Optic Opinions

[Howi 0]

So for the most part I'm finished with my first ar. I'm still struggling with what optic to put on it. I am a good shot with iron sights out to 500 and went with the a2 upper and flip rear so I would always have that option. That being said I'd like to be spoiled and get an optic with a little magnification. I'm used to the trijicon rco with a chevron, but at 1100-1300 dollars I'm open for suggestions lol. I was also looking at eo tech holo sight with a magnifier, but seeing as I have never used one its lost on me. (I know they can be equally expensive, but I'm not so much worried about price as I am quality and applicability)

 

Some key points:

-target acquisition. Short and long

-durability (not gonna treat this rifle like a new born)

-how well it holds a zero

-if talking about optics using batteries please at least estimate battery life

 

Thanks for any suggestions or input/personal experience

 

-Jim

[Zerosignal 1]

Here we go again.....

My vote is in for a Aimpoint since you said magnifier go with a pro.

[Howi 0]

Here we go again.....My vote is in for a Aimpoint since you said magnifier go with a pro.

First off I understand its a frequent topic, but no need for the comment.

 

Second why would you take that over the acog? Do u have personal experience, if so can it take a few bumps and smacks and how well does it hold a group?

 

Thanks!

[RecessedFilter 222]

Go aimpoint or Eotech. I prefer Aimpoint because Eotechs are a bit of a large optic but they both will hold zero, see war experience, and are the most reliable optics out there.

[Zerosignal 1]

First off I understand its a frequent topic, but no need for the comment.

 

Second why would you take that over the acog? Do u have personal experience, if so can it take a few bumps and smacks and how well does it hold a group?

 

Thanks!

Acog is a fine optic too..

[Howi 0]

Go aimpoint or Eotech. I prefer Aimpoint because Eotechs are a bit of a large optic but they both will hold zero, see war experience, and are the most reliable optics out there.

How are they in the 300-500 ranges with the magnifier? Still curious on if it can take a bump or two. Thanks a lot.

[bhunted 887]

The humanity....

 

 

Sent from John's iPad 2 via Tapatalk HD

Typos courtesy Apple...

[High Exposure 5,661]

Lol!

 

Aimpoint PRO all the way. Nothing out there better for the price.

 

This is a topic covered here often recently. Use the search function to find many answers to this eternal question. Check the "optics and accessories" forum here for more.

 

Here are a couple recent threads on this same topic:

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/56326-optic-opinions/

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/55581-eotech-557/

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/50692-alternatives-to-eotech/

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/50191-rds-vs-1-4x1-6x-scope-for-ar15/

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/50076-looking-to-buy-a-aimpoint/

[vladtepes 1,060]

I shoot center mass targets at 300 with a PRO and 3x magnifier.... I like the pro magnifier combo because when I move and shoot up close the magnifier is in my chest rig... Then when I need it I just clamp it on... Saved some money and went with a vortex magnifier... Quality is less than aimpoint but still good....

[lunker 274]

If you have an astigmatism (like me), the dot on the Aimpoint can seem a little strange, like seeing lights from behind a rainy windshield. But it works nonetheless. The effect is lessened by turning down the intensity. It is rock solid on its mount. I use a absolute cowitness and have my front sight post a little lower (i.e. I lollipop the target like on a target revolver). This allows for the dot not to be superimposed on the front sight post. I know some folks prefer the lower 1/3 cowitness so they don't have to sight the irons that way.  Sorry I don't have any input on the magnification. I don't use one. From everything I have read (take that for what it's worth ), the magnifiers are great. I love that they can rock out of the way to get you back to 1X.

[MidwestPX 172]

For that much money, get a Nightforce 1-4.  Personally, I don't like using 3x-4x non-variable optics for anything inside of 50 yards.  Shooting with both eyes open, especially at 3-5 yards through an ACOG is noticeably slower than a non-magnified RDS.  The Nightforce is an excellent choice as it's a true 1x and the 4x magnification makes target identification at longer ranges a snap.  RDS + magnifier combos are heavier and once you add up the cost of mounts plus the optics, you're in the range of the Nightforce anyway.  And I'm not pushing the Nightforce because I have a financial incentive...I'm not a dealer for that brand.  They just make a good optic that I really like.

[vladtepes 1,060]

For that much money, get a Nightforce 1-4.  Personally, I don't like using 3x-4x non-variable optics for anything inside of 50 yards.  Shooting with both eyes open, especially at 3-5 yards through an ACOG is noticeably slower than a non-magnified RDS.  The Nightforce is an excellent choice as it's a true 1x and the 4x magnification makes target identification at longer ranges a snap.  RDS + magnifier combos are heavier and once you add up the cost of mounts plus the optics, you're in the range of the Nightforce anyway.  And I'm not pushing the Nightforce because I have a financial incentive...I'm not a dealer for that brand.  They just make a good optic that I really like.

 

 

how much are they?

 

my aimpoint vortex magnifier was like $500

[2Alpha 6]

The vortex Razr 1-6x is awesome, fast as a red dot up close with excellent clarity and brightness

[vladtepes 1,060]

The vortex Razr 1-6x is awesome, fast as a red dot up close with excellent clarity and brightness

 

 

how rough have you been on it... because while it was definitely OK for the money... the build quality of the Aimpoint is IMO far superior.. I found the mount that it came with barely usable.. 

[MidwestPX 172]

how much are they?

 

my aimpoint vortex magnifier was like $500

Street price is around $1200.

[vladtepes 1,060]

Street price is around $1200.

 

 

I have a PRO on each of my 2 ARs and a magnifier on one.. and am not 1200 in... I am sure it is a nice optic.. but at $1200?

[Howi 0]

Honestly in not looking for tight groups at 50 yards, just rounds on target in a SD scenario. And I can center ass without the use of optics at 25 all day quickly and 50 as well just a little longer. But how fast is the target acquisition at say 75-100 with the PRO? Sorry for all the questions, I've never used a RDS or magnifier. Only acog

[vladtepes 1,060]

Honestly in not looking for tight groups at 50 yards, just rounds on target in a SD scenario. And I can center ass without the use of optics at 25 all day quickly and 50 as well just a little longer. But how fast is the target acquisition at say 75-100 with the PRO? Sorry for all the questions, I've never used a RDS or magnifier. Only acog

 

I find it faster than irons.. the idea always being 1 dot non target VS lining up a front and rear.. 

VERY fast close... 

[Howi 0]

I find it faster than irons.. the idea always being 1 dot non target VS lining up a front and rear.. 

VERY fast close...

 

Well I think u sold me, time to start selling my body...

[vladtepes 1,060]

Well I think u sold me, time to start selling my body...

 

 

they are under $400.. WITH the mount.. and are NV compatible.. I think you will be OK.. lol

[MidwestPX 172]

I have a PRO on each of my 2 ARs and a magnifier on one.. and am not 1200 in... I am sure it is a nice optic.. but at $1200?

Pro runs about $400 NIB.  The Aimpoint magnifier runs about $700 NIB.  I suppose you could go cheap and get a Primary Arms or similar to reduce the bill but then that rifle becomes a hobby gun in my eyes.  

[vladtepes 1,060]

Pro runs about $400 NIB.  The Aimpoint magnifier runs about $700 NIB.  I suppose you could go cheap and get a Primary Arms or similar to reduce the bill but then that rifle becomes a hobby gun in my eyes.  

 

the purpose of my AR is not a 300 yard gun.. within the intended use the PRO gets it done.. I have a magnifier on my rig and use it to shoot further.. but is not needed for the intended use of the gun which is close and fast.. 

[JackDaWack 2,895]

Pro runs about $400 NIB.  The Aimpoint magnifier runs about $700 NIB.  I suppose you could go cheap and get a Primary Arms or similar to reduce the bill but then that rifle becomes a hobby gun in my eyes.  

A substandard magnifier makes it a "hobby" gun? oh geese u guise..... so hard to please.. haha.

[raz-0 1,259]

How are they in the 300-500 ranges with the magnifier? Still curious on if it can take a bump or two. Thanks a lot.

 

 

 

Honestly in not looking for tight groups at 50 yards, just rounds on target in a SD scenario. And I can center ass without the use of optics at 25 all day quickly and 50 as well just a little longer. But how fast is the target acquisition at say 75-100 with the PRO? Sorry for all the questions, I've never used a RDS or magnifier. Only acog

 

 

Well the question is how good of a shot are you with irons at 500. You say you are, but is that hits on a 6 foot square, or a 5 inch plate, or somewhere in between? IF it was closer to the 6 foot square, were you relying on the elevation markings on your irons to do holdover?  If you have good eyes without an astigmatism, a 2moa dot on an aimpoint without a magnifier is going to be usable  out to 350 yards or so on 10 inch plates. It starts to get challenging with an unmodified RDS in my experience at around 250 or so, but I don't have the best eyesight. After that point, you have to see the target, deal with reduced contrast of the target to background, start dealing with holdovers bigger than the dot, and start using actual technique. A true 1-4x magnifying scope is MUCH faster than an unmagnified red dot, and IMO still likely faster than a RDS + magnifier for most people due to it being less of a compromise. 

 

Regardless of optic, dealing with just the platform, barrel choice, and the cartridge, for anything run and gun, the generally accepted 3 gun limit for not building a stage lots of people time out on is 4moa targets, and I tend to agree. 

 

Me and irons cease being on friendly terms before 200 yards for shooting something small-ish, and an unmagnified RDS (with a 3.5moa dot) hit on a 10 inch target at 350-ish is an achievement for me. 

 

However, with a good comp on my gun and 8 inch plates at 50 yards, the limiting factor on how fast I can hit them is how much I get the plate dancing. RDSs are definitely fast. However, once you enter the ranges where sight offset above bore becomes a meaningful factor, tilting the gun .45 degrees and essentially aiming down the barrel is faster, especially for multiple targets. Most of the speed picked up is due to easier transitions with both eyes open and no tube. Both eyes open, transitions to the left aren't so bad, but transitions to the right meaningful blind spot due to degree of focus down the tube and the tube wall. 

 

With proper technique on the gun, I can hit a 6" steel plate at 100 3 out of 4 times off hand with a 3.5moa RDS. For a torso sized are, it should be cake and damn fast.