Kimber to Wilson like Nissan to infinity?

[Parabellum 1]

Just a little curious,I have a couple 1911's. Nothing custom shop, Just a couple 800-900 SA's & S&W. Both wonderful guns but i been doing some research on two specific companies, Wilson Combat & Kimber. I'm in love with the look and feel of the Kimber custom convert 2. If you have ever seen one it has some beautiful curves and color scheme to it.

 

On the other hand, I am a firm believer in buy once cry once. And if i am going to spend $1500 on a kimber, do i want to go another 1k for custom hand fits by a ligament Smith...Most likely. But having never held or fired a Wilson all i have to base it off of is pictures and living vicariously through others experience's.

 

For $1300-$1500 you can get a Kimber Custom convert ll, Which is one of the most beautiful auto-loaders i have ever seen.

 

 

For $2000+ a Wilson Combat protector that you can trust your life with

I use my 1911 for basic bullseye & singlestack. Can't carry here so ill stick with the 5''

 

Any opinions or experience's?

 

Kimber to Wilson like Nissan to infinity? or tight competitors

 

 

Thanks

[bry@n 195]

I think you hit it right on the head. Kimber is to wilson/ baer/ ed brown as chevy to cadilac.

[1563621 388]

Years ago I had 4 Kimbers, I dumped them for Wilsons, Then I dumped the Wilsons for Nighthawks and Baers. I still have 2-Nighthawks, 2- Baers, and 14- Colts. When I visit the real US I carry a Baer Commanche 4". Buy a premier ll or go for a special forces. Great accuracy and less than a Wilson. JMHO.

[Parabellum 1]

Years ago I had 4 Kimbers, I dumped them for Wilsons, Then I dumped the Wilsons for Nighthawks and Baers. I still have 2-Nighthawks, 2- Baers, and 14- Colts. When I visit the real US I carry a Baer Commanche 4". Buy a premier ll or go for a special forces. Great accuracy and less than a Wilson. JMHO.

 

 

Ill have to look into this. Thanks to you & Bryan

[Parabellum 1]

chevy to cadilac.

 

 

Just kidding

[Parabellum 1]

Here we go

 

 

http://www.nelsontactical.com/products/ed-brown-special-forces-stainlessod-green-gen-iii-wambi-p-1528.html

[Ray Ray 3,566]

If you really want a high end 1911 then go for it. Although Smiths/Springfields/Kimbers make top notch stuff. All will run like champs, your just paying for a name after that.

[Mr.Shoot_It_All 13]

the difference in the car analogy is that they are literally the same company different trim. honda->acura ford->mercury->lincoln

 

unless its something new to me wilson and kimber are different companies

[jcerillo70 16]

Lots of YouTube videos on this

[hotshot 4]

any one see that beautiful volkmann on the a-n-a web site......now that's a beautiful 1911.....

[ronhonda 86]

Friends don't let friends buy Kimbers! (especially when they cost over $700)

[71ragtopgoat 23]

I would rate Kimber and wilson the same.Wilson's are maybe touch nicer as they are smithed but way over priced. I put Dan Wesson ,Baer,and Brown on the next step up.

Baers run good if you keep'em wet dont and they will give you fits.

I own and love my kimber it shoots way better then I do. But if I had the bucks to spare I would get a wesson .Only cause it's a darn good looker.

[Parabellum 1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBuCkTom1ns

[ronhonda 86]

I would rate Kimber and wilson the same.Wilson's are maybe touch nicer as they are smithed but way over priced. I put Dan Wesson ,Baer,and Brown on the next step up.

Baers run good if you keep'em wet dont and they will give you fits.

I own and love my kimber it shoots way better then I do. But if I had the bucks to spare I would get a wesson .Only cause it's a darn good looker.

 

Two of the funniest things I have seen in days!

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Kimbers w/ internal extractors are great shooters. Never let me down.

[lunker 274]

Two of the funniest things I have seen in days!

 

I thought it was only one of the funniest.

I bitched and moaned about the big price hike at Dan Wesson, but from what I have been reading elsewhere, the extra money is worth it. The new DW guns are much nicer than ones from the recent past (even though I owned and liked liked the older ones) and are stepping up into semi-custom territory. In the past they were a definite level below in fit and finish (although they always used premium small parts), but they were more than one step below in price, so there was good value to be had. From what I understand, CZ has been moving in this direction since they took over Dan Wesson from Bob Serva.

[Maksim 1,504]

Looking at the new catalog from CZ... the new Dan Wessons are supposed to be pretty nice... new IPSC guns there too.

[Parabellum 1]

Ed Brown Special Forces Stainless/OD Green Gen III

 

 

 

 

Kimber Custom covert ll

 

 

 

 

Found the Kimber covert look i was going for, in a Ed Brown. Thoughts...

[bry@n 195]

I would get the ed brown before the kimber. just my opinion.

[Parabellum 1]

I would get the ed brown before the kimber. just my opinion.

 

 

I shot him an email today. This OD is no longer on their order list, so i wanted to know if he could still make me one.(If i cant hold it, then i dont want one thats been in a warehouse for a year) Asked him for his info on re-producing this.

[bry@n 195]

They don't make them anymore. They make them in grey and black now.

 

PK90 has a black and tan special forces carry that is pretty sweet. You should go down and check it out. I am getting a EB soon enough and I went down to check it out and almost bought it.

[Parabellum 1]

They don't make them anymore. They make them in grey and black now.

 

PK90 has a black and tan special forces carry that is pretty sweet. You should go down and check it out. I am getting a EB soon enough and I went down to check it out and almost bought it.

 

 

Thanks bry, you've been a big help.

[lunker 274]

They don't make them anymore. They make them in grey and black now.

 

PK90 has a black and tan special forces carry that is pretty sweet. You should go down and check it out. I am getting a EB soon enough and I went down to check it out and almost bought it.

 

I wanted to look at the Ed Brown. It's not on the Arms-N-Ammo firearms page.

[Cylinder Head 22]

I would rate Kimber and wilson the same.

 

 

Having fired several 1911's including MIMbers and Wilsons, I'd say that Wilson 1911's are the TITS.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

 

Having fired several 1911's including MIMbers and Wilsons, I'd say that Wilson 1911's are the TITS.

 

I've disassembled my Kimber Custom, and I haven't noticed any MIM parts in it. Where is the evidence of this?

[Cylinder Head 22]

I've disassembled my Kimber Custom, and I haven't noticed any MIM parts in it. Where is the evidence of this?

 

Have Fun

 

Click the link and enjoy.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Have Fun

 

Click the link and enjoy.

 

Looks to me from those links that Kimber uses MIM parts in the same manner as most 1911 manufacturers do... SA, DW, etc. Not to mention the breadth and depth of the misinformation out there on the subject (aka MIM = bad).

 

There is a reason MIM has made it big in the firearms world, and it's not just because it's cheap. It's also easier to produce to a given tolerance to reduce the amount of machining and polishing (both are time and skill intensive processes). Is it worth the extra money to get hand-machined parts? Yeah, probably... maybe if you shoot 10,000+ rounds a year.

 

Now the question is: have MIM parts in any 1911 failed?

 

The argument here isn't so much if someone wants to spend, but to justify the cost of a brand/type of 1911. Would you spend $850 on a Taurus PT1911? Probably not... but a Kimber? Yeah.

[lunker 274]

Looks to me from those links that Kimber uses MIM parts in the same manner as most 1911 manufacturers do... SA, DW, etc. Not to mention the breadth and depth of the misinformation out there on the subject (aka MIM = bad).

 

There is a reason MIM has made it big in the firearms world, and it's not just because it's cheap. It's also easier to produce to a given tolerance to reduce the amount of machining and polishing (both are time and skill intensive processes). Is it worth the extra money to get hand-machined parts? Yeah, probably... maybe if you shoot 10,000+ rounds a year.

 

Now the question is: have MIM parts in any 1911 failed?

 

The argument here isn't so much if someone wants to spend, but to justify the cost of a brand/type of 1911. Would you spend $850 on a Taurus PT1911? Probably not... but a Kimber? Yeah.

 

You went from asking about MIM to staunchly defending it? The premium 1911 makers don't use any MIM parts in their guns. I know my Dan Wesson CBOB didn't have any either. Non premium Springfields do. Non premium Colts do too. The list goes on.

It's not often that changes made in the name of cost-cutting are superior to their more expensive predecessors.

[Cylinder Head 22]

It's not often that changes made in the name of cost-cutting are superior to their more expensive predecessors.

 

End of discussion right there.

 

DevsAdvocate, I'm not trying to be a jerk but sometimes the truth can cause a lot of butthurt, especially on the errornet. I'm sure you love your Kimber Custom, but you are sorely mistaken about the number of MIM parts in it. Taken from a thread specifically relating to the Custom, here is the list:

 

barrel bushing, hammer, sear, disconnector, grip safety, thumb safety, slide stop, extractor, ejector, plunger tube, mainspring housing,

 

I'll take hand-fitted, forged parts over Metal-Injection-Molded any day.

 

 

Have MIM Parts failed?? Taken from a thread where gunsmiths discuss MIM parts in 1911's (and the offending broken parts in a Kimber Custom were replaced with Wilson parts ).

 

I'll list the MIM parts that I've replaced because of part failure (parts that were cracked or broken) in 1911 guns and to be fair I'll only list parts that I've replaced three or more of.

 

MIM Slide Stops- All I've replaced because of failure had sheared the pin causing the gun to tie up. Before MIM the only slide stop I replaced because of breakage was a cast slide stop. Part of the locking lug broke causing the gun to not lock open when the last round was fired. However the gun could still be fired if the need be.

 

MIM Sears- I've seen failure on these in two different places. I've seen the nose or the ledge as some call it break causing the sear to fail to engage the hammer hooks. I've also seen cracks and breakage around the sear pin hole. Before MIM I can not recall ever replacing a sear that was cracked or broken.

 

MIM Slide Lock Safety (Thumb Safeties)- I've seen both single and the ambi fail because of breakage. I've seen the pins sheared and the tabs that operate the ambi side shear.

Before MIM I've never replaced a safety becuase of failure.

 

MIM Hammers- I've seen the hooks sheared off and the face of the hammers with cracks in them.

I've never replace a non MIM hammer because of part failure. However I have replaced a few with short hooks that some over zealous gun pro cut way to short.

 

MIM Extractors- the breakage I'v seen on these was at the Claw and the knuckle.

I've replaced two non MIM extractors because of breakage. In one of the guns the guy that owned it was dropping the slide on a round in the chamber. I don't know how many times he had done this, but to his best recollection it was several and he finally broke the claw on his extractor.

The other extractor was in a racegun that I was told had over 80,000 rounds fired thru it. The top corner of the claw was chipped off but the gun was still extracting.

 

MIM Disconnector- None had complete breaks just cracks in them. I've never replaced a non MIM disconnector from failure.

 

MIM Barrel Bushing- I've seen them cracked, the locking lug sheared off and the lower part of the bushing break.

I've replaced one cast barrel bushing that was cracked.In all fairness it was in one of the more least expensive 1911's offered today.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

You went from asking about MIM to staunchly defending it? The premium 1911 makers don't use any MIM parts in their guns. I know my Dan Wesson CBOB didn't have any either. Non premium Springfields do. Non premium Colts do too. The list goes on.

It's not often that changes made in the name of cost-cutting are superior to their more expensive predecessors.

 

Not so much defending it, but why is it considered to be such a detriment given the vacuum of evidence? I can see it from a price point perspective (why some 1911s cost $1200 or more, and others at different price points), but where is the performance angle?

 

The other issue here is: why is it such a big deal that Kimber uses MIM parts when SA and other makers use them as well? I always see that being thrown around as some reason to hate on Kimbers, but they're not the only ones who use them.

 

Also, your Dan Wesson probably has MIM parts in it as well...

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=199310