Tunaman 538 Posted December 6, 2022 5 hours ago, samiam said: 2013 New Jersey Revised Statutes Title 41 - OATHS AND AFFIDAVITS Section 41:3-1 - False swearing, affirmation of declaration; perjury states: 41:3-1. False swearing, affirmation of declaration; perjury If any person shall willfully and corruptly swear, affirm or declare falsely, in or by any oath, affirmation, declaration or affidavit, required to be made or taken by any statute of this state, or necessary or proper to be made, taken or used in any court of this state, or for any lawful purpose whatever, such person shall be deemed guilty of perjury and punished accordingly. My IANAL interpretion of that is that these ass-clowns are committing the crime of perjury whenever they willfully vote for legislation, or engage in other conduct, that is inconsistent with the Constiutions of NJ and the US. I alluded to this in my letter to Callahan. I wonder when Platkin or some other prosecutor will begin to indict them? I also am not very pleased that I have yet to see any of our advocacy organizations pursue, or even seriously threaten to pursue, mere lawsuits against those state officials violating their oaths in this manner. IMO they should be pressuring for criminal prosecution. Just keep in mind that you cant sue anybody until it becomes law. People a lot smarter than us are already on this. Keep an open mind as to what may happen...because it IS going to happen. Heads will roll for sure. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1LtCAP 4,259 Posted December 6, 2022 6 hours ago, samiam said: 2013 New Jersey Revised Statutes Title 41 - OATHS AND AFFIDAVITS Section 41:3-1 - False swearing, affirmation of declaration; perjury states: 41:3-1. False swearing, affirmation of declaration; perjury If any person shall willfully and corruptly swear, affirm or declare falsely, in or by any oath, affirmation, declaration or affidavit, required to be made or taken by any statute of this state, or necessary or proper to be made, taken or used in any court of this state, or for any lawful purpose whatever, such person shall be deemed guilty of perjury and punished accordingly. My IANAL interpretion of that is that these ass-clowns are committing the crime of perjury whenever they willfully vote for legislation, or engage in other conduct, that is inconsistent with the Constiutions of NJ and the US. I alluded to this in my letter to Callahan. I wonder when Platkin or some other prosecutor will begin to indict them? I also am not very pleased that I have yet to see any of our advocacy organizations pursue, or even seriously threaten to pursue, mere lawsuits against those state officials violating their oaths in this manner. IMO they should be pressuring for criminal prosecution. 6 hours ago, CMJeepster said: "They" make the rules and "they" don't follow them and will never be held accountable. just need to find a law firm to handle it/them properly. possibly the ones that won bruen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grima Squeakersen 473 Posted December 7, 2022 ***DELETED*** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Walkinguf61 40 Posted December 7, 2022 5 hours ago, samiam said: That is so. On the gripping hand, those legislators (as well as Callahan, et al) are (per the catch-all reference in 41:3-1) are arguably guilty of perjury for violating their oaths by merely voting to pass legislation that is blatantly unconstitutional per se. I'd like to see some noise made about that, even if there is little to no chance that any prosecutor will file those criminal charges. Same goes for lawsuits, actually. Promises to sue the living shit out of these people for passing their bullshit law doesn't need to wait until it is passed and signed. The lack of rhetoric on these subjects sadly suggests to me the intention to pursue the kind of behind-closed-doors political horse trading that has failed us so often in the past, in lieu of the open confrontation that I am convinced is needed. If the gloves aren't dropped by our advocates under these extreme circumstances, when would be the appropriate time for that to happen? Under what circumstances would there be a consensus that our advocates are really not up to the job, and need to be replaced? I'm not stating that needs to be done, but I believe that it is not too early to be contemplating those questions. The legislative branch is not liable for any law they propose or pass. The legal liability falls on those who enforce it. It has always been this way. A quick question about the insurance part of the bill. Does a general liability umbrella policy satisfy this part of the bill? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted December 8, 2022 16 hours ago, Walkinguf61 said: A quick question about the insurance part of the bill. Does a general liability umbrella policy satisfy this part of the bill? Nobody knows for sure as this whole thing is a pile of garbage thrown together at the last minute, like all other crap legislation. (Hopefully it does satisfy as that's what I've got.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grima Squeakersen 473 Posted December 8, 2022 ***DELETED*** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted December 8, 2022 Let's see how it's going in New York: New York can continue to enforce state gun control law, appeals court rules (msn.com) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DAHL 58 Posted December 8, 2022 3 hours ago, CMJeepster said: Let's see how it's going in New York: New York can continue to enforce state gun control law, appeals court rules (msn.com) Thats a ruling by a NY city based court. It needs to go to the federal court of appeals to be contested. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted December 8, 2022 20 minutes ago, DAHL said: Thats a ruling by a NY city based court. It needs to go to the federal court of appeals to be contested. And it will. I only posted that because it's the road that we'll be going down next. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spartiati 63 Posted December 8, 2022 2 hours ago, CMJeepster said: And it will. I only posted that because it's the road that we'll be going down next. This is the Second Circuit Appeals court which is based in NY. That Stayed the Injunction but not fully. NY can’t enforce churches and Airports, read the opinion. This is also temporary until the Second Circuit hear’s oral argument which will occur within 2 months…. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,764 Posted December 11, 2022 On 11/23/2022 at 8:31 PM, DAHL said: I'll hope hope and pray for a quicker resolution. I hope his cancer returns and this time it wins. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DAHL 58 Posted December 15, 2022 We all know the road that we are going down. The cancel carry bill will pass but public testimony, speaking out for what is right, and writing your legislators will raise public awareness about the kind of despots that we have in Trenton. We can say that the big cities control the NJ vote but what about the soccer moms that always vote democrat? We also need to get the message out to our black citizens that NJ government is NOT your friend. The cancel carry bill is a racist bill. Look at the crime in the inner cities. Has it gotten better under democrat control.? These are good talking points that must be discussed and hammered home.. Your opinion counts. Use it. 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M1152 713 Posted December 15, 2022 MONDAY: FULL SENATE TO VOTE ON CARRY-KILLER BILL https://www.anjrpc.org/page/MONDAYCarryKillerBillMovesToFullSenate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Xtors 327 Posted December 15, 2022 2 minutes ago, M1152 said: MONDAY: FULL SENATE TO VOTE ON CARRY-KILLER BILL https://www.anjrpc.org/page/MONDAYCarryKillerBillMovesToFullSenate Thanks for sending. I finally received this alert via email! I hit every senator earlier this week and cc'd Scutari on every one per GFH's recommendation and I will hit them all again tonight or tomorrow. Please, everyone, deluge the senate! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
10X 3,278 Posted December 16, 2022 10 hours ago, Xtors said: Thanks for sending. I finally received this alert via email! I hit every senator earlier this week and cc'd Scutari on every one per GFH's recommendation and I will hit them all again tonight or tomorrow. Please, everyone, deluge the senate! Done! It's easy and fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M1152 713 Posted December 16, 2022 11 hours ago, Xtors said: Thanks for sending. it gets better, it looks like you could get shit-faced and carry at the same time https://www.reddit.com/r/NJGuns/comments/zmudkt/s3214_major_error_we_can_carry_while_high_or/ carry on... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pjd832 146 Posted December 16, 2022 5 hours ago, M1152 said: it gets better, it looks like you could get shit-faced and carry at the same time https://www.reddit.com/r/NJGuns/comments/zmudkt/s3214_major_error_we_can_carry_while_high_or/ carry on... I’m confused….the non highlighted line between the highlighted ones ……Line 8&9 clearly says 8 “a. The holder of a permit to carry a handgun issued pursuant to 9 NJS.2C:58-4 shall not:” Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ShootersShooter 120 Posted December 16, 2022 Whenever I contact the Assembly or Senate on these issues along with my personal message, I remind them of these: NJ Constitution Paragraph 1 1. All persons are by nature free and independent, and have certain natural and unalienable rights, among which are those of enjoying and defending life and liberty, of acquiring, possessing, and protecting property, and of pursuing and obtaining safety and happiness. Oath of Office "I, ______ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully, impartially and justly perform all the duties of the office of _____ to the best of my ability, and that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of the State of New Jersey, and that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same and to the Governments established in the United States and in this State, under the authority of the people.” Oath covered by this : 41:3-1. False swearing, affirmation of declaration; perjury If any person shall willfully and corruptly swear, affirm or declare falsely, in or by any oath, affirmation, declaration or affidavit, required to be made or taken by any statute of this state, or necessary or proper to be made, taken or used in any court of this state, or for any lawful purpose whatever, such person shall be deemed guilty of perjury and punished accordingly. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M1152 713 Posted December 16, 2022 1 hour ago, pjd832 said: I’m confused….the non highlighted line between the highlighted ones ……Line 8&9 clearly says I am too, the bill is just one big cluster fuck and we shouldn’t even be having this discussion after the Supreme Court has weighed in on it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pjd832 146 Posted December 16, 2022 1 hour ago, M1152 said: I am too, the bill is just one big cluster fuck and we shouldn’t even be having this discussion after the Supreme Court has weighed in on it. It’s clear as day to me what is stated in the posted link…I meant I’m confused why the person in the link posted is inferring that you can drink/be under the influence of alcohol or drugs while carrying and highlighted the parts above and below the pertinent line … and the person posting the link agreed with the notion… hopefully it was humor/sarcasm that I’m missing, otherwise if that’s the reading compression of some future permit holders they unfortunately may be finding themselves on the wrong side of the steel doors Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mr.Stu 1,884 Posted December 16, 2022 4 hours ago, pjd832 said: I’m confused….the non highlighted line between the highlighted ones ……Line 8&9 clearly says 8 “a. The holder of a permit to carry a handgun issued pursuant to 9 NJS.2C:58-4 shall not:” 3 hours ago, M1152 said: I am too, the bill is just one big cluster fuck and we shouldn’t even be having this discussion after the Supreme Court has weighed in on it. 1 hour ago, pjd832 said: It’s clear as day to me what is stated in the posted link…I meant I’m confused why the person in the link posted is inferring that you can drink/be under the influence of alcohol or drugs while carrying and highlighted the parts above and below the pertinent line … and the person posting the link agreed with the notion… hopefully it was humor/sarcasm that I’m missing, otherwise if that’s the reading compression of some future permit holders they unfortunately may be finding themselves on the wrong side of the steel doors The bill does say "shall not". However, it also says the section that says it, will not come into effect for 7 months. So for 7 months the dimwits in Trenton are fine with drunk people with guns. It probably won't stop it passing, but it does make it even more clear that they have no clue what they are passing. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted December 16, 2022 34 minutes ago, Mr.Stu said: ...they have no clue what they are passing. This, folks. Every time. Just like why we can't pump our own gas. "THEY" HAVE NO CLUE!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,652 Posted December 16, 2022 8 minutes ago, CMJeepster said: This, folks. Every time. Just like why we can't pump our own gas. "THEY" HAVE NO CLUE!!! But ‘they’ know what’s good for you. More than you do… 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M1152 713 Posted December 16, 2022 54 minutes ago, Mr.Stu said: The bill does say "shall not". However, it also says the section that says it, will not come into effect for 7 months. So for 7 months the dimwits in Trenton are fine with drunk people with guns. It probably won't stop it passing, but it does make it even more clear that they have no clue what they are passing. you broke the code Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted December 16, 2022 11 minutes ago, Displaced Texan said: But ‘they’ know what’s good for you. More than you do… "They" can kiss my ass!!! 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DAHL 58 Posted December 16, 2022 6 hours ago, CMJeepster said: "They" can kiss my ass!!! Do your part. Write all the senators and email and let them know that you expect them to vote no as to the gross unconstitutionally of S3214. Be polite but hit all the senate addresses listed here. https://www.anjrpc.org/page/MONDAYCarryKillerBillMovesToFullSenate email address page: https://www.anjrpc.org/page/NJSenate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Moutinas 59 Posted December 16, 2022 17 minutes ago, DAHL said: Do your part. Write all the senators and email and let them know that you expect them to vote no as to the gross unconstitutionally of S3214. Be polite but hit all the senate addresses listed here. https://www.anjrpc.org/page/MONDAYCarryKillerBillMovesToFullSenate email address page: https://www.anjrpc.org/page/NJSenate I emailed all the senators, also included some links for reference: A yes vote would fail your law school final exam if you had to used NYSRPA v. Bruen to answer the question “is A4769 / S3214 constitutional and why.” https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/21pdf/20-843_7j80.pdf An excellent article you may want to read spells out how many gun control laws cannot survive today in light of historical analogs. https://reason.com/volokh/2022/12/16/analogical-reasoning-and-the-second-amendment/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DirtyDigz 1,793 Posted December 19, 2022 Senate session scheduled to start at 3:00 this afternoon. A4769 is on the docket, as expected. https://www.njleg.state.nj.us/live-proceedings/2022-12-19-15:00:00/S/Session 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,652 Posted December 19, 2022 Call their offices. Email them. Hit them HARD. Now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites