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hi guys

 

i'm new to the forum and shooting as a serious hobby. i'm waiting for my FID and doing research into what i should buy when i finally get the FID. i shot my first shotgun and my first clay on saturday and now i'm hooked. :D i'm looking for a decent over under but i don't have $1500 to drop. i found this one online and was wondering if it's worth it. i read on here that if it's not expensive it's not worth it.

 

let me know what you think.

 

http://www.tacticalgunarmory.com/Mossbe ... s75410.htm

 

TIA

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There's been a lot of discussions here lately about guns and stuff for clay sports. The general consensus is that the gun you shoot well is the gun to get into the sport with. Dedicated trap guns are a specialty item, and may or may not be something to look at later on, but probably not necessary at an entry level.

 

Here are a couple of the recent threads.

 

http://www.njgunforums.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=6306

http://www.njgunforums.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=6564

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Buy within your budget. A friend is heavily into "trap" and has invested over $30K in one shotgun. :o

 

K80? Those are beautiful guns, way out of my price range but...

 

If you're looking to shoot trap and shoot alot, buy a dedicated trap gun. (Unless you're shooting skeet or sporting clays? I really need to try Sporting Clays. I didn't see which in your post) I learned trap on a cheap single shot break open gun that was lent to me. I also separated a rib head from the back of my spine because I didn't have the gun shouldered quite correctly (because I was in a rush at the time for who knows what reason) and I was shooting loads that were a little bit too heavy for that crappy light gun and it kicked me... hard.

 

The gun should have some weight to it to ddeaden recoil and should fit you properly. Borrowing a gun to go hunting that doesn't quite fit you isn't reeally a big deal if you're firing it once. If you're putting 50, 100, 200 shells through the gun in an afternoon, you're going to find out real quick that the gun is a bitch to shoot if it's too light or it doesn't fit you well. Especially if it's hitting you in the face which is common with an ill fitting stock.

 

I have a Charles Daly o/u w/32" barrels and while not a Krieghoff it's a decent gun and fits me perfectly that I managed to pick up used. Many people I know buy a gun and need to have the stock fitted, I was fortunate enough to pick that gun up and it was basically made for me. I have put many thousands of shells through that gun shooting trap and it's pleasure to shoot. I have also put 2 rounds through it shooting turkeys. (2 different turkey, see the hunting thread if you're interested). Keep that in mind when you go looking for a shotgun, you don't want to pay additional money to have it adjusted if you can avoid it.

 

This mossberg looks nice, it doesn't say if the gun extracts/ejects or is adjustable? If it ejects only, shells shooting over your shoulder when you crack open the gun is not a huge deal, but is sort of a PITA when you're on the line.

 

Good luck.

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Stoeger?

 

Don't let the Fudd's mislead you entirely. Although expensive guns are nice and they are designed for trap or skeet, someone can shoot just as well with a $80 single shot break open gun.

 

It's up to the shooter mostly.

 

What's a Fudd?

 

i was looking at a stoeger too. i def want a gun for shooting clays only so maybe i'll pick up one of these. is there a shop in northern jersey that sells mossberg and stoeger for a reasonable price?

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Stoeger?

 

Don't let the Fudd's mislead you entirely. Although expensive guns are nice and they are designed for trap or skeet, someone can shoot just as well with a $80 single shot break open gun.

 

It's up to the shooter mostly.

 

What's a Fudd?

 

i was looking at a stoeger too. i def want a gun for shooting clays only so maybe i'll pick up one of these. is there a shop in northern jersey that sells mossberg and stoeger for a reasonable price?

A Fudd is a generally derogatory term for someone whose sole interest in firearms is shotgun sports. They don't really give a whit about gun laws, since only the most onerous laws would have any effect on them, and they usually look down on those who bring any attention to firearms legislation because it's so much easier not to make waves, and possibly put their particular hobby under the scrutiny of the state.

 

Dick's has Mossbergs, Stoegers, and a couple of other O/U guns available at good prices.

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Stoeger?

 

Don't let the Fudd's mislead you entirely. Although expensive guns are nice and they are designed for trap or skeet, someone can shoot just as well with a $80 single shot break open gun.

 

It's up to the shooter mostly.

 

What's a Fudd?

 

i was looking at a stoeger too. i def want a gun for shooting clays only so maybe i'll pick up one of these. is there a shop in northern jersey that sells mossberg and stoeger for a reasonable price?

A Fudd is a generally derogatory term for someone whose sole interest in firearms is shotgun sports. They don't really give a whit about gun laws, since only the most onerous laws would have any effect on them, and they usually look down on those who bring any attention to firearms legislation because it's so much easier not to make waves, and possibly put their particular hobby under the scrutiny of the state.

 

Dick's has Mossbergs, Stoegers, and a couple of other O/U guns available at good prices.

 

 

:text-+1: For Stoeger and Dick's (Sporting Goods that is!)

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Buy within your budget. A friend is heavily into "trap" and has invested over $30K in one shotgun. :o

 

K80? Those are beautiful guns, way out of my price range but...

Yup. Krieghoff K-80

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Pardon my ignorance, but what is the reason for over / unders being so expensive?

Any advance technical features not typical on a firearm or a long gun? Space age engineering?

 

I don't mean to make a joke, but I'm really clueless.. :think:

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Pardon my ignorance, but what is the reason for over / unders being so expensive?

Any advance technical features not typical on a firearm or a long gun? Space age engineering?

 

I don't mean to make a joke, but I'm really clueless.. :think:

 

 

i'd wouldn't mind knowing that either

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Pardon my ignorance, but what is the reason for over / unders being so expensive?

Any advance technical features not typical on a firearm or a long gun? Space age engineering?

 

I don't mean to make a joke, but I'm really clueless.. :think:

 

1) you could google that question and find a myriad of answers

 

2) Typically, they're built for Fudds who demand a certain level of quality, engraving, furniture, fit and finish, etc and a certain amount of bragging rights where the size of their hoohah is inversely proportional to the amount of money spent on the gun ;)

 

3) There's also the difficulty of machining two barrels to get to one point of aim, the dual lock work, dual safeties, etc.

 

4) Generally, they are really nice looking guns and are not "utilitarian" (unlike my firearms)

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2) Typically, they're built for Fudds who demand a certain level of quality, engraving, furniture, fit and finish, etc and a certain amount of bragging rights where the size of their hoohah is inversely proportional to the amount of money spent on the gun ;)

 

 

reminds me of the people who spend $800+ on a red dot sight.

 

i get the feeling the gun makers found a niche market filled with people willing to waste rediculous amounts of money on a certain product. theres nothing a $10K+ over under can do that a pump or automatic with a good shooter cant do.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dol3VyagEtU

 

here hes shooting his own ejected shells

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It's all a matter of what you want out of the gun. My mossberg 590 is a nice gun and it takes up to 3" shells, but it's nothing like my O/U. I'm a firm believer that it's more about skill than equipment but if you shoot well and have the money, the fit and finish on an O/U is excellent. Why buy a tricked out Kimber over a RI 1911? Sure they perform the same basic function but they are not the same. My gun will extract or eject and it's adjustable for each barrel. So if I was out wingshooting I'd probably want it to eject so I could drop 2 more shells in real quick. When you're shooting trap, the shells ejecting is annoying, so I set them to extract and they just pop up out of the chamber a half inch instead flying over my shoulder. Not a huge deal but when you shoot a lot it's a convenience. Just like auto day/night mirrors or heated seats in your car. (of which I have neither by the way) :)

 

The engraving is definitely a big factor, especially on high end guns. The difference in a $15K K80 vs a $30K+ K80 is really just the engraving. I have to say though that everyone I know who shoots a K80 thinks they are incredible, very well made guns. When the local range was still open here, there used to be a regular crowd who would be there every week and there were a couple of K80's there. Of course one guy was a Dr and one a Lawyer but they were there every Saturday and some sundays unless it was pouring. When you shoot 5-10K shells through the gun a year and spend that much time on something, the gun needs to fit well and perform flawlessly, why not spend the money on something you enjoy if you have it?

 

Check the web for shotgun engravings, its a dying art and all done by hand. Truely incredible work.

[attachment=0]1000235255.jpg[/attachment]

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the o/u has the advantage of status on the field.pros are choke versatility,reliabilty to fire,use of reloads,ease of maintience.as far as cleaning unhook the forend ,open the action,dismount the barrels run a bore snake through with wd 40.light lube on ejector/extractor arms and the barrel hinge and your done.resale value is another factor .they hold there value. you dont have to pick up empty hulls.im not a fudd,i just enjoy the sporting clays game.i love my handguns also. rember the gun is about 10% its all about leading the target,swinging the shotgun,and wathching the bird not the bead on the shotgun.you can shoot what u have,buy a semi auto rem 1100 with the remchoke system.they have been using them forever on trap and skeet fields.at the end of the day it all comes down to want verse need.good luck on your purchase.and shoot safe

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the o/u has the advantage of status on the field.pros are choke versatility,reliabilty to fire,use of reloads,ease of maintience.as far as cleaning unhook the forend ,open the action,dismount the barrels run a bore snake through with wd 40.light lube on ejector/extractor arms and the barrel hinge and your done.resale value is another factor .they hold there value. you dont have to pick up empty hulls.im not a fudd,i just enjoy the sporting clays game.i love my handguns also. rember the gun is about 10% its all about leading the target,swinging the shotgun,and wathching the bird not the bead on the shotgun.you can shoot what u have,buy a semi auto rem 1100 with the remchoke system.they have been using them forever on trap and skeet fields.at the end of the day it all comes down to want verse need.good luck on your purchase.and shoot safe

 

 

my uncle is selling me and older winchester semi with an adjustible choke(i think it's a model 50) for really cheap. i'll probably start with that but there is just something about o/u's that i love. i have to have one even tho it won't be 3k browning. still not sure what to got with tho. the mossberg silver or the stoeger condor?

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With the exception of the Super X1 the Model 50 is the finest semi-auto shotgun made by Winchester. It's built on a steel frame, extremely strong action, simple to disassemble and clean.good luck and enjoy it .

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I have a Super X1 and really like it. I was getting soft hits last time I had it out. I should probably give it a good cleaning and try again. It hasn't been getting any love lately since I've been focusing on improving with the Stoeger. Even Godzilla has been fairly idle lately.

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that might be the coolest engraving i've ever seen. i understand your point tho. thanks

 

you never said what your o/u is. got pics?

 

I bought a Charles Daly O/U with 32" Miroku barrels. I need to clean the gun tonight anyway, so I'll have to snap a few pics and post them later.

 

If you get a chance you should stop by Griffin and Howe in Bernardsville. They sell very high end guns. I bought my O/U there (used) about 8-9 years ago. The place is ridiculously expensive but if you want to see some really neat guns it's worth stopping in. When i was there they had a lever action rifle on display built in (I believe) the 1870's with an octagonal barrel. Too cool. They have cool things like double barreled shotguns with a rifle barrel underneath (for Safari hunting) and I believe they have their own line of firearms. They will be able to tell you what you are looking for as far as LOP and how the shotgun should fit you so that alone could make the trip worth it. It's not a place you're probably going to buy much from (I felt that their normal clientelle are probably English Lords going on Safari and in fact that's basically how they started their business) but it is a cool place that I think everyone should check out at some point.

 

Good Luck!

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G&H is the go-to place for the guys who shoot at Hudson Farm.

 

http://www.hudsonfarmnj.com/

 

I need to meet someone who shoots there. I'd love to see that place in action.

 

One of my congregants is an instructor at G&H. I shall have to see if I can get him to come to a CR outing.

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Pardon my ignorance, but what is the reason for over / unders being so expensive?

Any advance technical features not typical on a firearm or a long gun? Space age engineering?

 

I don't mean to make a joke, but I'm really clueless.. :think:

 

1) you could google that question and find a myriad of answers

 

2) Typically, they're built for Fudds who demand a certain level of quality, engraving, furniture, fit and finish, etc and a certain amount of bragging rights where the size of their hoohah is inversely proportional to the amount of money spent on the gun ;)

 

3) There's also the difficulty of machining two barrels to get to one point of aim, the dual lock work, dual safeties, etc.

 

4) Generally, they are really nice looking guns and are not "utilitarian" (unlike my firearms)

 

1.) A Mossberg will literally fall apart if shot to the level of $5000+ competition O/U.

 

2.) If a trigger spring breaks in a Mossberg you can go home. If it breaks in a Perazzi, you drop the trigger, replace the spring, and call for the next bird.

 

3.) If you spend $500 on a Mossberg you can sell it for $250 after putting 500 rounds through it. If you buy a $8,000 Perazzi, you can sell it for $7,500 after putting 50,000 rounds through it.

 

4.) Competition shooters travel the globe to participate in events. When you pull the trigger it HAS to go BANG!

 

I've owned a lot of shotguns. Most fall into the sub $1000 range and all have a place. My favorite upland gun is a 20ga Beretta 301 my Dad bought me when I was a kid. Would I trade that for a Perazzi? Not on your life :)

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1.) A Mossberg will literally fall apart if shot to the level of $5000+ competition O/U.

 

2.) If a trigger spring breaks in a Mossberg you can go home. If it breaks in a Perazzi, you drop the trigger, replace the spring, and call for the next bird.

 

3.) If you spend $500 on a Mossberg you can sell it for $250 after putting 500 rounds through it. If you buy a $8,000 Perazzi, you can sell it for $7,500 after putting 50,000 rounds through it.

 

4.) Competition shooters travel the globe to participate in events. When you pull the trigger it HAS to go BANG!

 

I've owned a lot of shotguns. Most fall into the sub $1000 range and all have a place. My favorite upland gun is a 20ga Beretta 301 my Dad bought me when I was a kid. Would I trade that for a Perazzi? Not on your life :)

 

 

that's depressing. :cry: makes me almost not want an o/u that's less than $5k. i think i'll still get one because i highly doubt i'll put enough shots thru it that i'll have to worry for a few years.

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If I were buying a low cost O/U I would look for a used Browning Citori. They are work horses that can be rebuilt and serviced by almost any gunsmith. They can be had for under $1000 . They are the same as Miroku if you can find them.

 

+1 for the Browning Citori.

I have one in 20 gauge my father gave me as a gift years ago.

It's not too fancy, it's a field grade, but it is by far one of the nicest shotguns made for the price.

I used to shoot skeet with it, and hunt quail with it back when I lived in Texas, and it is perfectly suited for that duty. It's also very 'pretty'....

I'm not normally into 'pretty' firearms, (I'm a Glock/AR-15 guy), but it is lovely, well balanced, and gorgeous fit and finish.

If you can find a used one, you would do well to pick it up. Again, for the money, you would be hard pressed to find a better o/u shotgun.

 

I hope you find what you are looking for.

 

Jeff

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