inmates go free

[RubberBullets 65]

drug use ends up ending in violent crimes alot, thus killing each other for the next fix..if they are going to relax incarceration for drug crimes they need to provide some other type of help to those people.

 

But there is a stark difference between marijuana and heroin/meth, which I believe what vlad is getting to. The latter drugs have a higher dependency probability, and it's effects have worse side effects. Marijuana's effects are more akin to the likes of alcohol. Personally I only favor the legalization of marijuana as it seems most other drugs of choice lead to the deterioration both physically and mentally of the user.

[vladtepes 1,060]

drug use ends up ending in violent crimes alot, thus killing each other for the next fix..if they are going to relax incarceration for drug crimes they need to provide some other type of help to those people.

 

alcohol ends in tons of motor vehicle accidents.. where people die... but no one wants to ban booze...

 

the problem with locking up drug abusers is when they get out they often end up back in the same situation.. only now with a criminal record... making a good life even less likely (getting a job with a criminal record can be difficult)

 

I would say that if drugs were decriminalized you could utilize some of that tax revenue to offer treatment...

 

I agree with you that drugs are a problem.. I have seen first hand many nightmares related to substance abuse... I just fail to understand the logic in locking people up that are ultimately only hurting themselves..

[tony357 386]

alcohol ends in tons of motor vehicle accidents.. where people die... but no one wants to ban booze...

 

the problem with locking up drug abusers is when they get out they often end up back in the same situation.. only now with a criminal record... making a good life even less likely (getting a job with a criminal record can be difficult)

 

I would say that if drugs were decriminalized you could utilize some of that tax revenue to offer treatment...

 

I agree with you that drugs are a problem.. I have seen first hand many nightmares related to substance abuse... I just fail to understand the logic in locking people up that are ultimately only hurting themselves..

 

i agree, but something else needs to be done to make the accountable.

[vladtepes 1,060]

i agree, but something else needs to be done to make the accountable.

 

accountable for what?

hurting themselves with drugs?

 

or do you mean committing crimes.. if crimes then YES.. but there are already laws on the books prohibiting murder.. theft.. etc.. drugs or no drugs is a moot point..

[MarkWVU02 47]

drug use ends up ending in violent crimes alot, thus killing each other for the next fix..if they are going to relax incarceration for drug crimes they need to provide some other type of help to those people.

 

There's a great book called "The Rich Get Richer, The Poor Get Prison". It deals a lot with drug laws. Almost all drug related crime is due to illegality and cost. If you legalized it costs would come down this eliminating most of the crime associated with it. I understand your statement with hard drugs but have never heard of a pothead killing someone for their next fix. Think about how much we spend on the war on drugs. Put that money into drug education and treatment.

[blksheep 466]

So show me all the upstanding citizens using marijuana I'll show you ten fold that are dead beat p.o.s. If we are making an argument about it being less abused fine. But what happens when those less effects on getting high give way to needing a better high. Which in turn leads to harder drugs and violent crimes. Wait till it's your kids smoking weed getting high and doing nothing. Then somebody is turning out your little boy or girl for crack money. Put it that way and now you have a problem with it.

 

Its a big problem. Most people locked up are not nice upstanding people. If they are let them in your house.

[blksheep 466]

 

 

There's a great book called "The Rich Get Richer, The Poor Get Prison". It deals a lot with drug laws. Almost all drug related crime is due to illegality and cost. If you legalized it costs would come down this eliminating most of the crime associated with it. I understand your statement with hard drugs but have never heard of a pothead killing someone for their next fix. Think about how much we spend on the war on drugs. Put that money into drug education and treatment.

 

Treatment huh? If you smack someone in the mouth enough times they won't need treatment. They just won't do it.

[MarkWVU02 47]

So show me all the upstanding citizens using marijuana I'll show you ten fold that are dead beat p.o.s. If we are making an argument about it being less abused fine. But what happens when those less effects on getting high give way to needing a better high. Which in turn leads to harder drugs and violent crimes. Wait till it's your kids smoking weed getting high and doing nothing. Then somebody is turning out your little boy or girl for crack money. Put it that way and now you have a problem with it.

 

Its a big problem. Most people locked up are not nice upstanding people. If they are let them in your house.

 

I highly doubt you could show me ten fold. You'd be surprised how many people smoke pot. I know doctors and lawyers who do and they're normal upstanding citizens that prefer a joint to a drink. Using the "gateway" drug analogy is a little outdated as well since it's not a proven theory. There's a reason marijuana reform is sweeping the country. It's basically because something fairly harmless is illegal. Look at alcohol deaths a year verse marijuana deaths a year. HUGE difference. Also look at the medicinal benefits of marijuana as well. I'm not arguing heroin, cocaine, and meth are awful drugs but give me a break on the marijuana. Our prohibition on marijuana dates back to a smear campaign based on propaganda not fact.

[MarkWVU02 47]

 

 

Treatment huh? If you smack someone in the mouth enough times they won't need treatment. They just won't do it.

 

Doubt that as well. I've unfortunately had a ton friends arrested time after time for heroin, and when they get out of jail go right back to it. Funny part of it is many of them learn new connections in prison. Also once they have that record following them they have no chance of finding a job and either turn to crime or kill themselves with drugs. It's sad but true.

[vladtepes 1,060]

So show me all the upstanding citizens using marijuana I'll show you ten fold that are dead beat p.o.s. If we are making an argument about it being less abused fine. But what happens when those less effects on getting high give way to needing a better high. Which in turn leads to harder drugs and violent crimes. Wait till it's your kids smoking weed getting high and doing nothing. Then somebody is turning out your little boy or girl for crack money. Put it that way and now you have a problem with it.

 

Its a big problem. Most people locked up are not nice upstanding people. If they are let them in your house.

 

show me ten people on marijuana that are dead beats and I will show you 20 where alcohol has caused death...

 

banning a substance NEVER works..

 

it did NOT work with alcohol

it is NOT working with drugs

and

it would NOT work with guns

 

 

the actions against others are criminal.. not the substance..

[TheSmokingGun 0]

drug abuse for example IS a problem.. but its a social problem not a legal one... if they totally ended drug prohibition they could free up mass amounts of jail space, and focus on keeping VIOLENT offenders off the street for extended periods of time with harsher sentences.. thus keeping our society safer.. sometimes I wonder what the hold up is.. why we don't make adjustments like that..

 

Sadly, NJ has the votes to decriminalize possession of small amounts of marijuana back in June of 2012. It passed 7-0 in committee and had a bipartisan majority in the state assembly and with 58% public support. The bill would have made first, second and third offenses punishable by small and then increasing fines, and on third offense require the individual to seek drug counseling at their own expense. Then Christie made some big grandstanding show with cops and teachers, blabbing about protecting our children, and threatened a veto, thus killing the bill.

 

Kind of funny, the guy is all about being "fiscally conservative" yet he doesn't mind spending millions upon millions of dollars patrolling, arresting, prosecuting, and jailing people simply for having a dime bag on them.

 

Also I would like to say that while I have some differences with you, you are spot on about Marijuana and I thank you for your contributions on the matter.

[TheSmokingGun 0]

But what happens when those less effects on getting high give way to needing a better high.

 

I don't know, why don't you ask people like Willie Nelson and Tommy Chong? They've been smoking for 50+ years.

 

I'm sure their answer would be "stop buying mids, man"

 

FYI: The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) reports that more than 37,000 annual U.S. deaths are attributed to alcohol use alone (i.e. this figure does not include accidental deaths). On the other hand, the CDC does not even have a category for deaths caused by the use of marijuana.

[anabolism 2]

In my jail we've had "low level" inmates get released in the morning then come back again on new charges later in the evening

[vladtepes 1,060]

FYI: The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) reports that more than 37,000 annual U.S. deaths are attributed to alcohol use alone (i.e. this figure does not include accidental deaths). On the other hand, the CDC does not even have a category for deaths caused by the use of marijuana.

 

that in itself should illustrate the absurdity that is marijuana prohibition..

[BlueLineFish 615]

It will happen soon. Colorado, Washington and Oregon I believe just legalized small amounts. Hell even in NY small amounts are just a summons. Unless you're smoking it in public..that's a collar. As opposed to jersey where even a nickel bag is a collar

[MarkWVU02 47]

It will happen soon. Colorado, Washington and Oregon I believe just legalized small amounts. Hell even in NY small amounts are just a summons. Unless you're smoking it in public..that's a collar. As opposed to jersey where even a nickel bag is a collar

 

That's why Santa preferred the cookies in Colorado and Washington

[gunguy1960 2]

Santa does a job no one else wants to do, forced to go into every dangerous neighborhood on the planet, bringing presents to your loved ones, and whats the thanks he gets? He puts on that red suit and risks his life flying all around, he works for society, not the individual and dont start with your taxes!

[KpdPipes 388]

Doubt that as well. I've unfortunately had a ton friends arrested time after time for heroin, and when they get out of jail go right back to it. Funny part of it is many of them learn new connections in prison. Also once they have that record following them they have no chance of finding a job and either turn to crime or kill themselves with drugs. It's sad but true.

 

Rehab doesnt work unless the Junkie WANTS to quit and has the willpower to do it..I watched a girl I went to HS with bankrupt her parents..they kept sending her to rehab, and within a couple of weeks of getting out she'd be strung out and Od'd. AS far as MJ..pretty much every arrest i ever made was because the moron brought himself to my attention. My favorite was the town councilman who answered the door with a joint in his hand when we went to his place on a noise complaint

[MarkWVU02 47]

Rehab doesnt work unless the Junkie WANTS to quit and has the willpower to do it..I watched a girl I went to HS with bankrupt her parents..they kept sending her to rehab, and within a couple of weeks of getting out she'd be strung out and Od'd. AS far as MJ..pretty much every arrest i ever made was because the moron brought himself to my attention. My favorite was the town councilman who answered the door with a joint in his hand when we went to his place on a noise complaint

 

Definitely...but my response was geared towards the comment that "If you smack someone in the mouth enough times they won't need treatment. They just won't do it." This also doesn't work as most will get released from jail and now have better connections and a drug conviction that will get them turned down from most decent jobs. With any addiction people have to want to quit in order to do so. Sadly I've seen heroin ruin a few lives but a few beat it once they realized it and they decided they wanted to help. I wouldn't dump money into treatment for everyone but would support some money going to the ones that really want the help and may not be able to afford it.

[MarkWVU02 47]

Also the thing that usually happens is they get out of rehab and go back to where they're from only to hang out with the same junkies they always hung out with...sometimes you have to get away from it.