Old Bridge Rifle and Pistol Club - NRA membership required?

[DirtyDigz 1,811]

I'm looking into joining Old Bridge Rifle and Pistol Club.
 

I see that their site lists NRA membership as a club membership requirement.

Are they still enforcing that requirement for membership?

[HuntingPaper 62]

Yes, Old Bridge is an NRA affiliated club and you have to maintain NRA membership as long you are a member of the club. 

[Scorpio64 5,147]

30 minutes ago, HuntingPaper said:

Old Bridge is an NRA affiliated club

Every private range in NJ requires NRA membership as a condition for joining.  It's part of their mafia style protection racket.  In spite of WLP's conspicuous self indulgences with membership fees and donations, there is actually a huge pile of cash left over.  The NRA uses that cash to insure ranges that can't get insurance, or offer it cheaper than any other insurer can.  As a result, they own 100% of the market, putting them in the position where they can extort citizens into joining It's the classic pay to play scheme.   The only redeeming aspect of the scheme is that democrats who want to join ranges have to be NRA card carriers.

Walk on ranges like Range 14 Shore Shot and Shooters do not require membership to shoot, but they usually only offer membership to NRA members.

[HuntingPaper 62]

Is not a mafia racket… there’s a huge part of the NRA dedicated to instruction and sanction competitions and that is why most clubs are affiliated. It may be hard to believe for you but not everything is politics.  

[Scorpio64 5,147]

27 minutes ago, HuntingPaper said:

s not a mafia racket…

If it's not a racket, then they should let non NRA members shoot there.  The NRA controls who can and cannot join ranges.  That, my friend, is a racket.  It is exactly the same as being forced to join a union to get certain jobs.

[HuntingPaper 62]

Thank you for make me remember why I stop hanging around this place.

[MartyZ 692]

31 minutes ago, Scorpio64 said:

If it's not a racket, then they should let non NRA members shoot there.  The NRA controls who can and cannot join ranges.  That, my friend, is a racket.  It is exactly the same as being forced to join a union to get certain jobs.

I agree 100%. Talking about COMPLYING with the NRA to be able to join a club. I thought this entire community was about non-compliance.

I will never join a club that forces me to comply with a mandate to join any organization that I don't want to join.

[Mr.Stu 1,916]

Be sure to keep using only 10 round magazines after ANJRPC win their case. Wouldn't it be awful benefit from the efforts of such a horrible organization. 

[MartyZ 692]

2 minutes ago, Mr.Stu said:

Be sure to keep using only 10 round magazines after ANJRPC win their case. Wouldn't it be awful benefit from the efforts of such a horrible organization. 

we are talking about private clubs forcing NRA membership in general, not ANJRPC specifically.

[Mr.Stu 1,916]

ANJRPC is the NJ State branch of the NRA. Perhaps you're unaware of how much support ANJRPC gets from the NRA and NRA-ILA.

[MartyZ 692]

2 minutes ago, Mr.Stu said:

ANJRPC is the NJ State branch of the NRA. Perhaps you're unaware of how much support ANJRPC gets from the NRA and NRA-ILA.

Ok, ANJRPC can mandate NRA membership since they are an NRA branch. But other clubs are not an NRA branch, so why do they mandate NRA membership?

[Scorpio64 5,147]

12 minutes ago, Mr.Stu said:

ANJRPC is the NJ State branch of the NRA. Perhaps you're unaware of how much support ANJRPC gets from the NRA and NRA-ILA.

Believe me, I know everything about the NRA I need to know, and then some.  I was a member for a very long time, decades of watching them do NOTHING for NJ, the state the NRA dubbed as a lost cause. 

I am not opposed to the NRA.  If people want to join, then join.  Although I'm not a member, I always round up when checking out at Midway.  I will not join the NRA until WLP gets the boot or drops dead.  It's a matter of principle.  I will not be strong armed into joining anything, especially when there is rampant corruption.

[Scorpio64 5,147]

30 minutes ago, HuntingPaper said:

Thank you for make me remember why I stop hanging around this place.

Please show me on the doll where the internet hurt you.  Are you so thin skinned you can't handle people having their own opinions based on their own experiences?  If you can make a good case why someone should be forced to join the NRA and explain away the WLP Club's living high on the hog off members dues, then I'm all ears. 

Give me just one good reason why NRA membership should be required to join a range.  Please don't go with "because it pays for insurance" because, guess what, the range can charge non members more and give that money to the NRA.

[Mr.Stu 1,916]

9 minutes ago, MartyZ said:

Ok, ANJRPC can mandate NRA membership since they are an NRA branch. But other clubs are not an NRA branch, so why do they mandate NRA membership?

Probably because they are affiliated with ANJRPC and derive benefits from that. Look at the following statute:

"2C:39-6 Exemptions.

f.   Nothing in subsections b., c., and d. of N.J.S.2C:39-5 shall be construed to prevent:
 
   (1)   A member of any rifle or pistol club organized in accordance with the rules prescribed by the National Board for the Promotion of Rifle Practice, in going to or from a place of target practice, carrying firearms necessary for target practice, provided that the club has filed a copy of its charter with the superintendent and annually submits a list of its members to the superintendent and provided further that the firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section;
 
   (2)   A person carrying a firearm or knife in the woods or fields or upon the waters of this State for the purpose of hunting, target practice or fishing, provided that the firearm or knife is legal and appropriate for hunting or fishing purposes in this State and the person has in his possession a valid hunting license, or, with respect to fresh water fishing, a valid fishing license;
 
   (3)   A person transporting any firearm or knife while traveling:
 
   (a)   Directly to or from any place for the purpose of hunting or fishing, provided the person has in possession a valid hunting or fishing license; or
 
   (b)   Directly to or from any target range, or other authorized place for the purpose of practice, match, target, trap or skeet shooting exhibitions, provided in all cases that during the course of the travel all firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section and the person has complied with all the provisions and requirements of Title 23 of the Revised Statutes and any amendments thereto and all rules and regulations promulgated thereunder; or
 
   (c)   In the case of a firearm, directly to or from any exhibition or display of firearms which is sponsored by any law enforcement agency, any rifle or pistol club, or any firearms collectors club, for the purpose of displaying the firearms to the public or to the members of the organization or club, provided, however, that not less than 30 days prior to the exhibition or display, notice of the exhibition or display shall be given to the Superintendent of the State Police by the sponsoring organization or club, and the sponsor has complied with any reasonable safety regulations the superintendent may promulgate. Any firearms transported pursuant to this section shall be transported in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section;"

Notice how subsection (1) does not state "directly to or from". To qualify for (1) the club of which you are a member needs to be affiliated with ANJRPC. Without membership of an affiliated club, you do not benefit from the "reasonable deviation" part of subsection g. You are limited to subsection (3) which stipulates "directly to or from".

Notice also that (1) allows for travel to "a place of target practice", whereas (3)(b) specifies "target range or other authorized place"

Membership has its benefits. If you don't want them, you are free to choose to go without. However, don't whine about having to support the organizations that are helping you and everybody else if you do chose to take the benefit. If you don't like the way it is run, get involved. If you were a member, you'd be able to vote for your choice of board members.

[MartyZ 692]

I was a member of the NRA for a long time, my membership actually expired this year, and I'm not whining, I'm stating an opinion.

The point I'm making is that every single private club with outdoor ranges and no non-member access, unless your a guest, in this state requires nra membership. Why do they all require it, and I don't think transport laws play a major role in it.

There are many indoor ranges with annual memberships that don't require nra memberships, explain that.

My issue is not nra membership specifically, but the REQUIREMENT of an nra membership.

[DirtyDigz 1,811]

44 minutes ago, Mr.Stu said:

If you were a member, you'd be able to vote for your choice of board members.

Maybe, If the NRA hadn't (deliberately?) screwed up the ballot envelopes:

https://onlygunsandmoney.com/2022/03/20/issue-with-returning-nra-ballots.html
https://onlygunsandmoney.com/2022/03/28/more-returned-nra-ballots.html

I want a strong, lawful, ethical and financially responsible NRA.  We all need it.

The NRA as it currently exists is captured by WLP, his cronies and sycophants, and a law firm that are all apparently content to continue to pick at the withering carcass of the NRA until it collapses.

https://onlygunsandmoney.com/2022/03/17/is-brewer-getting-his-hooks-into-nra-ilas-budget.html

The only reason that the NRA became vulnerable to NY's lawsuit was that they mismanaged themselves to the point where the lawsuit was feasible. Even though the NRA has surmounted the NY lawsuit, they still face a fraud lawsuit from one of their biggest donors:

https://onlygunsandmoney.com/2022/08/18/dellaquila-lawsuit-against-nra-revived.html

I have zero faith that any positive organizational change can come from any action of the members other than withholding funds.  At the last members meeting, every resolution raised that was critical of the NRA in any respect was ruled "out of order" or voted down:

https://onlygunsandmoney.com/2022/06/06/meeting-of-members-resolutions-part-i.html

https://onlygunsandmoney.com/2022/06/06/meeting-of-members-resolutions-part-ii.html

https://onlygunsandmoney.com/2022/06/06/meeting-of-members-resolutions-part-iii.html

https://onlygunsandmoney.com/2022/06/06/meeting-of-members-resolutions-part-iv.html

The amount of good and ethical people that have either voluntary left or have been ousted from the NRA is stunning.  The board members in the NRA seem content to ride WLP's coattails all the way into collapse.

I see any contribution of money to the NRA as only prolonging the mismanagement by WLP and his toadies, so I choose instead to donate to other organizations including Firearms Policy Coalition (FPC) and, locally, the Coalition of New Jersey Firearms Owners (CNJFO).

[10X 3,296]

12 hours ago, DirtyDigz said:

I want a strong, lawful, ethical and financially responsible NRA.  We all need it.

The NRA as it currently exists is captured by WLP, his cronies and sycophants, and a law firm that are all apparently content to continue to pick at the withering carcass of the NRA until it collapses.

I quite agree.  I'm still a member of the NRA, and wouldn't have a problem with ranges requiring membership if the 'financially-responsible' condition were met.   The NRA still does some good work, and Mr Stu outlined some of the benefits we receive here.

But, under LaPierre, the NRA has become a kleptocracy, focussed on enriching the inner circle.  I used to regularly donate to the NRA, but haven't for at least a decade, and when I do accidentally answer one of the NRA's fund raising calls, the conversation is always short:  

• "LaPierre is still CEO, right?"    "Yes"   "Not another dime until he is gone."

But he won't be gone, and that's a problem.  LaPierre, assisted by complicit board members (who should also be gone) have corrupted the election process to the point that Kim Jong-un is more likely to be voted out of office than is LaPierre.

[Scorpio64 5,147]

5 minutes ago, 10X said:

and Mr Stu outlined some of the benefits we receive here.

What benefits are gained from NRA membership?  If the benefit is range membership, then let me point out that there are at least two NJ ranges that do not require NRA membership to join, and the so called benefit is the same.

I dunno if I'm missing something here, but I do not believe being an NRA member affords a NJ citizen any additional freedoms.  The benefit comes from being a range/shooting club member.

[Dr. Goodshot 26]

14 hours ago, Mr.Stu said:

Probably because they are affiliated with ANJRPC and derive benefits from that. Look at the following statute:

"2C:39-6 Exemptions.

f.   Nothing in subsections b., c., and d. of N.J.S.2C:39-5 shall be construed to prevent:
 
   (1)   A member of any rifle or pistol club organized in accordance with the rules prescribed by the National Board for the Promotion of Rifle Practice, in going to or from a place of target practice, carrying firearms necessary for target practice, provided that the club has filed a copy of its charter with the superintendent and annually submits a list of its members to the superintendent and provided further that the firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section;
 
   (2)   A person carrying a firearm or knife in the woods or fields or upon the waters of this State for the purpose of hunting, target practice or fishing, provided that the firearm or knife is legal and appropriate for hunting or fishing purposes in this State and the person has in his possession a valid hunting license, or, with respect to fresh water fishing, a valid fishing license;
 
   (3)   A person transporting any firearm or knife while traveling:
 
   (a)   Directly to or from any place for the purpose of hunting or fishing, provided the person has in possession a valid hunting or fishing license; or
 
   (b)   Directly to or from any target range, or other authorized place for the purpose of practice, match, target, trap or skeet shooting exhibitions, provided in all cases that during the course of the travel all firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section and the person has complied with all the provisions and requirements of Title 23 of the Revised Statutes and any amendments thereto and all rules and regulations promulgated thereunder; or
 
   (c)   In the case of a firearm, directly to or from any exhibition or display of firearms which is sponsored by any law enforcement agency, any rifle or pistol club, or any firearms collectors club, for the purpose of displaying the firearms to the public or to the members of the organization or club, provided, however, that not less than 30 days prior to the exhibition or display, notice of the exhibition or display shall be given to the Superintendent of the State Police by the sponsoring organization or club, and the sponsor has complied with any reasonable safety regulations the superintendent may promulgate. Any firearms transported pursuant to this section shall be transported in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section;"

Notice how subsection (1) does not state "directly to or from". To qualify for (1) the club of which you are a member needs to be affiliated with ANJRPC. Without membership of an affiliated club, you do not benefit from the "reasonable deviation" part of subsection g. You are limited to subsection (3) which stipulates "directly to or from".

Notice also that (1) allows for travel to "a place of target practice", whereas (3)(b) specifies "target range or other authorized place"

Membership has its benefits. If you don't want them, you are free to choose to go without. However, don't whine about having to support the organizations that are helping you and everybody else if you do chose to take the benefit. If you don't like the way it is run, get involved. If you were a member, you'd be able to vote for your choice of board members.

But then that is followed by 4(g) which states:

g.All weapons being transported under paragraph (2) of subsection b., subsection e., or paragraph (1) or (3) of subsection f. of this section shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported, and in the course of travel shall include only such deviations as are reasonably necessary under the circumstances.

In other words, whether you are transporting under (1) - member of a club - or (3) - regular person going to the range - you are subject to the same rules regarding "reasonable deviations" and how to package your firearm for transportation.
Then, the attorney general's letter clarifies what "reasonable deviation" means, and it covers both types of people transporting, members of clubs and non-members. There is nothing in there about how you get to deviate more if you're the member of a pistol club (https://www.state.nj.us/oag/dcj/agguide/transporting-firearms_guide.pdf).

So in practical terms, unless I'm missing something, I'm not seeing how transporting under f(1) gives you more privileges than under f(3).

[DirtyDigz 1,811]

Back on the original point of the thread - I emailed OBRPC's membership address yesterday, they replied today that they ask members to join, but DO NOT REQUIRE NRA membership.

On my way to applying for membership there.

[Mr.Stu 1,916]

4 hours ago, Dr. Goodshot said:

But then that is followed by 4(g) which states:

g.All weapons being transported under paragraph (2) of subsection b., subsection e., or paragraph (1) or (3) of subsection f. of this section shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported, and in the course of travel shall include only such deviations as are reasonably necessary under the circumstances.

In other words, whether you are transporting under (1) - member of a club - or (3) - regular person going to the range - you are subject to the same rules regarding "reasonable deviations" and how to package your firearm for transportation.
Then, the attorney general's letter clarifies what "reasonable deviation" means, and it covers both types of people transporting, members of clubs and non-members. There is nothing in there about how you get to deviate more if you're the member of a pistol club (https://www.state.nj.us/oag/dcj/agguide/transporting-firearms_guide.pdf).

So in practical terms, unless I'm missing something, I'm not seeing how transporting under f(1) gives you more privileges than under f(3).

f(1) does not say directly to or from so reasonable deviations are allowed. f(3) does say directly to or from. That means no deviations, reasonable or otherwise are allowed.

[DirtyDigz 1,811]

Happy to report I'm now a probationary member of OBRPC without being a NRA member.

[MartyZ 692]

12 minutes ago, DirtyDigz said:

Happy to report I'm now a probationary member of OBRPC without being a NRA member.

Congrats. And I'm happy they removed the NRA requirement. Maybe now I will consider joining as well.