Help: 1911 Failure To Eject

[ESB 247]

I just started having an issue with FTE on my 1911.  The gun has a several hundred rounds through it, the magazine (Wilson Combat ETM Vickers) only around 100-200 or so.  It happens every other or every third mag.  

I was able to replicate it using dummy rounds so I could take a pic.  I usually clean the gun after every use, and this happened on the very first mag of the session at the range.  

In the pic it looks like the empty round got stuck on a lip of the new round.  On the ammo I was using at the range, there is no lip, yet I was getting the exact same malfunction.  The slide was pushing the round in the mag forward.  The round in the mag was pushing up on the empty round coming out of the chamber, preventing it from coming out all the way.  I could not tap and rack.  The mag would not drop by itself, I had to rip it out and when I did, the round to be chambered fell out.  I believe that round was what was preventing the mag from dropping free.  I then had to re-insert the mag and rack it.  When I racked it, the empty round would come out as normal.  

Not sure if it is the mag or the extractor or what.  Suggestions?

 

  

 

.

[124gr9mm 859]

I thought failures to eject was a feature built in to every 1911??

 

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

A few things to check off the bat:

1. Is there any crud built up under the extractor claw? - if there is crud under there it can prevent the claw getting full purchase on the rim of the case.
2. Is the extractor claw in good condition? If there is a piece chipped off the extractor claw it is not going to make good contact on the case rim.
3. Is there good tension on the extractor? If the extractor is not pressing in towards the center of the case it can more easily jump the rim.
4. Is the recoil spring still within spec? If the recoil spring is worn and is not applying sufficient forward pressure the slide speed may be too fast and the case may have not released from the sides of the breech before the extractor comes into play.

Also, does it happen with the same mag every time, or with a variety of mags? Marking your mags can help here.

What ammo are you using? Aluminum case is not as strong as brass and the extractor can sometimes rip through it.

Following on from the last point, is there any tell-tale markings on the case that failed to extract? To be sure not to make any additional marks, when the FTE happens, do not drop the slide back over the case to eject it. Pry it out gently with a knife tip or small screwdriver.

Do you, or have you ever loaded a round into the breech and dropped the slide onto it? The 1911, along with most other semi-autos, is a controlled feed design. The rim of the fresh round is supposed to slide up the breech face so the rim is already under the extractor. Forcing the extractor to move outboard to skip over the rim is not doing it any good, especially with the internal extractor design found in the 1911.

[ESB 247]

4 hours ago, Mr.Stu said:

A few things to check off the bat:

1. Is there any crud built up under the extractor claw? - if there is crud under there it can prevent the claw getting full purchase on the rim of the case.
2. Is the extractor claw in good condition? If there is a piece chipped off the extractor claw it is not going to make good contact on the case rim.
3. Is there good tension on the extractor? If the extractor is not pressing in towards the center of the case it can more easily jump the rim.
4. Is the recoil spring still within spec? If the recoil spring is worn and is not applying sufficient forward pressure the slide speed may be too fast and the case may have not released from the sides of the breech before the extractor comes into play.

Also, does it happen with the same mag every time, or with a variety of mags? Marking your mags can help here.

What ammo are you using? Aluminum case is not as strong as brass and the extractor can sometimes rip through it.

Following on from the last point, is there any tell-tale markings on the case that failed to extract? To be sure not to make any additional marks, when the FTE happens, do not drop the slide back over the case to eject it. Pry it out gently with a knife tip or small screwdriver.

Do you, or have you ever loaded a round into the breech and dropped the slide onto it? The 1911, along with most other semi-autos, is a controlled feed design. The rim of the fresh round is supposed to slide up the breech face so the rim is already under the extractor. Forcing the extractor to move outboard to skip over the rim is not doing it any good, especially with the internal extractor design found in the 1911.

The gun is fairly new and doesn't see a lot of use like my other guns.  I clean my guns after each use, but usually with cleaning wipes and microfiber clothes.  Rarely with q-tips and brushes.  So while the area may be clean there could have been crud under that I didn't see.  

I think it happened with more than one magazine, but definitely more often with the new one.  

I did not keep any of the cases.  

I store this in its own safe with one in the chamber.  I had been inserting a full mag into the gun, racking it to chamber the round, then pop the mag and top it off.  I recently read that repeatedly doing this with the same round can cause a Failure To Fire in that round so I started dropping a round in and rack the slide forward (I don't release it or sling shot it).  I store it with self defense ammo, and swap it out for range ammo or dummy rounds when taking it to the range or dry fire trainging with it.  This seems to be the most logical reason for the malfunction, as I just started doing this and the issue appeared.  

 

If it is the extractor and/or extractor spring (it does seem a little loose, but don't have another 1911 to compare it to) how involved is the fix?  

Thanks!

 

 

 

 

[1LtCAP 4,263]

what i do if i think i'm having an issue with a particular mag, is i mark that mag.

 

other than that, i don't have much to offer, as my remington has never failed me. but i'm following this to learn.

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

2 hours ago, ESB said:

I think it happened with more than one magazine, but definitely more often with the new one.  

Without deliberate testing you should not assume anything. Take it back to the range and deliberately test each mag.

2 hours ago, ESB said:

I did not keep any of the cases.  

Again, go back to the range and deliberately determine which cases it had an issue with and save them for examination.

2 hours ago, ESB said:

I recently read that repeatedly doing this with the same round can cause a Failure To Fire

I have no idea why that would be an issue. However, repeatedly chambering a specific round can cause something called bullet set back. This is where the bullet is pushed farther and farther into the case each time it is chambered. This can become dangerous as an overpressure event could occur if you fired that cartridge with the bullet set deeper into the case than designed - it leaves less space for the powder so the pressure spike at ignition could be higher, even too high.

2 hours ago, ESB said:

If it is the extractor and/or extractor spring (it does seem a little loose, but don't have another 1911 to compare it to) how involved is the fix?

The tip of the extractor should not be loose at all - there should be constant pressure toward the center of the gun - definitely more than you can overcome with finger pressure. If you can move it with little to no pressure you have already damaged the extractor and need to get it replaced - it is probably broken inside the slide.

The internal extractor design of a 1911 supplies its own springiness. There is no separate extractor spring. Replacing it can be a simple drop in, but more often it will need fitting and tuning to your specific gun. Unless you're very familiar with the 1911 internals (and I'm guessing you're not) it is a job best left to a gunsmith.

2 hours ago, ESB said:

I store it with self defense ammo

Until you get this issue sorted out, I would not rely on this gun for self defense unless you have no other alternatives.

[ESB 247]

Thank you so much Mr. Stu!  

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

18 minutes ago, ESB said:

Thank you so much Mr. Stu!  

No Problem - let us know how it works out.

[ESB 247]

The extractor has scratches on the outside lip.  I can push it in closer to the center of the gun a little fairly easily, but pushing out is very hard.  Where you see it in the pic, it is hard to push it further out.  

[RichP 115]

The extractor needs to be tensioned enough to be resting completely against its channel inboard and still be able to flex outward towards the slide when a round is chambered. Not being able to flex it outward is either crud in the channel, a cracked extractor or not enough tension(bend) in the extractor. There are youtube videos on tensioning it, although it is mostly a trial and error exercise. Those scratches indicate that someone was trying to remove it, use plastic or brass tools next time 

Some extractors do have springs, but that would not be on a factory gun.

A round in the mag should not be lifted before the slide clears, there is a rail built into the slide to ensure that.

Lastly, I don't see an ejector in the first pic. Is it there and in good shape?

[tony357 386]

  I recently read that repeatedly doing this with the same round can cause a Failure To Fire in that round so I started dropping a round in and rack the slide forward (I don't release it or sling shot it). 

 

This is part of your problem your not suppose to drop round in the barrel and release the slide as this will damage your internal extractor. The round is suppose to come up from the mag and it sets it under the extractor. putting one in the chamber makes the extractor pop over the case stretching the extractor bending it outward reducing your tension and bending extractor head backwards. 

Have a new extractor installed and tension set for your caliber. 

[bennj 215]

You have received excellent advice here. Only thing I would add is to check if the extractor claw is holding the round. To check this, remove the slide, place the rim of a round in the claw and see if it holds the round while lightly shaking the slide. The green dummy round looks as if the extractor didn't grab it, and the next dummy round pushed it more into the chamber? The extractor is relatively easy to remove to check for gunk , but that's not many rounds through it. And I would never drop a round in the chamber like you're doing, you were right the first time. Good luck and safe shooting.