New Video Destroys Myth About Large Capacity Magazines

[ryan_j 0]

This thread brought to mind a question I have been pondering for a while and rather than start a new thread, I will ask it here.

 

I have been instructed on magazine changes to chamber the first round by racking the slide on my Glock. I find it much quicker and convenient to use the slide release. What are the pro's and con's of this?

 

I was told that using the slide release wears the gun faster.

 

I always rack the slide.

[ryan_j 0]

Here is the fundamental problem everyone seems to be missing with arbitrary magazine limits. An active shooter attacking unarmed people can reload as many times as he needs and still be effective. A reload compounded with the high stress of a defensive situation puts the law-abiding citizen with the low capacity magazine trying to defend themselves at a greater disadvantage than the criminal who is attacking unarmed victims.

 

 

Don't use your gun. Just pee on yourself and your attacker will go away.

[raz-0 1,259]

The same way those that did this with the assault rifle ban. They get picked off one at a time over time for one reason or another. Fire, vindictive ex wife, emergency, etc etc. Consider that there is jail time and forfiture involved. Thats a stout risk in my view. So its not as simple as dont ask, dont tell!

 

I would argue that since you still see WWII take homes that weren't registered pre-86 still show up being randomly dumped with no idea who had them, that don't ask and don't tell can work for quite some time.

 

You roll the dice, you take your chances though.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Ray, the point is, the results are all within mere seconds of one another, therefore any sort of arbitrary magazine limit would do no good whatsoever. It stops the anti's argument that LCMs are part of the problem... because in this video it is shown mag capacity makes very little if any difference. The antis either have to accept facts, OR call for a ban on everything that takes a removable magazine.

 

But of course, we're talking common sense here, something the antis don't possess much of.

 

No, I understand what they were trying to do. But it still didn't make any sense.

[SgtToadette 59]

Gee, you mean it doesn't take 20 seconds to do a mag change????

 

Apparently that's passing, Bob.

[reloaderguy 30]

People who shoot competitively or who take more advanced firearms training courses that cover tactical reloads know how quickly a gun can be reloaded.

 

[greatgunstatenj 32]

Only the 5th time I've seen this posted on NJGF

[reloaderguy 30]

Only the 5th time I've seen this posted on NJGF

 

Well this was the 1st time for me!

[dtown223 12]

Only the 5th time I've seen this posted on NJGF

Lol

A simple "repost" will be sufficient Mr. Crankypants!

[Duppie 73]

Lol

A simple "repost" will be sufficient Mr. Crankypants!

"Mr Crankypants" thanks for the laugh.......I got to remember that one.I frequently work with folks wearing that brand.

[n4p226r 105]

they shouldnt have used the trained guy or the running and attacking bit. the trained guy obviously was trying harder on the ones with more mag changes. the guy running to charge the girl kinda trips up because he probably could have made it to her.

 

the point is well made, but they went overboard by tipping that they were biased from the start. we just happen to agree with them so we overlook it.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

So when are we going to see this video thrown at us as proof that they want to lower our capacity and it's for our benefit?

 

^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^

 

I think that this video will be twisted and come back to bite us in the A$$. Here's my take:

 

Idiot Politicians spout-off about mag capacity, changes, etc. and some say "20 sec's for a mag change".

 

To "prove them wrong", a crap-load of well-meaning Gun Rights advocates start videotaping above-average to expert hand-gunners changing tuned mags like a hot knife through butter.

 

We think we won THE argument. WE really showed-'em they were WRONG by having our people DO IT REALLY FAST, NEVER DROPPING OR MISSING A MAG CHANGE.

 

In reality, we supplied video (to the Gun Ban crowd) of the very reason why they want to limit capacity: because IT IS SO EASY AND FAST TO CHANGE MAGS!

 

Video gets twisted & used as propaganda to convince general populace how EASY it is to change a mag. EVIL standard-capacity mags are outlawed since it's so easy & quick to change a mag.

 

I HOPE I'm WRONG!

 

Dave

 

P.S.: Revolver stunt at the end of the video may cause some A-Hole Politician to dream-up a ban on owning more than X number of revolvers, since they're so deadly.....

[Shane45 807]

I dont think the anti's give a sh!t. They dont care about technical arguments because their goal is all guns in reality. The video may sway the middle grounders as to the shear stupidity. But the one part of the video that really should drive the point home was when he went for a second firearm. THIS is the real point that makes the cap ban purely stupid on every level.

[wooly bugger 1]

I think the two strongest arguments are:

1) common use test: a 10 round limit bans most *standard* so by definition firearm configurations

2) a premeditated bad guy can carry a satchel full of magazines and extra guns in a bag. if you've responsibly stored your gun in a bedside safe, your're going to be going to reach over, pull out your (1) gun, and have to face the guy.

3) "highly trained" NYPD have a 6.5% hit rate under pressure. That means that with a 10 round limit, there's a 50% chance you're not going to get even one hit.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^

 

I think that this video will be twisted and come back to bite us in the A$$. Here's my take:

 

Idiot Politicians spout-off about mag capacity, changes, etc. and some say "20 sec's for a mag change".

 

To "prove them wrong", a crap-load of well-meaning Gun Rights advocates start videotaping above-average to expert hand-gunners changing tuned mags like a hot knife through butter.

 

We think we won THE argument. WE really showed-'em they were WRONG by having our people DO IT REALLY FAST, NEVER DROPPING OR MISSING A MAG CHANGE.

 

In reality, we supplied video (to the Gun Ban crowd) of the very reason why they want to limit capacity: because IT IS SO EASY AND FAST TO CHANGE MAGS!

 

Video gets twisted & used as propaganda to convince general populace how EASY it is to change a mag. EVIL standard-capacity mags are outlawed since it's so easy & quick to change a mag.

 

I HOPE I'm WRONG!

 

Dave

 

P.S.: Revolver stunt at the end of the video may cause some A-Hole Politician to dream-up a ban on owning more than X number of revolvers, since they're so deadly.....

 

Dave:

 

Here is what negates that argument. If I have planned to kill as many people as possible, I will bring the instruments to accomplish that. For arguments sake, let's say that I, as the potential active shooter, actually obey the law and use only 10 round magazines - I will bring a shitload of them with me. This isn't hypothetical, both the Columbine shooters and Cho, at VA Tech, had multiple loaded 10-round magazines with them. With Cho I recall hearing he had 17 loaded mags in a backpack.

 

If I am Joe Citizen, with my CCW, I may only have the mag that is in the gun - and yes it would be a law-abiding 10-rounder - or at most one or two spares. Granted, even with an 18 round mag, there is still a great disparity of force - but at least I'll get 18 tries at neutralizing the shooter, rather than the state-mandated 10.

 

An offensive shooter will prepare with as many mags as they want, in order to perpetrate their evil A defensive shooter is limited by what they can comfortably carry and conceal and the state.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

[Soju 153]

Guys guys guys. Those in favor of magazine limitations either

 

1. Don't care about facts.

2. KNOW that it has no practical benefit whatsoever.

 

They simply want to limit our rights. You ban x capacity magazines...then you ban ownership of x number of magazine/guns...then you ban x type of guns...then you ban all guns.

 

Do you really think that they just want to limit magazine capacity? Hell no. They want to limit a lot more than that, but they think they can do this right NOW, so that is what they are doing.

 

Give them an inch, and they will take a mile. To us, this is a mile. To them, this is just the inch.

[BigHayden 77]

Somebody should share this video with Assm. Mainor. The third string of fire (five 6 round magazines; 4 reloads) was completed in less time than Mainor claims he can perform one magazine change...

[Soju 153]

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php?/topic/49660-new-video-destroys-myth-about-large-capacity-magazines/page__fromsearch__1

[CMJeepster 2,777]

An offensive shooter will prepare with as many mags as they want, in order to perpetrate their evil A defensive shooter is limited by what they can comfortably carry and conceal and the state.

Bad people are gonna do bad things no matter what the law says. ;-)

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Dave:

 

Here is what negates that argument. If I have planned to kill as many people as possible, I will bring the instruments to accomplish that. For arguments sake, let's say that I, as the potential active shooter, actually obey the law and use only 10 round magazines - I will bring a shitload of them with me. This isn't hypothetical, both the Columbine shooters and Cho, at VA Tech, had multiple loaded 10-round magazines with them. With Cho I recall hearing he had 17 loaded mags in a backpack.

 

If I am Joe Citizen, with my CCW, I may only have the mag that is in the gun - and yes it would be a law-abiding 10-rounder - or at most one or two spares. Granted, even with an 18 round mag, there is still a great disparity of force - but at least I'll get 18 tries at neutralizing the shooter, rather than the state-mandated 10.

 

An offensive shooter will prepare with as many mags as they want, in order to perpetrate their evil A defensive shooter is limited by what they can comfortably carry and conceal and the state.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

 

Bob,

 

Knowing politics & people the way I do, I still think my argument holds water. It all depends on just what "the other side" does with the video. If they twist it to be able to show how easy & fast it is for a law-abiding Citizen to change a mag (such as doing a voice-over of the segment of the mag change drill itself), STUPID people who VOTE will write & fax their representatives urging them to ban standard capacity mags. They'll do this because they're instructed to do so by the Anti's, the MSM and the like. I can see this as clear as day, as if it has already taken place in some out-of-body experience from a horror show, due in part to its' incremental nature, chippin'-away one thread at a time from the Second Amendment. I sincerely hope that I'm wrong.

 

Of course you are also correct in everything you point-out about Cho & other Active Shooter scenarios.

 

Bones, Jeepster, you & I are all correct, all at the same time, except I actually hope I'm wrong and the Anti's don't grab that video and use it as a weapon of mass disarmament....

 

Dave

[ryan_j 0]

Quibble - they're not firing to slide lock on each magazine, only on the last. Still, glad to see some objective analysis on this.

 

I think that is important but it demonstrates that one can reload quickly using that method.

[dtown223 12]

"Mr Crankypants" thanks for the laugh.......I got to remember that one.I frequently work with folks wearing that brand.

You learn all sorts of curse substitutes having kids

Normally adults get my adult vocabulary , but I didn't wanna get the mods upset

[bzer1 15]

Unfortunately they never really account for the differing stress levels of attacker and atackee. An attacker changing mags is doing it under a completely different mindset than that of a woman about to be raped and murdered, or a man who must consider the fate of his family if he doesn't stop the invader. The difference between determination and desperation would be a much more valid criteria. Unfortunately the pols can't be held liable for the death and destruction their not so well meaning legislation causes. Any and all changes to the law, should come with a liability clause to the legislators who vote yes. If they were held responsible for the laws they create, and the money they waste, you'd see far fewer laws and more freedom.

[RUTGERS95 890]

first time I saw it too

 

great vid

[ECShooter 0]

I have been fortunate to train with several LEOs, Military (enlisted and retired) and I was first introduced to shooting by one of my closest friends and some of his fellow seal team members. Count, drop, load. When you can you do a tactical reload, reloading a full mag with a round chambered. That has been my habit, don't see anything wrong with this.

[Shane45 807]

"Count, drop, load" Its great to try to do but HARD to do under real world conditions. BTW SEAL's get cranky if you dont use caps