Long Arm Carry

[Grapeshot 301]

OK, I know this has been beaten to death here, but I cannot find a reference to this in the law.

 

Conventional wisdom here is that with an FPID I can carry unloaded long arms in my car and not have to worry about the whole “direct to and from the range” part of the law. I’ve seen posts that say that as long as I have my FPID I can drive around all day with a rifle in my trunk, as long as it is unloaded (and I stay out of school zones). But I can’t find any post that actually points to this in the law – it is all opinion. There are also a bunch of links in the FAQ that are broken. As far as I can tell NJ makes no distinction between handguns and longarms – they are all “firearms”.

 

I apologize if my searching skills are not up to par, but can someone please point me to this exception in the law? Not your opinion, but where it actually says this.

 

 

BTW - my card was re-issued in January of 2010, and it only says "purchase".

 

Thanks

 

[Smokin .50 1,907]

If you want all of the actual laws, do yourself a favor and buy Nappen's book.

 

Keep in mind that since it isn't YET against the law to BREATHE in NJ, there isn't a law prohibiting it.  Not every point is 100% clear, and so some are left up to common-sense and extrapolation (as in breathing AIR).  So it is with firearms laws.  

 

It's not illegal to walk up stairs while whistling, but you can't find a law about it.

 

Put another way:  If I was an agent of the super-secret drone police and I had a bird circling your house right now and could watch you put a 12 ga. into your car's trunk and then go to the mall to do some shopping, do you actually think I'd have my SWAT team encircle your vehicle, blow the lock with some C-4, gather the evidence and then surround the storefront waiting for your return?  Sound a little Tin-Foily to you?  Good!  Now just don't keep trying to find laws written telling you you CAN do something......

 

No doubt someone here will re-post the entire sordid details with which you can then see that it's perfectly LEGAL to have a long gun as long as you have been "carded" a FPID.  But you'd have to be a complete idiot to believe anything anybody types on a forum while hiding behind a screen name, RIGHT?  So buy the book!!!!!!!

[ryan_j 0]

Conventional wisdom here is that with an FPID I can carry unloaded long arms in my car and not have to worry about the whole “direct to and from the range” part of the law. I’ve seen posts that say that as long as I have my FPID I can drive around all day with a rifle in my trunk, as long as it is unloaded (and I stay out of school zones). But I can’t find any post that actually points to this in the law – it is all opinion. There are also a bunch of links in the FAQ that are broken. As far as I can tell NJ makes no distinction between handguns and longarms – they are all “firearms”.

 

It's in 2C:39-5. Right at the beginning. 

 

NJ does in fact distinguish between handguns and long arms.

 

NJ doesn't talk about carry except when referring to the permit to carry. It talks about possession (which is why the right to carry is important, it's about a right to possess). 

 

So if you want to possess a handgun, you need a permit to carry a handgun.

If you want to possess a rifle or shotgun, you need a firearms purchaser ID card.

 

Then there are the exceptions which say that you can possess in certain places ONLY and transport directly to and from (2C:39-6).  

 

2C:39-5. Unlawful possession of weapons.

 

     2C:39-5. Unlawful possession of weapons. a. Machine guns. Any person who knowingly has in his possession a machine gun or any instrument or device adaptable for use as a machine gun, without being licensed to do so as provided in N.J.S.2C:58-5, is guilty of a crime of the second degree.

 

     b.     Handguns. Any person who knowingly has in his possession any handgun, including any antique handgun, without first having obtained a permit to carry the same as provided in N.J.S.2C:58-4, is guilty of a crime of the third degree if the handgun is in the nature of an air gun, spring gun or pistol or other weapon of a similar nature in which the propelling force is a spring, elastic band, carbon dioxide, compressed or other gas or vapor, air or compressed air, or is ignited by compressed air, and ejecting a bullet or missile smaller than three-eighths of an inch in diameter, with sufficient force to injure a person. Otherwise it is a crime of the second degree.

 

     c.     Rifles and shotguns. (1) Any person who knowingly has in his possession any rifle or shotgun without having first obtained a firearms purchaser identification card in accordance with the provisions of N.J.S.2C:58-3, is guilty of a crime of the third degree.

 

     (2)     Unless otherwise permitted by law, any person who knowingly has in his possession any loaded rifle or shotgun is guilty of a crime of the third degree.

 

     d.     Other weapons. Any person who knowingly has in his possession any other weapon under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for such lawful uses as it may have is guilty of a crime of the fourth degree.

 

     e.     Firearms or other weapons in educational institutions.

 

     (1)     Any person who knowingly has in his possession any firearm in or upon any part of the buildings or grounds of any school, college, university or other educational institution, without the written authorization of the governing officer of the institution, is guilty of a crime of the third degree, irrespective of whether he possesses a valid permit to carry the firearm or a valid firearms purchaser identification card.

 

     (2)     Any person who knowingly possesses any weapon enumerated in paragraphs (3) and (4) of subsection r. of N.J.S.2C:39-1 or any components which can readily be assembled into a firearm or other weapon enumerated in subsection r. of N.J.S.2C:39-1 or any other weapon under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for such lawful use as it may have, while in or upon any part of the buildings or grounds of any school, college, university or other educational institution without the written authorization of the governing officer of the institution is guilty of a crime of the fourth degree.

 

     (3)     Any person who knowingly has in his possession any imitation firearm in or upon any part of the buildings or grounds of any school, college, university or other educational institution, without the written authorization of the governing officer of the institution, or while on any school bus is a disorderly person, irrespective of whether he possesses a valid permit to carry a firearm or a valid firearms purchaser identification card.

 

     f.     Assault firearms. Any person who knowingly has in his possession an assault firearm is guilty of a crime of the second degree except if the assault firearm is licensed pursuant to N.J.S.2C:58-5; registered pursuant to section 11 of P.L.1990, c.32 (C.2C:58-12); or rendered inoperable pursuant to section 12 of P.L.1990, c.32 (C.2C:58-13).

 

     g. (1) The temporary possession of a handgun, rifle or shotgun by a person receiving, possessing, carrying or using the handgun, rifle, or shotgun under the provisions of section 1 of P.L.1992, c.74 (C.2C:58-3.1) shall not be considered unlawful possession under the provisions of subsection b. or c. of this section.

 

     (2)     The temporary possession of a firearm by a person receiving, possessing, carrying or using the firearm under the provisions of section 1 of P.L.1997, c.375 (C.2C:58-3.2) shall not be considered unlawful possession under the provisions of this section.

 

     h.     A person who is convicted of a crime under subsection a., b. or f. of this section shall be ineligible for participation in any program of intensive supervision; provided, however, that this provision shall not apply to a crime under subsection b. involving only a handgun which is in the nature of an air gun, spring gun or pistol or other weapon of a similar nature in which the propelling force is a spring, elastic band, carbon dioxide, compressed or other gas or vapor, air or compressed air, or is ignited by compressed air, and ejecting a bullet or missile smaller than three-eighths of an inch in diameter, with sufficient force to injure a person.

 

     i.     A person convicted of violating subsection a., b. or f. of this section shall be sentenced by the court to a term of imprisonment, which shall include the imposition of a minimum term during which the defendant shall be ineligible for parole, if the court finds that the aggravating circumstance set forth in paragraph (5) of subsection a. of N.J.S.2C:44-1 applies. The minimum term of parole ineligibility shall be fixed at five years. The sentencing court shall make a finding on the record as to whether the aggravating circumstance set forth in paragraph (5) of subsection a. of N.J.S.2C:44-1 applies, and the court shall presume that there is a substantial likelihood that the defendant is involved in organized criminal activity if there is a substantial likelihood that the defendant is a member of an organization or group that engages in criminal activity. The prosecution at the sentencing hearing shall have the initial burden of producing evidence or information concerning the defendant's membership in such an organization or group.

 

     Amended 1979, c.179, s.4; 1990, c.32, s.2; 1992, c.74, s.2; 1992, c.94, s.1; 1995, c.389; 1997, c.375, s.2; 2007, c.284; 2009, c.13.

[Grapeshot 301]

Not to belabor the point, but doesn't this trump everything else? It's the any firearm part that I'm trying to understand.

 

N.J.S.2C:39-5f states:

(1) A member of any rifle or pistol club organized in accordance with the rules prescribed by the National Board for the Promotion of Rifle Practice, in going to or from a place of target practice, carrying such firearms as are necessary for said target practice, provided that the club has filed a copy of its charter with the superintendent and annually submits a list of its members to the superintendent and provided further that the firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section;

(2) A person carrying a firearm or knife in the woods or fields or upon the waters of this State for the purpose of hunting, target practice or fishing, provided that the firearm or knife is legal and appropriate for hunting or fishing purposes in this State and he has in his possession a valid hunting license, or, with respect to fresh water fishing, a valid fishing license;

(3) A person transporting any firearm or knife while traveling:

(a) Directly to or from any place for the purpose of hunting or fishing, provided the person has in his possession a valid hunting or fishing license; or

(b) Directly to or from any target range, or other authorized place for the purpose of practice, match, target, trap or skeet shooting exhibitions, provided in all cases that during the course of the travel all firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section and the person has complied with all the provisions and requirements of Title 23 of the Revised Statutes and any amendments thereto and all rules and regulations promulgated thereunder; or

© In the case of a firearm, directly to or from any exhibition or display of firearms which is sponsored by any law enforcement agency, any rifle or pistol club, or any firearms collectors club, for the purpose of displaying the firearms to the public or to the members of the organization or club, provided, however, that not less than 30 days prior to the exhibition or display, notice of the exhibition or display shall be given to the Superintendent of the State Police by the sponsoring organization or club, and the sponsor has complied with such reasonable safety regulations as the superintendent may promulgate. Any firearms transported pursuant to this section shall be transported in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section;

http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/about/fire_ag2.html

[Grapeshot 301]

... And let me try to explain why I am asking. Next week my buddy and I are heading out for a weekend of shooting, in NJ. Rifles only, no pistols. We will be staying in a hotel Saturday night, and don’t want to leave our guns in the room unattended when we go to dinner. I say they will be fine in the trunk, and he is freaking out. I just want to point to something to set his mind at ease.

[maintenanceguy 510]

No.  The first part of the law posted by ryan_j lists the things that can't be possessed in NJ - the prohibitions.  One of those things is a rifle or shotgun unless you have an FID card.

 

The second part posted by Grapeshot lists the exceptions to the prohibitions.  and tells you how you must transport if you're transporting under an exception or under the prohibitions.

 

So, you can't possess a rifle or shotgun unless you have an FID is listed before the exceptions so it's allowed, even if you don't fall into one of the exceptions, like to and from the range.  But you still must transport under the rules of section g: 

 

"All weapons being transported under paragraph (2) of subsection b., subsection e., or paragraph (1) or (3) of subsection f. of this section shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported, and in the course of travel shall include only such deviations as are reasonably necessary under the circumstances.”

 

Older FID cards had a statement on them that the possessor of this card is lawfully allowed to transport rifles and shotguns.   It's not on the newer cards.

[ryan_j 0]

 

Not to belabor the point, but doesn't this trump everything else? It's the any firearm part that I'm trying to understand.

 

N.J.S.2C:39-5f states:

(1) A member of any rifle or pistol club organized in accordance with the rules prescribed by the National Board for the Promotion of Rifle Practice, in going to or from a place of target practice, carrying such firearms as are necessary for said target practice, provided that the club has filed a copy of its charter with the superintendent and annually submits a list of its members to the superintendent and provided further that the firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section;

 

(2) A person carrying a firearm or knife in the woods or fields or upon the waters of this State for the purpose of hunting, target practice or fishing, provided that the firearm or knife is legal and appropriate for hunting or fishing purposes in this State and he has in his possession a valid hunting license, or, with respect to fresh water fishing, a valid fishing license;

 

(3) A person transporting any firearm or knife while traveling:

 

(a) Directly to or from any place for the purpose of hunting or fishing, provided the person has in his possession a valid hunting or fishing license; or

 

(b) Directly to or from any target range, or other authorized place for the purpose of practice, match, target, trap or skeet shooting exhibitions, provided in all cases that during the course of the travel all firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section and the person has complied with all the provisions and requirements of Title 23 of the Revised Statutes and any amendments thereto and all rules and regulations promulgated thereunder; or

 

© In the case of a firearm, directly to or from any exhibition or display of firearms which is sponsored by any law enforcement agency, any rifle or pistol club, or any firearms collectors club, for the purpose of displaying the firearms to the public or to the members of the organization or club, provided, however, that not less than 30 days prior to the exhibition or display, notice of the exhibition or display shall be given to the Superintendent of the State Police by the sponsoring organization or club, and the sponsor has complied with such reasonable safety regulations as the superintendent may promulgate. Any firearms transported pursuant to this section shall be transported in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section;

http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/about/fire_ag2.html

 

 

No that is 2C:39-6f, and is prefaced by:

 

  f.     Nothing in subsections b., c. and d. of N.J.S.2C:39-5 shall be construed to prevent:

 

So basically it means without a FID card you can do everything under f, as prescribed, but if you have a FPID card you can possess in general. 

 

Think about it, if 2C:39-6f applied the way you thought, then it would mean that people with carry permits would not be able to carry. 

[Smokin .50 1,907]

HERE WE GO AGAIN!    

 

I'll tell you what.  I'll put your minds at ease.  Just put the rifles in your trunk, drive to my house on the way to dinner.  I'll sign some C.O.E.'s for you, uncase them, take-off the trigger locks, and SECURE THEM in the trunk of MY CAR!  You and your Buddy go to dinner.  Get drunk, get laid, take a shower and come back and we'll tear-up the C.O.E.'s and you can have your long guns back!

 

There...I FIXED THE WHOLE PROBLEM!

[Grapeshot 301]

We'll be in South Jersey around Williamstown - any good restaurant recommendations?

 

 

Any of 'em got a safe?

[PK90 3,569]

We'll be in South Jersey around Williamstown - any good restaurant recommendations?

 

 

Any of 'em got a safe?

 

Peter's on BHP

[Smokin .50 1,907]

We'll be in South Jersey around Williamstown - any good restaurant recommendations?

 

 

Any of 'em got a safe?

 

Library IV on the BHP in Williamstown.  I've eaten there myself when my son was attending Rowan in Glassboro.  Hand-cut steaks.  NOT cheap, but then some of the best never is.  30 foot-long salad bar!

 

For Diners, you really have only two good ones: Geets & Peter's.

 

Plenty of fast food joints all over the BHP.

 

Enjoy the range and dining experience.

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

Where's the match? SJSC?