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vladtepes

Is *Insert any semi automatic shotgun* legal in NJ?

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Ray, I have personally seen victims of attempted suicide with birdshot walk themselves to an ambulance. We are talking contact distance to the face. Gruesome to be sure, but completely superficial.

I just had dinner with a friend who is retired NYPD cool guy. He has witnessed the same thing on multiple occasions. Accidental and purposeful shootings of self - at contact distances - with birdshot. Victims walks themselves to the Ambo. 

There just isn't enough mass in the shot to retain velocity and it leaves a nasty looking but shallow and superficial wound.

Why go with a maybe when you can have an almost certainly? I don't aspire to mediocrity.

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2 hours ago, Ray Ray said:

But if the distance is across the lawn, then those Federal Flight control wads in 00Buck OR Hornady 00Buck are TIGHT.

So you are conducting a select buck drill if you need to take a longer shot? That's retarded. Set the gun up right from the get go and take the shot you need to take. At room distances, in a 1st world home 00/#1 rules the roost.

You have a round (00/#1 B) that is a proven suitable FISHing at normal room distances and will arguably stop an aggressive attacker most times and you choose to use something less effective? Tell me how that mkes sense?

Shooting high brass? What are your split times vs 00 in a tactical low recoil load? Doesn't make sense bro.

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2 hours ago, High Exposure said:

So you are conducting a select buck drill if you need to take a longer shot? That's retarded. Set the gun up right from the get go and take the shot you need to take. At room distances, in a 1st world home 00/#1 rules the roost.

You have a round (00/#1 B) that is a proven suitable FISHing at normal room distances and will arguably stop an aggressive attacker most times and you choose to use something less effective? Tell me how that mkes sense?

Shooting high brass? What are your split times vs 00 in a tactical low recoil load? Doesn't make sense bro.

you know I'm not a shotgun in the house guy.. but mine is loaded with Polyshocks.. 

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8 hours ago, High Exposure said:

So you are conducting a select buck drill if you need to take a longer shot? That's retarded. Set the gun up right from the get go and take the shot you need to take. At room distances, in a 1st world home 00/#1 rules the roost.

You have a round (00/#1 B) that is a proven suitable FISHing at normal room distances and will arguably stop an aggressive attacker most times and you choose to use something less effective? Tell me how that mkes sense?

Shooting high brass? What are your split times vs 00 in a tactical low recoil load? Doesn't make sense bro.

I use a load appropriate to my residence, high brass BB shot.  That's it.  No 00, no #4, no slugs. 

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5 hours ago, vladtepes said:

you know I'm not a shotgun in the house guy.. but mine is loaded with Polyshocks.. 

No thanks. Maybe if I was doing VBSS work I would think about using it.

I find it interesting that they use gallons of water and not ballistic gelatin to demo their rounds...

Ah ha! Here's why, it does poorly in ballistic gelatin - the standard for testing the terminal ballistics of ammunition. From the highly respected DocGKR (Dr. Gary Roberts) ~ 2006 time frame:

 

We recently tested the 12 gauge 2 3/4” Polyshok “Law Enforcement, Urban Tactical, Impact Reactive SMART Projectile” containing 470 gr of very small spherical lead shot contained in “a low density polymer compound projectile body”. Despite some rather amusing claims by the manufacturer, the Polyshok ammunition offered some of the WORST terminal performance of any shotgun ammunition we have ever tested. It has inadequate penetration of only 7.9”, with terminal performance similar to bird shot. Ave vel = 973 f/s from a 14” Rem 870.


The product information provided by the Polyshok manufacturer was grossly inaccurate, misleading, and replete with hyperbole. BEWARE !

There is a reason they went out of business. There is a reason that so few  LEO Dept and Mil/Gov agencies issued it, and only for a short time period.

I also am not a fan of a shotgun for HD and prefer my AR, but the shotgun in my safe is loaded with Hornady TAP 8 pellet 00B while I look for Federal Flight control #1B, which is always sold out....

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On 5/24/2017 at 8:22 AM, HBecwithFn7 said:

 

Fair enough...   Looks like I'm buying some more 00 buck...

Don't just buy any 00B. Buy something designed to shoot people trying to kill you in your home, not deer in the woods.

Generally, "tactical" or LE rounds are a good choice for HD. Federal Flight Control stuff and Hornady TAP are amazing for keeping tight groups and reducing flyers at distance. 

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I told the story a few times on this forum here before. When I was 12 I was shot in the back (through a bush first) at a distance of less than 30 feet. He pellets that made it through my jacket barely broke my skin, in fact several pellets were in my socks because my skin stopped them and they fell down on the hike out. 

It dident incapacitate me and I was 12, imagine how ineffective it would be on someone trying to do you harm. 

I'm not a shotgun in the house guy either but my wife is not comfortable or accurate with handguns. She is most comfortable and accurate with my Mossy 500 Persuader loaded with TAP 00B, so that's her HD gun. 

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14 hours ago, High Exposure said:

Don't just buy any 00B. Buy something designed to shoot people trying to kill you in your home, not deer in the woods.

Generally, "tactical" or LE rounds are a good choice for HD. Federal Flight Control stuff and Hornady TAP are amazing for keeping tight groups and reducing flyers at distance. 

There is Federal Flight Control and Hornady TAP/Critical Defense, and then there is everything else.

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9 hours ago, SMOKIE901 said:

Is the MOSSBERG 590 Shockwave legal in NJ? 

https://www.mossberg.com/category/series/590-shockwave/

Just curious what you plan to do with it?  Most ranges won't let you shoot it, and I don't think they allow it in most training classes.  They look pretty cool, but are annoying to shoot.  Plus, you can use CQB techniques to shorten the effective length of a regular shotgun. So just keep it around for home defense?

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57 minutes ago, PK90 said:

I've been trying to restock any type of shockwave with no luck. Seems like any type of Tactical Shotguns are nonexistent.

Mossberg has Shockwaves on National B/O

9 hours ago, SMOKIE901 said:

Is it considered a hand gun where I need a permit or is it considered a rifle or shotgun?

Shock Waves are considered an "Other"  -they are not a Pistol, not a Shotgun, Not a long gun

They are transferred in NJ with a COE just like a shotgun would, but the 4470 is marked "Other"

 

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Didn't know where else to put this, and I'm hoping an ffl will chime in

Would this be legal to ship to nj

https://www.genesisarms.com/product-page/gen-12-upper-only

 

And, would this be able to be made nj compliant by adding a Thumbhole stock, or changing to one of those ca legal not a pistol grips and pinning the stock?

https://www.genesisarms.com/product-page/gen-12

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Mr.Forks said:

Didn't know where else to put this, and I'm hoping an ffl will chime in

Would this be legal to ship to nj

https://www.genesisarms.com/product-page/gen-12-upper-only

 

And, would this be able to be made nj compliant by adding a Thumbhole stock, or changing to one of those ca legal not a pistol grips and pinning the stock?

https://www.genesisarms.com/product-page/gen-12

 

 

Says right in the link that they wont ship to NJ

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7 hours ago, Mr.Forks said:

Didn't know where else to put this, and I'm hoping an ffl will chime in

Would this be legal to ship to nj

https://www.genesisarms.com/product-page/gen-12-upper-only

 

And, would this be able to be made nj compliant by adding a Thumbhole stock, or changing to one of those ca legal not a pistol grips and pinning the stock?

https://www.genesisarms.com/product-page/gen-12

 

 

It's not the upper that is not legal - it's the lower it's mounted to.

You cannot have a Pistol Grip on a Semi-Auto Shotgun in NJ, so the PG needs to be removed and a skeleton / thumbhole stock installed that has no seperate PG.

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8 hours ago, fishnut said:

Says right in the link that they wont ship to NJ

Yeah, that doesn't mean anything though, plenty of places wont ship to nj just because

I've been in contact with them and they won't ship because they dont understand nj gun laws, but are willing to ship after speaking to an ffl about the laws- I want to make sure before going any further that it would even be possible

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2 hours ago, Mr.Forks said:

Yeah, that doesn't mean anything though, plenty of places wont ship to nj just because

I've been in contact with them and they won't ship because they dont understand nj gun laws, but are willing to ship after speaking to an ffl about the laws- I want to make sure before going any further that it would even be possible

I wasent implying it was illegal because they wont ship it to NJ just pointing it out incase you had not seen it. 

As JT pointed out there is nothing illegal about the upper itself.

1500 bucks is allot of dough for an upper especially since your still limited your still limited to 6 rounds. That's my opinion though. 

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Is the Black Aces Tactical S Max NJ legal with the birds head grip on it?  Barrel is 18.5" but not sure what the OAL is with the birds head grip.  It's 39" with the stock.  Their Pro S with 14" barrel (non-nfa not a shotgun) is 26.5", so guessing it would be 31" OAL.  

Black Aces Tactical Black Aces Tactical Pro Series S Max 12Ga 18.5In Semi Auto Black | RTSP (rtsponline.com) $199

Pro S Max (Semiautomatic) – Black Aces Tactical

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8 hours ago, ESB said:

I thought a non-nfa has to never have had a stock on it?  It ships with the stock on.  

That applies to an A4 or any weapon with a short barrel (like a shockwave for example)

If it has a legal length barrel then it can be swapped

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