slide release or sling shot on a 1911

[Shane45 807]

Maks Maks Maks. The REAL gaming pros dont count their shots. They count their mikes!

 

On the topic of counting shots, its my opinion that this is a gungame only thing. If you are firing that many rounds you are likely in the very, very rare (for a civy) protracted gunfight. In the real world I dont think you will get to figure out in advance the number of shots you will fire or where you plan to reload. I cant fathom trying to keep a round count, communicate with team members, family members or use the radio or phone and scan for BG's all while keeping a round count in my head. Especially if Im hurt, a family member or team member is hurt or I just shot someone. I just think its unrealistic. I think that this is why most drills for defensive and offensive shooting center around slide lock reloads. If you get an opportunity for a reload with retention, great. I think those are the two more likely scenarios. Keeping a round count in a real gunfight to me is like trying to thread a needle while in a gunfight. The brain and body is simply not going to comply.

[dgstinner 11]

I prefer to slingshot/rack the slide instead of using the slide lock. Racking the slide will work with almost any semi-automatic pistol. I say 'almost' because my Ruger Mark III 22/45 can't be slingshot without being modified.

[GRIZ 3,369]

Its called a slide STOP for a reason. Some guns had them internally only, and could ONLY be slingshotted, ala' cz52/70

 

THANK YOU GLENN!

 

I get frustrated when someone uses it as a RELEASE when shooting one of my pistols.

 

I'm far from the firearms genius John Browning was but I figure if he put a knob on the end of it he intended it to be used as a release.

 

I have seen slide stops/releases worn on 1911s. I don't know how many rounds were through them. As I said in my previous post I haven't worn one out with over 30K rounds (sometimes using the release, sometimes slingshotting).

 

I use neither method with my Glock. I just slap the mag in. The inertia causes the slide to retract enough on its own to release from the lock and chamber the round.

 

I have seen this on new Glocks. Glock told me that some slide stops/releases are under spec and sent me a new one which would make the gun function normally. If the person was comfortable with it and the slide going forward was reliable as yours I'd let the individual shooter decide if they wanted to leave it that way. I don't see any harm in it and it does speed up your reload. I imagine its the same issue with other guns.

 

Never let the gun go dry, count your rounds.

 

Ideal situation but not real life.

 

If I was in a defensive shootout I won't be counting my rounds. I'm gonna shoot until empty and then reload. If your counting rounds during a gun battle then either you've been in many before or you where going in battle because your nuts.

 

Ray is 100% correct here. It used to be standard to tell people to count their rounds in training and it will carry over to the real world. It doesn't work in real life however. Even if you did count your rounds there are too many ways you'll get thrown off round count. If you're under cover in an extended battle then partial reloading a revolver or doing a magazine exchange with a semi auto does make sense. The agency I worked for taught that after you stopped the threat first ascertain if there is another threat, move to cover (ideally you'd already be there), and reload. Always reload before you move (the Army taught me this long ago). All of this minimizes the chance of shooting yourself dry. This will carry over to the real world.

 

Whatever your preference the fact is you have to train using both methods. Slingshotting is big motor skill as has been said but you need to practice with the release as well.

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Never let the gun go dry, count your rounds.

 

 

Perfect for Gun-games, in a real life SHTF scenario you will remember to reload after you pulled the trigger a few times and nothing happens.

 

Harry

[McClane 4]

Always slingshot, only because that teeny little button may be hard to get at under stress.

 

 

I've heard so many people say this and it's never made any sense to me. How is it any different form using the mag release under stress? If you can't hit the slide release under stress, I'd hate to see what happens when your gun runs dry and it's ready for a reload in the heat of the moment.

 

I always have and always will use the slide lock/release, whichever you'd like to call it. But... to each his own.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Under stress, you'll revert to how you trained. I hit the slide stop.

[Soju 153]

Slide stop. Slide release. Call it what you want but you are arguing semantics. You can find it called one or the other or both in various different manuals, documents, websites, and from different people. It functions as both.

 

Never letting the gun go dry is simply not realistic. And if you did, it still doesn't explain how you initially load, or how you release the slide when you are done shooting.

 

I use the slide release because it is quicker, and generally easier. However on my M&P compact, it is so small, and so difficult to manipulate (requires extensive force to get to release) that I use the overhand technique.

[bry@n 195]

I use the slide stop also.

[Caine 147]

I can barely count to 5, let alone remember how many of the 15 rounds in my gun I shot.

 

I user the overhand method. Only time it's an issue is on guns with a slide mounted safety.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Where's the USPSA guys? Seems Maks is taking the fight by himself.

 

OldSchool, your right on with your statement.

[LorenzoS 100]

Whoopsie double post

[LorenzoS 100]

I prefer the overhand method as illustrated in this clip from the Magpul pistol DVD. They recommend the same method for admin, tactical or emergency reloads. It may not be the fastest in all cases but it will always work consistently with any pistol. I think it's also more reliable under stress because it requires less precise placement of your hand.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUnLceBAw-U

[Shane45 807]

" it will always work consistently with any pistol." Thiis is not correct, especially for those that like to run shock buffs in their comander 1911's.

[Tosser 61]

" it will always work consistently with any pistol." Thiis is not correct, especially for those that like to run shock buffs in their comander 1911's.

 

Well anyone serious about self defense would not be using a 1911...

 

All joking aside I always use the overhand method. 100% of the time. Same muscle memory for anything on the pistol.

[Joelk 61]

" it will always work consistently with any pistol." Thiis is not correct, especially for those that like to run shock buffs in their comander 1911's.

Forgive my ignorance Shane, but why won't the overhand metod work with a 1911 with a shock buff?

 

I am yet to encounter a pistol it does not work on, which is why you have me curious.

[LorenzoS 100]

Ah, Shane is correct. A shock buff is a little plastic gadget that absorbs impact on the frame but slightly reduces the slide travel which can make the overhand method less reliable, especially on a commander length. These things also are known to break into pieces and jam the gun. It can reduce wear on the gun but at the expense of reliability.

 

Whatever your technique preference, I would never trust a gun for serious purposes unless it can reliably function using both methods.

[Joelk 61]

Ah, Shane is correct. A shock buff is a little plastic gadget that absorbs impact on the frame but slightly reduces the slide travel which can make the overhand method less reliable, especially on a commander length. These things also are known to break into pieces and jam the gun. It can reduce wear on the gun but at the expense of reliability.

 

Whatever your technique preference, I would never trust a gun for serious purposes unless it can reliably function using both methods.

Thanks Lorenzo.

 

As the shock buff limits slide travel does it also prevent manually locking the slide open on a commander length 1911 as well?

 

Also, does it truely prevent the overhand method from working, or just require more effort to overcome the resistance of the shock buff?

[Shane45 807]

It has been over 10 years since I ran a shock buff as I only ran one in my IPSC pistol. But I do know those that use them in all their 1911's. I never had one chew uo on me to the point of shredding in the pistol but I changed it out regulerly. I was running VERY hot 45 loads back then as I was one of the Dinosuars running a .45 still and the power factor was higher then so I was running around 1200fps . Anyway, the shockbuff would allow everything to function normally except slingshotting. I dont recall if I ever tried to muscle a slingshot to tell the truth. Did a quick search and found this link with more info.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=196845

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Well anyone serious about self defense would not be using a 1911...

 

Really? I do.

[Shane45 807]

I believe he was being tongue in cheek/sarcastic

[Joelk 61]

It has been over 10 years since I ran a shock buff as I only ran one in my IPSC pistol. But I do know those that use them in all their 1911's. I never had one chew uo on me to the point of shredding in the pistol but I changed it out regularly. I was running VERY hot 45 loads back then as I was one of the Dinosuars running a .45 still and the power factor was higher then so I was running around 1200fps . Anyway, the shockbuff would allow everything to function normally except slingshotting. I don't recall if I ever tried to muscle a slingshot to tell the truth. Did a quick search and found this link with more info.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=196845

Thanks for the info. I am still curious because it seems to me if you can lock the slide back then there is enough travel to release it with the overhand method. If anyone has a commander length 1911 with a buff would you please vigorously try the overhand method and let me know if it works.

 

I find all of this interesting as in training I regularly participate in malfunction drills involving setting up and fixing malfunctions on other people's guns, and I am yet (in 100s of different guns) to encounter any where the overhand method does not work.

 

I believe he was being tongue in cheek/sarcastic

I know Tosser was joking, but as in most good jokes a little kernel of truth makes it funnier

[Shane45 807]

Joel, they used to be all the rage but I suspect that they have fallen out of favor especially for the types of shooters you will find in your classes. Frankly I havent seen one in a long time. But again I have been out of IPSC for a long time too.

[efl15 0]

manipulate the slide.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jm4-R4hYy8

[Ray Ray 3,566]

I've been thinking about this and it seems that since I'm a south-paw and my trigger finger usually sits right below the slide STOP that it's what I use, but I tried the power stroke method and it felt weird. I guess I'll do both and learn both.

[Shane45 807]

Something for further consideration. There is a small risk associated with the overhand/powerstroke method particulerly for .40 shooters. there is the remote possibility of setting off a round while your hand is over the chamber. This happened to Todd Jarrett when he sent a .40 through his hand.

[Joelk 61]

Something for further consideration. There is a small risk associated with the overhand/powerstroke method particulerly for .40 shooters. there is the remote possibility of setting off a round while your hand is over the chamber. This happened to Todd Jarrett when he sent a .40 through his hand.

That is what can happen when the shooter is ejecting a live round and tries catch it in his support hand. If it bounces back into the chamber and the ejector hits the primer when the slide goes forward bad things can happen. The easy way to avoid that is to not try to catch the live round but let it fly.

 

Also if the gun is canted toward the ejetion port it makes sure a live round, or what happens much more often, an empty case in a failure to eject malfunction, doesn't fall back into the chamber.

[Shane45 807]

I supose it could happen that way although I havent heard of it occuring. I do believe in Todd's case he was clearing a jam.

[mipafox 438]

I prefer using the slide stop( the proper name), my thumb is already there and I am right into battery.

 

It is true that there is no slide release, there is a slide stop. It is not designed to chamber all pistols, although it often can.

 

"Sling shot" is not a good idea, either. Grab the slide from over the top when hands permit. Try to dissengage the slide stop if that is not possible, or use your belt on the sights if it needs to be racked and over the top is not an option.

[dgstinner 11]

Something for further consideration. There is a small risk associated with the overhand/powerstroke method particulerly for .40 shooters. there is the remote possibility of setting off a round while your hand is over the chamber. This happened to Todd Jarrett when he sent a .40 through his hand.

I wonder if this is why he grabs the slide from underneath the front of the gun to rack the slide.

[Tosser 61]

I wonder if this is why he grabs the slide from underneath the front of the gun to rack the slide.

 

That sounds like the least safe way to to rack the slide....