SAF v NJ (MULLER et al v. MAENZA et al)

[intercooler 41]

ryan_j, on 17 Oct 2013 - 10:41 AM, said:

I know it must be nice to be a naysayer but how about giving us a real solution? 

it just isn't...the solution is to move. I am not agreeing with it, just being a realist. 

[intercooler 41]

ryan_j, on 17 Oct 2013 - 11:17 AM, said:

Take out the big cities, NJ is more conservative than you think, just not on certain social issues. 

 

yep...unfortunately....the big cities are what rule this state. So now you know what it means to be discriminated against.

[ryan_j 0]

yep...unfortunately....the big cities are what rule this state. So now you know what it means to be discriminated against.

It really depends. It's not an absolute. Look, Vermont is a deep blue state but strong on gun rights...

[ryan_j 0]

it just isn't...the solution is to move. I am not agreeing with it, just being a realist.

Reality is once they're done with NJ they are going to try it nationally. Where do you think Diane Feinstein gets her wacky ideas from?

[Fawkesguy 57]

Is there any rule that requires them to explain why they refuse to hear a case?

 

No.

[kwadz 11]

Reality is once they're done with NJ they are going to try it nationally. Where do you think Diane Feinstein gets her wacky ideas from?

 

[begin rant]

 

That is exactly why we need to stay here and fight this fight.  I consider it our patriotic duty to protect the United States from these radicals who threaten our Constitution.  If we all bail and leave to freer ground, NJ will be completely ruined (worse than it is) and all of the anti-gun money and efforts will move to PA and other currently free states.  They'll tackle one state at a time as the formerly free residents flee for greener grass.  Then they'll keep moving on, like a steamroller.  While is sucks for us, we are literally protecting the rest of the country by putting up the damn best fight we can and giving them the hardest time we can when they try to pass these things.  Should Lonegan have not run?  Should we have let Booker save his $12 million and walk right into the office?  No way.  We keep the pressure on them at all times, even if we don't win the majority of battles.  If we push hard enough, their victories will start to be Pyrrhic since they'll have to spend so much money and effort on winning.  We are all volunteers - we do this for our families, state, and country - and we do not tire.  The other side fights with resources, so let them keep spending themselves into exhaustion.  Did we handily defeat the British in the Revolutionary War?  No - they grew tired of dealing with our resistance and gave up.  Let THEM grow tired of fighting us.  We should NEVER grow tired of fighting them.

 

[end rant]

[PDM 91]

kwadz -- I've got to say, that was a pretty good rant.  Look around the country -- there's pressure on in almost every state.  New Hampshire, Colorado obviously, I'm sure we'll see Florida hit with some gun control proposals soon.  Very good points.

[ryan_j 0]

Is there any rule that requires them to explain why they refuse to hear a case?

 

They usually hear the cases because there is a circuit split. That is the determining factor. With the right to carry cases there hasn't really been a strong circuit split, but that could change with the Hawaii case. 

 

And no, I don't think it's fatigue about gun rights issues or anything of the sort. If the 4th circuit had struck down G&S in Maryland but the 3rd had upheld justifiable need in NJ, I am 99% sure that one of the cases would have been granted cert.  So far the closest we have to a circuit split is that the 7th struck down Illinois's complete ban on carry, which is not really a split. 

 

So we have to get a real split then this could force the issue into SCOTUS. Baker (Hawaii) in the 9th has the best chance of doing so. 

[n4p226r 105]

What's the status with the Hawaii case. I haven't followed that one

[ryan_j 0]

Here's the original complaint.

 

http://www.hawaiidefensefoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/CV11-00513SOM-RLP.pdf

 

Hawaii is actually similar to NJ but much stricter. In fact if you get a CCW in one county it won't be good in another. 

[ryan_j 0]

Here's the full docket.

 

http://ia600709.us.archive.org/0/items/gov.uscourts.hid.98653/gov.uscourts.hid.98653.docket.html

[HuntingPaper 62]

[begin rant]

 

That is exactly why we need to stay here and fight this fight. I consider it our patriotic duty to protect the United States from these radicals who threaten our Constitution. If we all bail and leave to freer ground, NJ will be completely ruined (worse than it is) and all of the anti-gun money and efforts will move to PA and other currently free states. They'll tackle one state at a time as the formerly free residents flee for greener grass. Then they'll keep moving on, like a steamroller. While is sucks for us, we are literally protecting the rest of the country by putting up the damn best fight we can and giving them the hardest time we can when they try to pass these things. Should Lonegan have not run? Should we have let Booker save his $12 million and walk right into the office? No way. We keep the pressure on them at all times, even if we don't win the majority of battles. If we push hard enough, their victories will start to be Pyrrhic since they'll have to spend so much money and effort on winning. We are all volunteers - we do this for our families, state, and country - and we do not tire. The other side fights with resources, so let them keep spending themselves into exhaustion. Did we handily defeat the British in the Revolutionary War? No - they grew tired of dealing with our resistance and gave up. Let THEM grow tired of fighting us. We should NEVER grow tired of fighting them.

 

[end rant]

This sound good!

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

After reading the entire Hawaii case, I hope the courts pound Hawaii back into the ocean for the shite they're pulling.

It's even worse than here in the PRNJ

 

Any wonder this is O's 'home' state??

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Reality is once they're done with NJ they are going to try it nationally. Where do you think Diane Feinstein gets her wacky ideas from?

 

I think there may be more to Sen. Feinstein than meets the eye. Recall that she was the San Francisco "President of the Bd. of Supervisors" and had to go before the S.F. media one evening and tell them (and the world) that its mayor (George Moscone)  and a fellow supervisor (Harvey Milk) had just been assassinated by a former supervisor (Dan White). I watched that press conference live (it was the first time I'd ever seen her), and repeated endlessly (at the time) by the MSM, as events like Newtown and Aurora were. The reaction from the press was enough to "shell shock" the strongest of people.

 

I think there might be some direct "personal motivation" to her anti-gun agenda.

[ryan_j 0]

I think there may be more to Sen. Feinstein than meets the eye. Recall that she was the San Francisco "President of the Bd. of Supervisors" and had to go before the S.F. media one evening and tell them (and the world) that it's mayor (George Moscone)  and a fellow supervisor (Harvey Milk) had just been assassinated by a former supervisor (Dan White). I watched that press conference live (it was the first time I'd ever seen her), and repeated endlessly (at the time) by the MSM, as events like Newtown and Aurora were. The reaction from the press was enough to "shell shock" the strongest of people.

 

I think there might be some direct "personal motivation" to her anti-gun agenda.

 

Without a doubt. 

[n4p226r 105]

I think there may be more to Sen. Feinstein than meets the eye. Recall that she was the San Francisco "President of the Bd. of Supervisors" and had to go before the S.F. media one evening and tell them (and the world) that its mayor (George Moscone) and a fellow supervisor (Harvey Milk) had just been assassinated by a former supervisor (Dan White). I watched that press conference live (it was the first time I'd ever seen her), and repeated endlessly (at the time) by the MSM, as events like Newtown and Aurora were. The reaction from the press was enough to "shell shock" the strongest of people.

 

I think there might be some direct "personal motivation" to her anti-gun agenda.

Was that before or after she got her concealed carry permit?

[HBecwithFn7 296]

 

I think there may be more to Sen. Feinstein than meets the eye. Recall that she was the San Francisco "President of the Bd. of Supervisors" and had to go before the S.F. media one evening and tell them (and the world) that its mayor (George Moscone) and a fellow supervisor (Harvey Milk) had just been assassinated by a former supervisor (Dan White). I watched that press conference live (it was the first time I'd ever seen her), and repeated endlessly (at the time) by the MSM, as events like Newtown and Aurora were. The reaction from the press was enough to "shell shock" the strongest of people.

 

I think there might be some direct "personal motivation" to her anti-gun agenda.

Was that before or after she got her concealed carry permit?

 

The incident occurred on 11/27/1978. I'm not sure if/when Sen. Feinstein received a CCW.

 

Is that "public record" somewhere?

[David_p 0]

The incident occurred on 11/27/1978. I'm not sure if/when Sen. Feinstein received a CCW.

Is that "public record" somewhere?

Yes. A quick google search will give you a bunch of articles on it. It doesn't get much more public then her saying it in testimony/speech on the floor of congress.

 

She gave it up at some point apparently but she had one for personal protection. Her current stance (with her gov't protection) compared to her quotes back then make my head hurt.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Yes. A quick google search will give you a bunch of articles on it. It doesn't get much more public then her saying it in testimony/speech on the floor of congress.

 

Yup, that it did (Googling).   Apparently, she obtained it *after* the Moscone/Milk incident, and after the Pres. Reagan/Brady incident. It's starting to seem like she made an "executive exception" for herself...   And yes, having become a US Senator, she no longer needed it. Seems a tad hypocritical to me...

[Alex V 99]

So looks like it's all over... well.  Time to move...

[Pythagoras 2]

So looks like it's all over... well. Time to move...

?

[Pythagoras 2]

So looks like it's all over... well. Time to move...

?

[ryan_j 0]

Far from over.

[DeeVeeEight 0]

Pardon me for stating the obvious....

 

If this keeps going downhill the way it is only the cops and the criminals will have firearms. I know that we do not want to give up our firearms. Does this mean that we are all soon to be criminals? If we cave in and comply we will have no option other than to stay inside and live like sheep waiting for the slaughter. 

[ryan_j 0]

Pardon me for stating the obvious....

 

If this keeps going downhill the way it is only the cops and the criminals will have firearms. I know that we do not want to give up our firearms. Does this mean that we are all soon to be criminals? If we cave in and comply we will have no option other than to stay inside and live like sheep waiting for the slaughter. 

 

If enough of us are "criminals" do you think they can arrest and imprison all of us? There are 11 million illegal aliens in this country and it is estimated that there are at least 4x that number of gun owners. They keep saying they can't deport and arrest all of the illegals, do you really think they're going to come after gun owners?

 

I'm not saying commit a crime, all I'm saying is that it won't come to that. 

[illy 1]

If enough of us are "criminals" do you think they can arrest and imprison all of us? There are 11 million illegal aliens in this country and it is estimated that there are at least 4x that number of gun owners. They keep saying they can't deport and arrest all of the illegals, do you really think they're going to come after gun owners?

 

I'm not saying commit a crime, all I'm saying is that it won't come to that.

Thing is, this stuff happens one state (more or less) and one type of firearm/feature/right at a time such that most gun owners who can't move will just comply. And as the numbers dwindle, civil disobedience looks less and less desirable. The proverbial death by a million paper cuts.

[ryan_j 0]

SAF to DC district court, quit stalling!!!

 

http://saf.org/viewpr-new.asp?id=458

 

This is important because DC has an "outright ban" on carry and is the only remaining jurisdiction with such a ban. 

[ryan_j 0]

Looks like Gura filed to extend the deadline for petition for writ or certiorari and the extension has been granted. So we'll know in January 2014 whether or not they decide to hear this case. 

[Imaginos 0]

Edit: Never mind read more..

[n4p226r 105]

Looks like Gura filed to extend the deadline for petition for writ or certiorari and the extension has been granted. So we'll know in January 2014 whether or not they decide to hear this case. 

 

is there a specific date we should hear by or is it whenever they decide to announce it