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Franklin Armory’s New AR-15 Is Neither A Pistol Nor A Rifle

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Hi All,

 

I'm new here and I was wondering about this. I just read N. J.A.C. Title 13 Chapter 54, and nowhere does it say that bump fire "stocks" are illegal. I also searched and couldn't find any "official public ruling" on the Slide Fire stock. Granted the Slide Fire people would not mail one to me here in The People's Republic of New Jersey. I asked one of the cops up at RTSP range here in Randolph, NJ if these things were legal. He told me the nobody knows as he had no knowledge of any specific challenges to the law here.

 

I'm thinking about contacting Evan Nappen's office (they say they're available for quick Q&A's via email). Will see what happens and report back.

 

Thanks.

 

not to be negative.. but that thing is nothing more than a gimmick.. the best way I have found to control a rifle (especially a full auto) rifle is basically the opposite of how you have to hold that thing to even work..

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Well, the NJSP trooper in the Firearms Division that does the store inspection says it's illegal, their conclusion came as to the stock has to be fixed therefore since the bump stock moves it becomes illegal.

 

Walt at Hackettstown G&A a NJSP Trooper and I were talking about the Slide Fire Solution at the store yesterday afternoon and the trooper verify what the NJ State Trooper from the Firearms Division had said.

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Hi All,

 

I'm new here and I was wondering about this. I just read N. J.A.C. Title 13 Chapter 54, and nowhere does it say that bump fire "stocks" are illegal. I also searched and couldn't find any "official public ruling" on the Slide Fire stock. Granted the Slide Fire people would not mail one to me here in The People's Republic of New Jersey. I asked one of the cops up at RTSP range here in Randolph, NJ if these things were legal. He told me the nobody knows as he had no knowledge of any specific challenges to the law here.

 

I'm thinking about contacting Evan Nappen's office (they say they're available for quick Q&A's via email). Will see what happens and report back.

 

Thanks.

the buffer tube moves in the stock body (the "Slide" part of the name) therefore it is "Collapsible" and unlawful under the Administrative code as an Evil Feature.

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I read the ATF letter, and while I am sure the manufacturer had it fully vetted by an attorney, I'm not seeing where it states this is not an SBR. It states that it does not meet the definition of a pistol or handgun and also that it is not an AOW - it does NOT specifically state that it is not an SBR.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

 

Would not it first have to be a rifle to then be an SBR, as SBR stands for short barreled RIFLE, correct? If it isn't a rifle, then it cannot be an SBR. At least that would make sense.

 

With that said, this is NJ, and absent of any clear instruction (and even sometimes when there is), it will be looked at as illegal unless you can prove statutorily that it is not. Of course this goes against basic logic and practice in most other places, but that is a different issue.

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Would not it first have to be a rifle to then be an SBR, as SBR stands for short barreled RIFLE, correct? If it isn't a rifle, then it cannot be an SBR. At least that would make sense.

 

 

no..

 

ar15 pistol (7in upper for arguments sake) + stock = SBR

 

that is actually how I plan to make my first SBR.. using a pistol AR .. and simply mating it to a lower with a stock..

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With that said, this is NJ, and absent of any clear instruction (and even sometimes when there is), it will be looked at as illegal unless you can prove statutorily that it is not. Of course this goes against basic logic and practice in most other places, but that is a different issue.

 

Hey Bonesinium,

 

That's what I was kinda trying to go by, ie, chapter and verse statute. I sent an email to Mr. Nappen. Hope he responds. Will post his answer if and when it arrives.

 

Thanks

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The NJ Attorney General's answer was "no".

 

"Why?"

"... Just No."

 

Is there a place where one can see the ruling? Don't get me wrong, I'm not doing the "Doubting Thomas" thing; I'll just sleep better want to see it in print.

Thanks.

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not to be negative.. but that thing is nothing more than a gimmick.. the best way I have found to control a rifle (especially a full auto) rifle is basically the opposite of how you have to hold that thing to even work..

 

How many rounds have you put on the Slidefire?

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How many rounds have you put on the Slidefire?

admittedly none..

but I have finally had range time with full auto AR series rifles.. and the manner in which I fired the rifle would not be conducive to the manner in which you shoot the slide fire.. so for me.. it is a waste.. maybe others are more comfortable holding the slide fire.. I dont know.. it just seems dumb to me..

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the buffer tube moves in the stock body (the "Slide" part of the name) therefore it is "Collapsible" and unlawful under the Administrative code as an Evil Feature.

 

Hi,

 

Not to single out "KpdPipes" or any one, but this is merely a follow-up.

 

I just got off the phone with Mr. Gary Needleman, attorney on retainer by the ANJRPC. He said that the State of NJ is still currently unaware of the Slide Fire stock, and that there is nothing in the statute that makes it illegal. He says that the stock is NOT collapsible, and since it can still be fired as a semi-auto, it is legal. This is similar to what the range officer at RTSP told me. The point Mr. Needleman made was that and there is nothing illegal about it. That's not to say it won't be in the FUTURE once they get wind of these things, but for now it is NOT illegal, according to the attorney for the AJNRPC.

 

I have an inquiry to the AG on this; I'm waiting for an answer. Will forward it to the list when i get it.

 

Cheers

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Hi,

 

Not to single out "KpdPipes" or any one, but this is merely a follow-up.

 

I just got off the phone with Mr. Gary Needleman, attorney on retainer by the ANJRPC. He said that the State of NJ is still currently unaware of the Slide Fire stock, and that there is nothing in the statute that makes it illegal. He says that the stock is NOT collapsible, and since it can still be fired as a semi-auto, it is legal. This is similar to what the range officer at RTSP told me. The point Mr. Needleman made was that and there is nothing illegal about it. That's not to say it won't be in the FUTURE once they get wind of these things, but for now it is NOT illegal, according to the attorney for the AJNRPC.

 

I have an inquiry to the AG on this; I'm waiting for an answer. Will forward it to the list when i get it.

 

Cheers

 

telescoping stock is illegal..

the stock moves forward and backwards on a tube collapsing on a tube.. as defined by telescoping..

 

don't worry I am sure you will get the answer you do not want..

 

attorney general,

 

I am a concerned NJ citizen, and I am inquiring about this rifle stock that is available. The concept of the stock is to allow full auto fire from a semi automatic gun. It does this in a clever way by bouncing the gun all over the place causing your finger to hit the trigger every time. This basically skirts the law because there is one trigger pull per fire..

can I legally own this in NJ?

 

sincerely,

john doe

 

 

if you watch the video the gun is really not controlled well since the operation involves more than a trigger pull of a stable rifle.. it uses the momentum of the gun to bounce it all over the place.. sometimes resulting in what looks like no fire when you expect it to fire.. and other times an extra round or two when you are not expecting one...

 

further what range is going to let you shoot this?

I have heard of many ranges going on red alert lock down from someone shooting normal semi too fast.. I can only imagine what this would trigger..

 

but hey it IS a free country.. and if NJ gives you the green light.. by all means go for it if you like.. I just totally do not understand this..

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admittedly none..

but I have finally had range time with full auto AR series rifles.. and the manner in which I fired the rifle would not be conducive to the manner in which you shoot the slide fire.. so for me.. it is a waste.. maybe others are more comfortable holding the slide fire.. I dont know.. it just seems dumb to me..

 

I know people with M16s who like the slidefire. Unfortunately, like you, I've never tried a slidefire.

 

It is good hear about your experience with finally getting some range time with full auto AR series rifles.

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Slide fire is 100% legal was talking to a close friend whom is a NJ state trooper and they had an demonstration on it and were able to fire it and the AG considered it to be legal, as of last sunday when we had this discussion with him so your GTG

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Haha, you just want to shoot it.

 

But seriously where the hell would I shoot it?

 

Bullethole gets all pissy if you do a few double taps, if I had a rifle that seemingly fired FA, they'd probably shit bricks and throw me out.

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Haha, you just want to shoot it.

 

But seriously where the hell would I shoot it?

 

Bullethole gets all pissy if you do a few double taps, if I had a rifle that seemingly fired FA, they'd probably shit bricks and throw me out.

 

Fired FA? It's basically a giant pistol. Send PK90 a PM, he would get one for you.

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