Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
sage613

dealing with OGAM

Recommended Posts

Okay-I know this is stupid; but dealing with OGAM drives me nuts. I have two guns on layaway and have two weeks left to pick up one and then will need to wait 31 days for the other. How do others deal with this waiting period? I know I am a grown-up and all, but man, I am impatient!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If they're current manufacture, and that's all the OP is filing for, not likely to be approved.

Are you speaking from experience, or assumption?

 

I had looked over the OGAM exemption forms and spoke with one of the investigators at the State Police unit, and from what I gathered, if you can show legal purpose, they aren't going to deny the application. The lady I spoke iwth was very accomodating and indicated (at that time) that the process takes about 2 weeks. This was back in the fall.

 

That aside, it doesn't cost anyting to try.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you speaking from experience, or assumption?

 

I had looked over the OGAM exemption forms and spoke with one of the investigators at the State Police unit, and from what I gathered, if you can show legal purpose, they aren't going to deny the application. The lady I spoke iwth was very accomodating and indicated (at that time) that the process takes about 2 weeks. This was back in the fall.

 

That aside, it doesn't cost anyting to try.

 

13 exemptions filed and received in 2 years. Both Sgts know me on a first name basis. They do their homework more than you think. If you have something modern within a group of firearms no longer produced, not a big deal. If you are buying two mass-produced, readily available, unremarkable modern handguns - e.g., take you choice of Glocks, HKs, etc - your purpose will need to be a good one and i doubt it would go over, especially now. If the guns were something like modern custom-built competition pistols or revolvers, no problem with an exemption.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay-I know this is stupid; but dealing with OGAM drives me nuts. I have two guns on layaway and have two weeks left to pick up one and then will need to wait 31 days for the other. How do others deal with this waiting period? I know I am a grown-up and all, but man, I am impatient!

its not worth the hassle to file an exemption if its only 2 guns

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

13 exemptions filed and received in 2 years. ............be a good one and i doubt it would go over, especially now.

Cool! Thanks for sharing your experience. I had a feeling that if you took the time to go through the process it would yeild results.

 

I disagree, however, when you say "especially now," because quite frankly I think right now now it's very difficult to find stock, even of mass produced firearms. I could be wrong, but from what I've seen (and read) the recent run on guns isn't limited to AR's. Couple that with the NICS delays and a case could be made.

 

In your experience (and opinion) is there any downside to applying? Doesn't cost anything, right? No blemish on your record if they say no, right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

13 exemptions filed and received in 2 years. Both Sgts know me on a first name basis. They do their homework more than you think. If you have something modern within a group of firearms no longer produced, not a big deal. If you are buying two mass-produced, readily available, unremarkable modern handguns - e.g., take you choice of Glocks, HKs, etc - your purpose will need to be a good one and i doubt it would go over, especially now. If the guns were something like modern custom-built competition pistols or revolvers, no problem with an exemption.

I've never had one denied. Granted I buy more milsurp and C&R than I do modern, but I have put modern on the exemptions and never had a problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I disagree, however, when you say "especially now," because quite frankly I think right now now it's very difficult to find stock, even of mass produced firearms. I could be wrong, but from what I've seen (and read) the recent run on guns isn't limited to AR's. Couple that with the NICS delays and a case could be made.

 

In your experience (and opinion) is there any downside to applying? Doesn't cost anything, right? No blemish on your record if they say no, right?

 

Especially now in the sense that the political climate is forcing scrunity. Since you haven't been through the process, the investigating officer has to sign off on the exemption which effectively states he feels there's sufficient need to grant it. That officer certainly would like to remain employed, so he's not going to sign off on an exemption for someone saying a need a Glock 21 and 23 for sporting purposes... Catch my drift?

 

Also, the OP has to have both guns with the same FFL, and must have the FFL sign off on the second form. It's legwork, time, and postage given the OP is looking at 6 weeks to be able to pick up both anyway, not worth it. My last exemption took 6 weeks to process as it started just before 12/14, before that it was half the time.

 

 

I've never had one denied. Granted I buy more milsurp and C&R than I do modern, but I have put modern on the exemptions and never had a problem.

 

Yes, as I indicated earlier I too have had moderns in with a long list of scarce handguns and approved no problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Catch my drift?

No, I got it, and I can't disagree with your logic except to offer a different viewpoint, albeit without the experience. The language in the excemption law is fairly clear in my view. If I collect Glocks simply because I like modern Glocks, unless I present a safety concern, my desire (need) to collect Glocks shouldn't be impaired by this law, provided I meet the critera set forth. It's my understanding after reading the law the only reason they are supposed to deny you is if you appear to be a straw purchaser.

 

The bottom line is that their is a process for relief from this stupid law and you and halbautomatish have used it sucessfully. I only wish more people would and suspect they don't because they feel it's an impossible process, which, obvioulsy, it isn't.

 

 

 

(1) The application is to purchase multiple handguns from a person who obtained the handguns through inheritance or intestacy;

 

(2) The applicant is a collector of handguns and has a need to purchase or otherwise receive multiple handguns in the same transaction or within a 30-day period in furtherance of the applicant's collecting activities. As used in this paragraph, "need" shall include, but not be limited to, situations where there is a reasonable likelihood that the additional handguns sought to be purchased would not be readily available after the 30-day period, that it would not be feasible or practical to purchase the handguns separately, or that prohibiting the purchase of more than one handgun within a 30-day period would have a materially adverse impact on the applicant's ability to enhance his collection. As used in this paragraph, "collector" shall include any person who devotes time and attention to acquiring firearms for the enhancement of the person's collection: as curios; for inheritance; for historical, investment, training and competitive, recreational, educational, scientific, or defensive purposes; or any or other lawful related purpose. If an applicant is a member of an organized gun club; firearms competitors organization; firearms collectors organization; or any other organization dedicated to the acquisition, preservation, or use of firearms for historical, investment, training and competitive, recreational, educational, scientific, or defensive purposes, or any other lawful related purpose, such membership shall be considered in determining whether the applicant qualifies as a collector; or

 

(3) The applicant participates in sanctioned handgun shooting competitions and needs to purchase or otherwise receive multiple handguns in a single transaction or within a 30-day period, and the need is related to the applicant's competitive shooting activities, including use in or training for sanctioned competitions.

 

 

b. The applicant shall certify, on a form prescribed by the superintendent, the specific exemption sought and the particular handguns to be purchased. This form shall be submitted to the superintendent at the same time as the permit to purchase a handgun, along with any pertinent documentation supporting the need for an exemption. If the information concerning the particular handguns to be purchased is not available when the form is submitted, that information shall be provided to the superintendent as soon as practicable thereafter. The superintendent shall consider the veracity, accuracy, and completeness of the information provided in determining whether the applicant meets the requirements for an exemption pursuant to this section. In considering whether an applicant qualifies as a collector under paragraph (2) of subsection a. of this section, the superintendent shall not consider the number of guns in the applicant's collection. In considering an exemption sought under paragraph (2) of subsection a. of this section, the superintendent shall not consider the merit or validity of the applicant's collecting activities. The superintendent shall not grant an exemption if he finds a reasonable likelihood that the public safety would be endangered by granting the exemption, including but not limited to instances where the applicant may be purchasing a handgun to give, sell or distribute to a person who would not qualify to purchase or otherwise acquire a handgun under the provisions of this chapter.

 

The exemptions set forth in this section shall not be construed and are not intended to authorize multiple handgun purchases where the sole justification set forth by the applicant is that the seller offers a discount for the purchase of more than one handgun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, I got it, and I can't disagree with your logic except to offer a different viewpoint, albeit without the experience. The language in the excemption law is fairly clear in my view. If I collect Glocks simply because I like modern Glocks, unless I present a safety concern, my desire (need) to collect Glocks shouldn't be impaired by this law, provided I meet the critera set forth. It's my understanding after reading the law the only reason they are supposed to deny you is if you appear to be a straw purchaser.

 

The bottom line is that their is a process for relief from this stupid law and you and halbautomatish have used it sucessfully. I only wish more people would and suspect they don't because they feel it's an impossible process, which, obvioulsy, it isn't.

 

Sorry friend, and I mean this with due respect and not off-handedly, in the State of New Jersey your are not entitled to get the exemption, and the decision lies solely within the NJSP Firearms Bureau. By use of the term "need," it is VERY open-ended, as precident shows that in this State (ala, CCW). Two spanking new Glocks that can be bought just as easily 6 months from now as right this second won't cut it because that can easily be acquired under OGAM. Now, if you are acquiring someone's collection of new Glocks, and the deal is contingent on time and taking the lot, you have a good argument demonstrating need because in 6 months time that collection won't be available and can then pursue under being a collector. Early on, I had lots of similar questions regarding exemptions, but now I've been through it enough I know what's expected... Certainly don't expect to find yourself getting an exemption every month for multiple handguns either... Key point to remember, an exemption is a POSSIBILITY under the State gun laws and not a right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, I got it, and I can't disagree with your logic except to offer a different viewpoint, albeit without the experience. The language in the excemption law is fairly clear in my view. If I collect Glocks simply because I like modern Glocks, unless I present a safety concern, my desire (need) to collect Glocks shouldn't be impaired by this law, provided I meet the critera set forth. It's my understanding after reading the law the only reason they are supposed to deny you is if you appear to be a straw purchaser.

 

The bottom line is that their is a process for relief from this stupid law and you and halbautomatish have used it sucessfully. I only wish more people would and suspect they don't because they feel it's an impossible process, which, obvioulsy, it isn't.

 

 

 

(1) The application is to purchase multiple handguns from a person who obtained the handguns through inheritance or intestacy;

 

(2) The applicant is a collector of handguns and has a need to purchase or otherwise receive multiple handguns in the same transaction or within a 30-day period in furtherance of the applicant's collecting activities. As used in this paragraph, "need" shall include, but not be limited to, situations where there is a reasonable likelihood that the additional handguns sought to be purchased would not be readily available after the 30-day period, that it would not be feasible or practical to purchase the handguns separately, or that prohibiting the purchase of more than one handgun within a 30-day period would have a materially adverse impact on the applicant's ability to enhance his collection. As used in this paragraph, "collector" shall include any person who devotes time and attention to acquiring firearms for the enhancement of the person's collection: as curios; for inheritance; for historical, investment, training and competitive, recreational, educational, scientific, or defensive purposes; or any or other lawful related purpose. If an applicant is a member of an organized gun club; firearms competitors organization; firearms collectors organization; or any other organization dedicated to the acquisition, preservation, or use of firearms for historical, investment, training and competitive, recreational, educational, scientific, or defensive purposes, or any other lawful related purpose, such membership shall be considered in determining whether the applicant qualifies as a collector; or

 

(3) The applicant participates in sanctioned handgun shooting competitions and needs to purchase or otherwise receive multiple handguns in a single transaction or within a 30-day period, and the need is related to the applicant's competitive shooting activities, including use in or training for sanctioned competitions.

 

 

b. The applicant shall certify, on a form prescribed by the superintendent, the specific exemption sought and the particular handguns to be purchased. This form shall be submitted to the superintendent at the same time as the permit to purchase a handgun, along with any pertinent documentation supporting the need for an exemption. If the information concerning the particular handguns to be purchased is not available when the form is submitted, that information shall be provided to the superintendent as soon as practicable thereafter. The superintendent shall consider the veracity, accuracy, and completeness of the information provided in determining whether the applicant meets the requirements for an exemption pursuant to this section. In considering whether an applicant qualifies as a collector under paragraph (2) of subsection a. of this section, the superintendent shall not consider the number of guns in the applicant's collection. In considering an exemption sought under paragraph (2) of subsection a. of this section, the superintendent shall not consider the merit or validity of the applicant's collecting activities. The superintendent shall not grant an exemption if he finds a reasonable likelihood that the public safety would be endangered by granting the exemption, including but not limited to instances where the applicant may be purchasing a handgun to give, sell or distribute to a person who would not qualify to purchase or otherwise acquire a handgun under the provisions of this chapter.

 

The exemptions set forth in this section shall not be construed and are not intended to authorize multiple handgun purchases where the sole justification set forth by the applicant is that the seller offers a discount for the purchase of more than one handgun.

If you are a Glock collector, and you are buying more Glocks, I would state that on the paperwork where it asks for the reason why you are requesting the exemption.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you are a Glock collector, and you are buying more Glocks, I would state that on the paperwork where it asks for the reason why you are requesting the exemption.

I'm not...I only used that as an example for the purpose of the discussion.

 

I think more people should take advantage of the OGAM excemption process. Given the replies in this thread it seems to work for those who take the time to avail themselves of the process.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ive gotten the exemption for a ruger sp101 a conteder pistol in 357mag, and a henry 22 mares leg.

 

none are "collectors" items, yet all 3 are difficult to get even being current manufacturer (except the contender), i stated that as my reason and that i collect firearms. Hardest part was the wait for permits.

 

By law as sited above they cannot deny you because they "feel" like it--

 

"need" shall include, but not be limited to, situations where there is a reasonable likelihood that the additional handguns sought to be purchased would not be readily available after the 30-day period, that it would not be feasible or practical to purchase the handguns separately, or that prohibiting the purchase of more than one handgun within a 30-day period would have a materially adverse impact on the applicant's ability to enhance his collection. As used in this paragraph, "collector" shall include any person who devotes time and attention to acquiring firearms for the enhancement of the person's collection: as curios; for inheritance; for historical, investment, training and competitive, recreational, educational, scientific, or defensive purposes; or any or other lawful related purpose. If an applicant is a member of an organized gun club; firearms competitors organization; firearms collectors organization; or any other organization dedicated to the acquisition, preservation, or use of firearms for historical, investment, training and competitive, recreational, educational, scientific, or defensive purposes, or any other lawful related purpose, such membership shall be considered in determining whether the applicant qualifies as a collector; or

 

As stated in red they cannot deny you, THEY built the multiple option into the law i suggest everyone uses it.

I will use it everytime i want 2 guns that are at the same dealer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been looking at this OGAM thing because i am interested in 2 pistols. One is currently in production and one has been out of production for 3 years now, both were police issued. These would be through a private sale. Every OGAM thread I've looked to for clarification mentions dealers and FFLs. I'm sure, but could be wrong, that OGAM applies to private sales as well? 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've only had one occasion to ask for an extension.  When asked why I needed it I simply explained I had ordered a gun and it hadn't arrived yet.  The PD approved it and I was fine.  Since then if I see something I am ready to buy, I'll pay for it and the FFL will hold it until I can return with the permit, or my 31 days goes by, or whatever needs to happen.  I think most FFLs are willing to do this because without that service it would just make the OGAM nonsense insurmountable for customers.

 

I suspect this is a topic that varies from town to town though, so if you have to file for more permits do so.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.



  • olight.jpg

    Use Promo Code "NJGF10" for 10% Off Regular Items

  • Supporting Vendors

  • Latest Topics

  • Similar Content

    • By JW_Pepper
      I'm looking into applying for the OGAM exception and have a few questions despite reading the sticky and a few other posts. I conveniently could not find any kind of instructions on the NJSP website on completing the forms or process. Thanks in advance.
      1. Should forms SP015 and SP016 be sent to the local PD or directly to the NJSP? I have read different things and that the local police just forward the forms to NJSP which will obviously add additional lead time.
      2. Is the original form with inked signature required to be submitted or is a copy acceptable? This is obviously not a problem with form SP015 since I would sign it myself but with SP016 that requires the FFL signature. If original is required, I would have to obtain the form physically from them vs them emailing me a copy and then submit the original.
      3. How will I be notified if I was approved for the exemption?
      4. If anyone who as applied for a OGAM exemption recently, please chime in on how long the turnaround time was.
    • By cam29906
      Hi looking for some clarification and possible direction if my thinking is true.
       
      I was denied a nics today because of OGAM law per NICS.
      I last bought a handgun under an exemption on 08/15/14. Last non exempt handgun purchase was 07/12/14. According to them the 08/15/14 nics resets the clock on the 30 day rule. However i read on here before that an exempt purchase is just that it is exempt and doesn't count. I have used that reading for past two years and have done it numerous times with success. Today was no good, NICS transferred me to Firearms Unit and they said it wasn't real clear how the statue handles this but their interpretation was NICS was correct in denying me. They said they are keeping this interpretation unless they receive something in writing from attorney generals office or the law is changed. Thanks in advance
    • By mikka1
      Was thinking about this for quite some time, but can't find any specific info on this. Sorry if it has been discussed already, just point me out where :-)
      I almost had a chance to try this on myself a couple of months ago (buying a handgun evening before a long trip out of state), but got lucky then.
       
      So, hypothetical situation:
      1a) You come to the store with your P2P, choose a handgun, commit to buy it (e.g. pay the whole price right away).
      Store associate runs your NICS (Day 1) and gets a "delayed" response (seems not that uncommon, especially for Green Card holders). You fly out to Dallas Montreal the next morning for 2-weeks project. Next afternoon (when you are already enjoying Texas sun Montreal cold and French-speaking crowd everywhere sitting in an small office) you get a call that NICS returned "approved" (Day 2).
      You can't take the gun that day, you actually can do it only on Day 15 or so.
      It is fine as long as NICS results are valid for 30 days AFAIK.
       
      (another version of this situation - 1b) - might be a friendly FFL running NICS for you a little bit in advance, let's say, on Day 1 with you coming to pick guns up on Day 6 after that)
       
      Result is basically the same. While NJ NICS writes the date of request as Day 1, you actually take a possession of a gun on Day 15 (or Day 6 etc.).
       
      Question: when can you buy the next gun?
       
      a) On Day 31 (or 32 to be sure)
      b) On Day 45 (or Day 36 respectively for 1b) for 30 days to pass from the moment you actually took possession of the gun
      c) You can again run NICS on Day 31, and it will be approved, but you will be unable to legally take a possession of a handgun until Day 45 (or 36).
       
      Question 2: in such scenarios, what dates go where in your papers?
      As I remember, FFL can NOT put Day 1 in your P2P if you actually come on Day 15, because in this case it would look like he failed to return other copies of P2P to authorities on time.
      Still back to OGAM, how NJ NICS system will know about the actual date of transfer?
       
      Thanks a lot in advance!
       
      Locations edited not to hit a raw nerve :-))))
    • By boo
      It's been at least a few weeks since I last saw this asked, so I'm going to bring it up again
       
      While there are many ambiguitiesin NJ firearms laws, this doesn't appear to me to be one of them:
       
       
       
       
      So to me this clearly states that if I buy a handgun on day zero and starting counting on the following day, I would be eligible to buy a handgun on day 30. Doing a search, everyone advises buying on day 31. I called the NJSP firearms unit. I was told the law permits buying on day 30, but it was her "personal recommendation" to wait for 31. I just wonder if this is one of those gun store "NJSP requires us to see an FID before allowing you to handle a firearm" things. So my question is:
       
      1. What was your personal experience buying on day 30? Approved or denied? No offense, I'm not interested in what happened to your buddy or what happened to your friend's brother's former roomate, just your personal experience where you have first hand knowledge of when your permit was dated, when NICS was run, and know you were careful about the day count.
       
      2. And if you were denied, 1) were you told why?, 2) does it affect the way you have to fill out any future NICS requests?
    • By djg0770
      Informative post intended to be a sticky:
       
      One Gun A Month (OGAM) applies to the following:
      HANDGUNS ONLY. If you need a "Permit to Purchase" OGAM applies, if you purchase your gun with ONLY an FPID card, OGAM DOES NOT APPLY!
       
       
       
      I bought a handgun on February 28th, when can I next buy a handgun?
      Regarding this - I suggest you read this. http://njgunforums.c...__1#entry502784
       
      In my opinion the following is the safe and sure method to ensure that you don't end up in prison.
      If you buy on February 28th, your first day of counting is March 1 (as per NJSP Firearms unit, see link above), your 30th day is March 30, you are legal to purchase on March 31. Some people will argue you are legal on March 30th. That's entirely your call, I am NOT a lawyer.
       
      Please note that you can apply for an exemption from OGAM.
      The forms are available on the NJSP website and to date, it appears as though all exemptions applied for have been approved. Due to the delays in obtaining an exemption, it usually only makes sense if you are taking delivery of 3+ handguns. Instructions on applying for exemptions are listed here http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php?/topic/41324-filling-out-ogam-exemption-form/page__hl__exemption__fromsearch__1
  • Posts

×
×
  • Create New...