CAUTION: Rem UMC 115gr 300Blk packaged with live .223 rds

[Tactical Monkey 51]

Fellow 300Blk enthusiasts,

 

I went shooting on Saturday and found a live .223 round inside a box of Remington UMC 115gr 300 AAC Blackout. It was a new box, unopened, and I did not have a .223/5.56 rifle with me that day. For my own sanity, this prompted me to go through every box of Rem 115gr 300Blk that I have (32 boxes).

 

The lot number of the box with the .223 round was N16 VBI. The lot number can be found on the tab that folds inside the box, beneath the thumb cutout (see picture below). I purchased 17 boxes of Remington UMC 115gr from MidwayUSA on 5/21/12, all with that same lot number. Out of the small sample of boxes I purchased, I found 4 boxes that each had 1 live .223 round in the box. The rounds were head stamped "223 REM", and looked as though they came right off the production line.

 

.223 round

 

Headstamped 223 REM among 300 AAC BLACKOUT

 

 

Remington Lot # N16 VBI

 

Please be careful and check all your Remington UMC 115gr 300Blk just to be safe. I had 2 other lot numbers in my possession and all those boxes checked out. Be very thorough if your lot number is the one mentioned here, as with a small sample size of 17, I had a very high rate of failure.

 

Remington has been contacted about the issue.

 

Updating this thread 6/8/12:

 

Received 2 brand new boxes of ammo free of charge for the inconvenience straight from Remington's ammo plant. The rounds came after I spoke in-length with the Director of QC.

 

Thanks -

TM

[Tactical Turtle 11]

Good thing u caught it. Could of been very bad. Let us know.what remington says

[Sandy 44]

I have had more problems with Remington UMC. Light off center strikes on 3 of our guns , only with that ammo (guns have run flawlessly on Federal) , in 2 different calibers. Others told me they had the same issue. I stay away from it now.

[PK90 3,570]

Was this purchased over the counter? Maybe the dealer took a round out to compare with the 223Rem and mixed up the rounds when putting them back. If so, please call the dealer and advise them before the other guy finds the same.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Had one light strike with UMC 9mm 124gr Target Nickel.... Didn't try to re-shoot it - not sure if it would work or not.

[Tactical Monkey 51]

Answering your question Paul it was all purchased online, this particular batch from Midway.

 

The issue is up until recently not many manufactuer's put out 300 AAC Blackout ammo. And for plinking ammo (not subsonic, match, or defensive) the Remington UMC is basically the staple. It will be interesting to see what Remington comes back with. In the meantime I will try some PNW arms 147gr ammo for plinking.

[mcbethr 42]

Not to hijack the thread but I didn't even know they made 147 Grain 300 Blackout.

 

147 grain going 2,200 feet per second... wow.

[Tactical Monkey 51]

Update:

Remington has been very responsive in addressing this issue with me, and they are investigating it further. I will post any updates as they become available.

 

Thanks -

TM

[BigHayden 77]

I don't think firing a .223 from a .300 AAC rifle would do any damage. The bullet would bounce down the barrel and might only be accurate for a few inches, but it wouldn't blow up or do anything dangerous for the shooter.

[Shane45 807]

Yeah well it would be a problem if it allowed the rifle to be fired just out of battery!!!!

[BigHayden 77]

Depends on how the .300 AAC chamber indexes, I suppose. If it's off the case mouth, the .223 round might not even chamber. And I was pretty sure the AR won't fire unless the bolt is completely locked. Am I wrong about that?

[Qel Hoth 33]

I don't think firing a .223 from a .300 AAC rifle would do any damage. The bullet would bounce down the barrel and might only be accurate for a few inches, but it wouldn't blow up or do anything dangerous for the shooter.

 

If it's bouncing down the barrel though who knows what direction it will be going when it comes out. It may or may not impact the berm...

[Shane45 807]

I havent reviewed the drawing but based on the fact the rifle was able to drop the hammer, its close enough to make me uncomfortable for sure.

[BigHayden 77]

I havent reviewed the drawing but based on the fact the rifle was able to drop the hammer, its close enough to make me uncomfortable for sure.

 

The OP never chambered the .223 round in his .300 AAC. He just found the cartridge in the box of Blackouts. Nobody has said anything about a hammer actually dropping on the .223 round.

[Shane45 807]

BH no it was not said but did in fact occur. Since you were not there I am unsure how you can so emhatically state it did not. Since I assembled the OP's 300 black upper, I might have a little insight as to what went on

 

 

 

edited for clarity

[Anselmo 87]

Was the .223 in the same position in each box?

[BigHayden 77]

BH no it was not said but did in fact occur. Since you were not there I am unsure how you can so emhatically state it did not. Since I assembled the OP's 300 black upper, I might have a little insight as to what went on

 

I apologize for not having clairvoyance and my crystal ball is in the shop being repaired; this left me only the information I had been given which was that the OP found a .223 round in a box of .300 AAC, and did not include anything about your involvement with the OP and his rifle.

[Tactical Monkey 51]

Was the .223 in the same position in each box?

 

No, the rounds were in various slots throughout the boxes.

[Shane45 807]

Big Hayden, you dont need a chrystal ball to know you werent there. And having not been there I dont understand how you can state what did or didnt happen"The OP never chambered the .223 round in his .300 AAC". Im not sure why you are taking such an adversarial position but the fact of the matter is your comment "I don't think firing a .223 from a .300 AAC rifle would do any damage" could be interpreted as there is no danger in this. This would appear to be wrong. I have found information on 3 kabooms so far from 223 rounds making it into a 300 black. Apparently some rifles are able to push the 223 round back into the casing to make the turn to load in the chamber in a bullet setback(and probably very crooked in my estimation), compressed state.

[BigHayden 77]

Big Hayden, you dont need a chrystal ball to know you werent there.

 

No, but I do need one to know that you A) know the OP, B) assembled his upper, and C) know that he did chamber a round. The only information I had was what the OP said, which was simply that he found a .223 round in a box of .300. You have more information about that, that's great. From your first two posts, there was no way for me to know that you knew more. I thought that you misread something in the thread about him chambering a round, and when I went back and read the whole thing, I didn't see anything about chambering a round until your post. Like I said in that post, "Nobody has said anything about a hammer actually dropping on the .223 round."

 

And having not been there I dont understand how you can state what did or didnt happen"The OP never chambered the .223 round in his .300 AAC". Im not sure why you are taking such an adversarial position

 

Like I said. I was going off of what the OP said and had no idea that you know him and know what happened. Had you included all the information from your third post in your second post, we wouldn't be having this conversation because I would not have thought you were mistaken about the information.

 

your comment "I don't think firing a .223 from a .300 AAC rifle would do any damage" could be interpreted as there is no danger in this.

 

What part of "I don't think" are you interpreting to be an absolute statement? Prior to this latest post, I didn't think firing a .223 from a .300 AAC would be any different than firing a .357 SIG from a .40 pistol.

 

This would appear to be wrong.

 

Clearly.

 

I have found information on 3 kabooms so far from 223 rounds making it into a 300 black. Apparently some rifles are able to push the 223 round back into the casing to make the turn to load in the chamber in a bullet setback(and probably very crooked in my estimation), compressed state.

 

Now that you have educated me, I no longer think that. I know otherwise.

[Shane45 807]

OK. I can see how we got a little off track here, no biggie...

 

"What part of "I don't think" are you interpreting to be an absolute statement? Prior to this latest post, I didn't think firing a .223 from a .300 AAC would be any different than firing a .357 SIG from a .40 pistol."

 

I actually took your statement as academic and thought someone else may not understand that. Without actual annalysis I might agree with you. What I mean to say is if you hand loaded a round in to the chamber from the breach this may indeed be the case(357sig/40). I suspect, again without really looking at the drawings that it is the longer oal of the 5.56 making the turn into the chamber that causes the danger. This is purely speculative on my part.but the big difference I see between the two cartridges is the oal. So I suspect making the turn from mag to chamber is what actually causes the bullet set back by hitting the roof of the shorter chamber and subsequent pressure spike fireing a compressed damaged round.. Just a theory but I dont have a 300blk on hand to fiddle with at the moment.

[Shane45 807]

OK I took a quick look at the saami drawings. It looks to me, trying to keep all the call out numbers in my head and since I dont have photo shop on this lappie to make an overlay, that there is about .1 length where the 5.56 would need to swage in about .02 to make it in the chamber.

[BigHayden 77]

OK. I can see how we got a little off track here, no biggie...

 

 

Seriously good info you've posted. I'm interested in learning more about the .300, as it sounds like a promising cartridge. And i've got a couple of stripped lowers that I don't have any concrete plans for.

[Socom 19]

I don't think firing a .223 from a .300 AAC rifle would do any damage. The bullet would bounce down the barrel and might only be accurate for a few inches, but it wouldn't blow up or do anything dangerous for the shooter.

 

I agree it's almost like you can shoot .40sw in a 10 mm barrel

[Shane45 807]

The 300Blk is probably the first new comer cartridge that I actually believe is here to stay and will conitnue to gain popularity very quickly. Ive played with a number of them but adopted none(grendal, beowulf,6.8, 458. The 300Blk will be the first.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

The 300Blk is probably the first new comer cartridge that I actually believe is here to stay and will conitnue to gain popularity very quickly. Ive played with a number of them but adopted none(grendal, beowulf,6.8, 458. The 300Blk will be the first.

 

Why do you say that?

 

There are a bunch of *new* cartridges for the AR platform already. Including the ones you already mentioned. Why the 300AAC over the others?

[Shane45 807]

Because its so easy to support. There is really no penalty for shooting a 30 cal projo. Upper, lower, mags, bolt, bolt carrier, ALL the same as a standard ar. Only diff is the barrel. The mil and agencies are all over it becuase it doesnt give up performance out of short, short barrels like a 5.56 or 308 does. That and they just cant fix the MP5's any more. So to get a rifle cartridge in a package the same size as a subgun and so easily and $$$$ supported is a big win. Then thres the ammo. Ever price out 458 or 50 WHEN you can even find it available? YIKES!

[Tactical Turtle 11]

I got a lower sitting at home for a dedicated 300 black out gun.

[Tactical Monkey 51]

Updating this thread:

 

Received 2 brand new boxes of ammo free of charge for the inconvenience straight from Remington's ammo plant. The rounds came after I spoke in-length with the Director of QC.

 

Clearing up some other issues:

Yes, it chambered, and the bolt seated enough to get a click out of the trigger. The primer on the .223 round did not have a dimple however. The reason I did not include it in the original post is because I have this thread cross-posted on multiple forums and didn't want the "OMG you could of died/your retarded" being the majority of the replies. I wanted to keep it focused on the issue of .223 rounds mixed in with that lot number.

 

Since I don't mind thread jacking my own thread - 300Blk IMHO is the most promising cartridge to be released in the AR platform since .308. The benefits are many for the 300Blk, once you understand what the round can and cannot do.

[Shane45 807]

It only took me 8 months to convince you

 

Yet oddly I still dont have one