of their application?  I just called the Edison PD records department and they told me that they don’t give any status and I just have to wait until I hear from the court.  She sounded like she was tired of responding to requests for ccw status.  

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On 10/25/2022 at 3:21 PM, dragon22 said:

Has anyone who applied for their CCW in Edison ever obtained the status of their application?  I just called the Edison PD records department and they told me that they don’t give any status and I just have to wait until I hear from the court.  She sounded like she was tired of responding to requests for ccw status.  

 

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11 minutes ago, marlintag said:

yep, tons of people have applied for CCW in edison and most are still waiting at the court level. I suggest you join Middlesex county CCW facebook group. Were are unlucky enough to be in one of the worst counties for ccw issuance. 

Thanks for the quick response. How do people know they are at the court level?  I already joined the facebook page but haven’t seen anything specific for Edison.  Everyone else in Middlesex seems to have obtained status from their PD except for Edison.  I agree that we seem to be in the worst town and county for ccw.

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1 hour ago, Chad-williams said:

Has anyone heard of Cumberland county approving an application besides that one guy in millville? Searched this thread and other places but all I've found is that one guy from millville getting approved.

I know someone who has his in-person hearing in Cumberland on Thursday of this week.

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On 10/25/2022 at 3:41 PM, dragon22 said:

Thanks for the quick response. How do people know they are at the court level?  I already joined the facebook page but haven’t seen anything specific for Edison.  Everyone else in Middlesex seems to have obtained status from their PD except for Edison.  I agree that we seem to be in the worst town and county for ccw.

 

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19 minutes ago, samiam said:

That statement goes WAY beyond the advocacy requirements of the job. If that is indeed what the PBA rep said, then the PBA rep is nothing more than an elitist, anti-Liberty, colossal asshole.

The PBA rep should not have a seat at the table.

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