anyone know if the vltor vc-1 comp is legal in nj?

[chrisfc923 14]

anyone know if the vltor vc-1 comp is legal in nj?

 

 

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/product/7-VC1

 

 

[Zerosignal 1]

I would say no..

But to add: 1) cheaper than dirt blows

2)If you check they won't ship it to NJ anyway.

[intercooler 41]

yup...it is sold as a comp, advertised as a comp...so that is what it is...

and it would seem they won't ship ANY AR parts to NJ

 

besides, they gouged like hell on everything in the craze...don't spend your $ there...they are scumbags

[Clintoon Eastwood 2]

Contacting VLTOR might be your best bet.

Or try midwayusa - http://www.midwayusa.com/product/784915/egw-muzzle-brake-a2-1-2-28-thread-post-ban-ar-15-steel-parkerized

 

If you like that look

[Lalo 13]

If you do a little digging, more places refer to it as a flash suppressor than a compensator which makes things confusing. If you look at the end of it, will it pass the cop "pinky" test? Maybe.

 

VLTOR advertises it and sells it as a comp: http://www.vltor.com/compensators.html - This is good because it can be used in your defense.

 

Their description from: http://vtsupply.com/vltor-vc-1-ar15-flash-hider-m4-ar-15-compensator-model-1-comp.html

 

"The VC-1 is a hybrid muzzle device (flash hider and compensator similar to the PWS FSC556). The VC-1 takes an opposite approach from the FSC556 with regard to function though. The VC-1 is a flash hider first with some compensating properties, while the FSC556 is a compensator first with some nominal flash-hiding properties (it has been classed by the ATF as a non-flash suppressing device). Because of this, while both are excellent devices and perform both duties well, the FSC556 is more "blasty" in comparison."

 

Could that description go both ways? Maybe, i dont like the word hybrid. How would a prosecutor see it? I don't know. A letter from VLTOR saying its ONLY a comp would go a long way.

 

You should be ok, but if it was me, I wouldn't get it. Too many maybes and confusing descriptions that could be misconstrued.

[Zerosignal 1]

How about the BCM comp as another option for ya?

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCMGUNFIGHTER-Compensator-MOD-0-5-56-p/bcm-gfc-mod-0-556.htm

[checko 180]

I'm not sure, so then my answer to you would be no. It wouldn't pass the infamous "pinky test".  Yes I know thats not in the law anywhere, but if I have a local smokey poking around my rifle, and thats the first thing he thinks of, I want to pass before I have to go to court. 

[JackDaWack 2,895]

IMO, if it says ANYTHING about suppressing flash i would steer clear. There is no "pinky test" that would fly in a court room.. just standard flash from a crowned barrel and any device that would further suppress that flash.. that's all the court would have to prove.. Your defense would be that the company described the product as a compensator, and just that...

[vladtepes 1,060]

yup...it is sold as a comp, advertised as a comp...so that is what it is...

and it would seem they won't ship ANY AR parts to NJ

 

besides, they gouged like hell on everything in the craze...don't spend your $ there...they are scumbags

 

 

that is NOT good advice... just because it does not say hider does not make it NJ OK... 

[Turbotezza 1]

that is NOT good advice... just because it does not say hider does not make it NJ OK... 

I say it could be argued the other way as well.

[Turbotezza 1]

What is important (barring an official test by BATFE or a State test) is what the manufacturer says and I don't see anywhere on Vltor's site that says it is a hybrid.

If you do a little digging, more places refer to it as a flash suppressor than a compensator which makes things confusing. If you look at the end of it, will it pass the cop "pinky" test? Maybe.

VLTOR advertises it and sells it as a comp: http://www.vltor.com/compensators.html - This is good because it can be used in your defense.

Their description from: http://vtsupply.com/vltor-vc-1-ar15-flash-hider-m4-ar-15-compensator-model-1-comp.html

"The VC-1 is a hybrid muzzle device (flash hider and compensator similar to the PWS FSC556). The VC-1 takes an opposite approach from the FSC556 with regard to function though. The VC-1 is a flash hider first with some compensating properties, while the FSC556 is a compensator first with some nominal flash-hiding properties (it has been classed by the ATF as a non-flash suppressing device). Because of this, while both are excellent devices and perform both duties well, the FSC556 is more "blasty" in comparison."

Could that description go both ways? Maybe, i dont like the word hybrid. How would a prosecutor see it? I don't know. A letter from VLTOR saying its ONLY a comp would go a long way.

You should be ok, but if it was me, I wouldn't get it. Too many maybes and confusing descriptions that could be misconstrued.

[chrisfc923 14]

yeah i think since there is some question whether or not it's legal will make me pass. its not worth the risk. just looking for some type of comp that isn't overly obnoxious. might go with a linear comp like the st dynacomp or kies... any recommendations?

[FLHX 1]

I have used a few comps and the one I liked the best and I thought worked the best is the Griffin M4SDII (see link)

 

http://www.joeboboutfitters.com/Griffin_Armament_M4SD_II_Tactical_Compensator_XHP5_p/ga-xhp556tc.htm

[Lalo 13]

I have the Troy Medieval and Claymore on two of my AR's. I'm liking the Troy Medieval more and more every time I use it.

 

[vladtepes 1,060]

I say it could be argued the other way as well.

In all honesty unless the brake has a letter from ATF saying it does not significantly reduce flash you are rolling the dice... I could make a flash hide call it a brake and sell it to you... If it hides flash it's still a flash hider....

[chrisfc923 14]

I have the Troy Medieval and Claymore on two of my AR's. I'm liking the Troy Medieval more and more every time I use it.

 

was looking at those... how the sound output to the side of the shooter?

[checko 180]

was looking at those... how the sound output to the side of the shooter?

Can I ask why that's important to you?

[Lalo 13]

was looking at those... how the sound output to the side of the shooter?

 

The Troy Medieval comp has three ports, one facing up and two facing left and right. Shooting it outdoors, I haven't really noticed anything out of the norm as far as the side blasts are concerned. People haven't complained or said anything to me about getting hit with the blast or sound being too loud.

 

Shooting it indoors is a different story though. I remember shooting it at RTSP when the person next to me had their target pulled all the way back in and I could see that after every shot, their target would catch the blast and it'd be blown around. I stopped of course and we laughed about it and afterwards when they had their target back out, they didn't complain about it being overly loud. I think that is the same with most muzzle brakes though, it's not the first time I've seen that, and it's happened to me as well.

 

____

 

If you're really that worried about the side blasts/sound, then look into the Troy Claymore. It has no side ports at all and all the blast/sound get directed in front of you. It's supposed to add a little more felt recoil but to be honest, I cant say I feel anything abnormal about that. Shooting the Claymore indoors though, funny, If someone next to me has their target at 10yds or less, their target would blow and flap around after every shot. Again, nothing too abnormal there but I CAN tell the difference between the Claymore versus others.

[T Bill 649]

This is sold by Rainier as the XTC, extreme tactical compensator,

 

Same issues here as well possibly?

 

[chrisfc923 14]

This is sold by Rainier as the XTC, extreme tactical compensator,

 

Same issues here as well possibly?

 

i recall reading somewhere that this was NJ legal... In fact I even remember seeing a pic with that comp on there in a thread labeled pic of NJ legal rifles or something like that. Got to search for it now  lol

[polpol 1]

How about the BCM comp as another option for ya?

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCMGUNFIGHTER-Compensator-MOD-0-5-56-p/bcm-gfc-mod-0-556.htm

 

is the BCM mentioned above, NJ legal???

[Lalo 13]

is the BCM mentioned above, NJ legal???

 

The general rule that I made up that I have in my head about legal NJ compensators is this:

 

If the hole on the comp where the bullet passes through is larger than the size of the bullet or is in any other shape other than round, then I would be extremely careful and do some research before acquiring it.

 

Run a google search on "AR muzzle brake" or AR compensator". 95% of the images you see have a hole barely big enough for the bullet to pass through. Kind of like this PSA pigsticker comp I'm also running on another AR. These, in my eyes, WILL pass the "pinky test".

 

 

The BCM Mod-0 is definitely advertized as a compensator, however, it does have some "flash hiding" capabilities... Remember what Vlad said above???

 

______________

This Compensator was not designed as a gamers comp.  It was designed for tactical applications to reduce muzzle rise, flash signature, noise, and lateral pressure.

 

The BCMGUNFIGHTER Compensator Mod 0-5.56

 

• Exterior dimensions consistent with Mil-specs for mounting BFA or flash hider mounted  suppressors.
•  

• Tuned slots and interior cone offer maximum in recoil mitigations, compensation of muzzle-rise, and flash reduction.
•  

• Designed to have much less side blast and noise associated with typical compensators.  Makes it perfect for working in teams for CQB.  It is a compensator that is built for the 21st Century Gunfighter!
•  
• Stainless Steel construction for maximum corrosion resistance
•  
• Includes a Crush Washer
•  
• Should be installed by a qualified military armorer.
•  

____

 

Listen, I'm not saying it's illegal, after all, what do I know, I'm just an internet mall ninja. I'm sure there are people in NJ that are running this comp. Hell, I'm sure there are people in NJ with 30 round magazines and unshaven bayo lugs on their uppers as well. Personally, I wouldn't get it because it doesn't pass my own made up rule that I listed above.

[checko 180]

High Exposure posted in one of these threads somewhere about talking to an njsp guy regarding how they check for flash supressors. I'll search it when I get home

[Holeshot 3]

Just remember to apply the completely made up NJGF "pinky test" and you will be safe. Lol

 

It is no wonder why we are in the shape we are in.

[checko 180]

Just remember to apply the completely made up NJGF "pinky test" and you will be safe. Lol It is no wonder why we are in the shape we are in.

 

I know this doesn't help you with your short barrel but...First a disclaimer - IANAL - the below information is from a discussion with a Lt at the NJSP Ballistics Unit. I have no documentation on this. Also keep on mind, most of the decisions regarding what is "evil" and passes the assault rifle "test" is legal OPINION based on the law as written and not factual definitions.According to the NJSP Ballistics unit, they don't follow the Fed guideline for the definition of a Flash Hider - they do not measure the actual flash suppressing qualities of the device, although they do recommend following the Fed Definitions as a good guideline. The NJSP definition is if the opening in the muzzle device that the bullet exits is the same as the caliber being shot through it (with a few fraction of an inch as appropriate).Basically, if a 5.56/.223 projectile travels through a ~ 5.56.223 opening through a solid disk after leaving the end of the barrel but before leaving the end of the muzzle device you should be good to go. The "pinky test" is a good guideline - If you can reach your pinky (or larger then caliber specific rod) thought the muzzle device and touch the end of the barrel directly = Flash hider. If not = muzzle break/comp. There are exceptions, think vortex style. Flash hider where, you can't reach your pinky all the way down, but the muzzle device is open with prongs going all the way to the barrel in the sides, there is no "disk" with appropriate sized opening.I know, I know, as with most things in this state, clear as Mud. Anyway...Two that I know are good (they are legal, because I asked specifically about these two, and work great) - the PWS FSC556 and the Battle Comp. I am still wondering about the NJ Legality of the BCM comps.

No need to be condescending holeshot. I think we all know its not a definitive answer for legality, just a guideline to stay in. If you, or anyone else, want to buy and open ended "comp" in NJ and be the test case, I'm all for it. At least it will help the others.

[Holeshot 3]

No need to be condescending holeshot. I think we all know its not a definitive answer for legality, just a guideline to stay in. If you, or anyone else, want to buy and open ended "comp" in NJ and be the test case, I'm all for it. At least it will help the others.

 

Not trying to be. Just trying to point out that there is no "official" test or written guideline.

 

You referenced HE's post.

 

I respect him and have no reason to not believe him or his conversation. 

 

If you were in court and they called upon a  NJSP LT in the ballistics unit as an expert, I would say you would have a hard time proving otherwise.

 

Anyway in the post he says that he was told the "pinky test"  was a good guideline.

 

He also stated that the PWS FSC556 is good to go in NJ.

 

I can put my pinky finger into the end of the PWS FSC556.

 

[Holeshot 3]

Why wouldn't the NJSP instead say to use the PWS TTO with no flash suppressing tangs?

 

Let's use a 16" barrel not a 14.5" for these examples.

 

[checko 180]

I'm not sure, so then my answer to you would be no. It wouldn't pass the infamous "pinky test".  Yes I know thats not in the law anywhere, but if I have a local smokey poking around my rifle, and thats the first thing he thinks of, I want to pass before I have to go to court. 

 

 

Just remember to apply the completely made up NJGF "pinky test" and you will be safe. Lol

 

It is no wonder why we are in the shape we are in.

 

That seemed condescending to me.  Anyway,

 

Not trying to be. Just trying to point out that there is no "official" test or written guideline.

 

You referenced HE's post.

 

I respect him and have no reason to not believe him or his conversation. 

 

If you were in court and they called upon a  NJSP LT in the ballistics unit as an expert, I would say you would have a hard time proving otherwise.

 

Anyway in the post he says that he was told the "pinky test"  was a good guideline.

 

He also stated that the PWS FSC556 is good to go in NJ.

 

I can put my pinky finger into the end of the PWS FSC556.

 

As you can see by my above post, I already stated it is no written law, again just a way to try to keep law abiding folks out of trouble.  

 

As for that comp, as you can see here:

It does seem to have a closed end, or baffle, near the end of the comp that is just big enough to send a bullet through, very similar to the guideline written previously.   I've met you, and I'd be very surprised if you can fit your pinky through there. 

[Holeshot 3]

No of course not.  I cannot touch the end of the barrel through the FSC556 but I can put my pinky into the end of it.  

 

Same as the BCM Comp.

 

 

 

[checko 180]

I won't argue that point with you.  The only sticking point I have about the BCM is what Vlad and Lalo alluded to earlier.  Yes, it is listed as a compensator, but is heavily marketed for having "maximum flash reduction".  Again, we'd have to have a guinea pig to be certain it would be ok or not, which I'm not willing to be. 

Back to the OP,

That is what is alarming right off the bat.