The Generator Thread

[T Bill 649]

Just as a side note.  Does not have to be a standy unit.  Can be a portable as long as it's used as a home standby unit, over 3,000 watts and not a honda.  FYI

[ryan_j 0]

It would be simply awesome if they produced a standby inverter generator. A fully automatic standby that will not cost me $1000 in propane to run for a week and ran all of my electronics without issue? Want.

[Sota 1,191]

I always figured, if your backup fuel choice is propane, you should really look into diesel. Every person I know who's considered using propane during a time of need has choked at the cost and rate of consumption.

[Nac 3]

Just as a side note. Does not have to be a standy unit. Can be a portable as long as it's used as a home standby unit, over 3,000 watts and not a honda. FYI

I have a Ingersoll Rand with Honda Motor 7KW portable that is bolted to my work truck that i use for a backup gen i had my house wired with a transfer switch and remote plug . I wonder if that qualify ?

 

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[Porthole 15]

I always figured, if your backup fuel choice is propane, you should really look into diesel. Every person I know who's considered using propane during a time of need has choked at the cost and rate of consumption.

 

Storing diesel for extended periods has a set of issues that could end up being more costly then the propane.

 

Sitting diesel is subject to algae and bacteria growth. Even with additives.

[T Bill 649]

Nac, the way it was presented, and I understand it, is as I stated earlier.  Over 3000 watts, used as standby, and non Honda.  I would think you qualify.  True the motor is a Honda but I believe they are talking about the genset part of it.

[Sota 1,191]

Storing diesel for extended periods has a set of issues that could end up being more costly then the propane.

 

Sitting diesel is subject to algae and bacteria growth. Even with additives.

Best I can say on that is, plan on cycling it through a diesel vechicle. I've been doing something like that with my gas generator... fill up my 6 5gallon cans and rotate them through my one car.

[johnott 5]

I know a generato'rs output voltage is regulated and most are fine for running lights, freezers, small motors and the like, but not all generators claim to be suitable for sensitive electronic equipment.

 

Question: What do you use to filter or regulate your generator output to supply power to your portable electronic devices (Laptops, cell phone chargers etc...)?    

 

I am concerned that my generator may not produce a clean and stable enough output voltage for these items. I don't want to ruin anything. If you know what I mean.

[Porthole 15]

I know a generato'rs output voltage is regulated and most are fine for running lights, freezers, small motors and the like, but not all generators claim to be suitable for sensitive electronic equipment.

 

Question: What do you use to filter or regulate your generator output to supply power to your portable electronic devices (Laptops, cell phone chargers etc...)?    

 

I am concerned that my generator may not produce a clean and stable enough output voltage for these items. I don't want to ruin anything. If you know what I mean.

 

Your laptops and cell phones are getting "clean" power through the device's power supply (120AC --> 5-12 volts DC or AC in some cases)

 

For the rest of my stuff - I use two of the Costco carried UPS units.

 

One for the desktop computer, monitor, printer etc and a second one in my main TV room, TV, receiver, SAT receiver DVD etc.

[Sota 1,191]

APC UPSes. You can pick up the older SmartUPS series for cheap online and stuff new batteries in them. The 1400's were tank like in reliability (just use the right size batteries! not too big or too small!) and do nicely in an outage.

[Malsua 1,422]

I always figured, if your backup fuel choice is propane, you should really look into diesel. Every person I know who's considered using propane during a time of need has choked at the cost and rate of consumption.

 

I have a 500 gallon propane tank, my 14kw uses under 1 gallon of propane an hour at my loads, which include a sump pump, furnace and all the comforts.   I pay exactly $2.57/gallon, which, all things considered, I find quite reasonable when the utility power is out.   While propane has roughly 2/3 the amount of energy as Diesel, it can sit in my tank for the next 100 years and not degrade at all.  Not to mention, I also have a furnace, stove and dryer that use the same tank, so I don't need to pay attention to multiple types of fuel for emergency backup.  

 

Diesel may work for some folks, but since I need propane anyway, diesel doesn't make any sense for me.  Diesel is currently running about $3.70 a gallon.  The efficiency/cost difference is just about a wash.  Add in that you still need to rotate it, the downsides are too high for me.    If you're buying Blue Rhino tanks at $6 a gallon, you're right, I'd choke at that too.

[T Bill 649]

I think if you have propane for heating, cooking, clothes dryer, etc., then for standby power that is the way to go.  Given how often it will be really used and that the motor will run cleaner are all pluses. 

True a slow turn diesel is the cat's meow for standby power, the constant monitoring of fuel quality does have its drawbacks.  Gotta keep that tank always full to keep contamination at a minimum.

Let's face it, its only a backup until you get an idea what your next step would be.  Longest I went on it was 13 days, and the weather after the storm was with us.  In a bad ice storm the kind they have up near Canadian border would change things a lot.

[olderguy 0]

I know a generato'rs output voltage is regulated and most are fine for running lights, freezers, small motors and the like, but not all generators claim to be suitable for sensitive electronic equipment.

 

Question: What do you use to filter or regulate your generator output to supply power to your portable electronic devices (Laptops, cell phone chargers etc...)?    

 

I am concerned that my generator may not produce a clean and stable enough output voltage for these items. I don't want to ruin anything. If you know what I mean.

Years ago when I lived in Warren, we had an ice storm that knocked out power for 7 days.  I survived with a WWII surplus 5000 watt generator that ran everything fine, except for the TV.  The output was so noisy that it fried the circuitry.  But the microwave survived.  I still have that generator sitting in the cellar of this house; why, I don't know.

[Sota 1,191]

I have a 500 gallon propane tank, my 14kw uses under 1 gallon of propane an hour at my loads, which include a sump pump, furnace and all the comforts.   I pay exactly $2.57/gallon, which, all things considered, I find quite reasonable when the utility power is out.   While propane has roughly 2/3 the amount of energy as Diesel, it can sit in my tank for the next 100 years and not degrade at all.  Not to mention, I also have a furnace, stove and dryer that use the same tank, so I don't need to pay attention to multiple types of fuel for emergency backup.  

 

Diesel may work for some folks, but since I need propane anyway, diesel doesn't make any sense for me.  Diesel is currently running about $3.70 a gallon.  The efficiency/cost difference is just about a wash.  Add in that you still need to rotate it, the downsides are too high for me.    If you're buying Blue Rhino tanks at $6 a gallon, you're right, I'd choke at that too.

Sounds like you worked out the math well for your situation. The couple people I've helped run their numbers aren't in as good a spot. 100 gallon tanks, heat pump systems, propane heat backup. When we did the math for his consumption numbers in temps below 32F it worked out to him nuking the tank in 36 hours, assuming it was full. That heat pump needs a LOT of electricity to run apparently.

 

Me personally, I'll be running the generator on natural gas with gasoline as the "backup" fuel. (Sandy was eye opening... have a backup plan for fuel supply.)

[Porthole 15]

APC UPSes. You can pick up the older SmartUPS series for cheap online and stuff new batteries in them. The 1400's were tank like in reliability (just use the right size batteries! not too big or too small!) and do nicely in an outage.

 

The newest UPS's that Costco carries use about 10-15% of the grid power on standby that previous units used. My older units were always very warm to the touch. The one sitting under my desk now is nice and cool with a just noticeable temp change near the very rear at the vents.

 

Wasted heat is wasted energy.

[Porthole 15]

Me personally, I'll be running the generator on natural gas with gasoline as the "backup" fuel. (Sandy was eye opening... have a backup plan for fuel supply.)

 

Natural Gas for me as well.

But my backup will be the Honda 3000IS and a Tractor Supply 14 gallon gas caddy to keep it topped off.

[Jersey Joe 4]

 

Me personally, I'll be running the generator on natural gas with gasoline as the "backup" fuel. (Sandy was eye opening... have a backup plan for fuel supply.)

That's my plan also...

[Sota 1,191]

The newest UPS's that Costco carries use about 10-15% of the grid power on standby that previous units used. My older units were always very warm to the touch. The one sitting under my desk now is nice and cool with a just noticeable temp change near the very rear at the vents.

 

Wasted heat is wasted energy.

just be careful and make sure you research what kind of output and line connectivity they supply. Switching units can sometimes not be fast enough for the modern high efficiency power supplies coming in a lot of computer gear these days. Also what kind of waveform output they have. APC's SmartUPS has a pure sine wave output. The BackUPS units are modified square wave. The SmartUPS units also have efficiency in the high 80% to low/mid 90% range, depending on size and load. Their RT (real-time) line has much lower efficiency since it does double conversion. They're needed for some of those super-sensitive power supplies out there.

[Sota 1,191]

Natural Gas for me as well.

But my backup will be the Honda 3000IS and a Tractor Supply 14 gallon gas caddy to keep it topped off.

I'll be getting one of the HF units in a couple months and installing the NG kit on it. That is if this cold weather ever breaks long enough for me to pour some concrete.

[Porthole 15]

just be careful and make sure you research what kind of output and line connectivity they supply. Switching units can sometimes not be fast enough for the modern high efficiency power supplies coming in a lot of computer gear these days. Also what kind of waveform output they have. APC's SmartUPS has a pure sine wave output. The BackUPS units are modified square wave. The SmartUPS units also have efficiency in the high 80% to low/mid 90% range, depending on size and load. Their RT (real-time) line has much lower efficiency since it does double conversion. They're needed for some of those super-sensitive power supplies out there.

 

$89 the last time I picked one up (month or two ago at Costco)

 

http://www.cyberpowersystems.com/products/ups-systems/intelligent-lcd-ups/CP1500AVRLCD.html

[Sota 1,191]

I can't speak about the cyberpower units, but I can say that there's a reason I've stuck with APC's SmartUPS line of units. I personally have several that are over a decade old and other than batteries every couple of years have been flawless. I also personally scoped the output waveform and looked for any transfer/switching "glitch" on them back then... there's none to speak of. That's why I keep them around.

[Malsua 1,422]

I received the confirmation call yesterday from Honda, they are still planning on coming by today.  I should have more information this afternoon.

[Malsua 1,422]

4 guys came and asked me about a lot of things, and you're right, they're more into portables, mine was the first fixed installation.

 

Who wants to know the payola?

[olderguy 0]

4 guys came and asked me about a lot of things, and you're right, they're more into portables, mine was the first fixed installation.

 

Who wants to know the payola?

I do.  They are coming here tomorrow.

[T Bill 649]

Please, fill me in.  Just confirmed tomorrow.  Looking to build bigger portables?

[Malsua 1,422]

I believe they are trying to figure out things that people want in their portables.  Also, the engineer wanted to see how it was attached to my main power so I showed him the internals of the transfer switch.

 

I had a 4k portable and they were interested in what I would have liked to see added to it.

 

dual or tri fuel was my #1

ability to change from bonded to floating neutral was another

 

an hour meter would be nice, I'm not sure i"d pay extra for it.

 

They are also curious as to know what you use power for in an outage, i.e. what are your critical items. 

 

For me it's the sump pumps.  My step dad needs his medical stuff.

 

Very nice guys from the midwest somewhere and the engineers were clearly from Japan.

 

At the end they gave me a Visa gift card worth a Franklin.

 

It took about 45 minutes.

[T Bill 649]

Thankx for the heads up.  Worth 45 minutes for me.  I guess I'm what they're looking for, a portable connected to the house.  Important to me is heat, fridge and well pump.

[Sota 1,191]

they need anyone else to talk to?

funny part, I just put in an APC UTS10BI... one of the transfer switches that was designed to work with a couple Honda generators back in the day.

[olderguy 0]

The group left a little while ago.  Very nice people and they seemed genuinely interested while I rambled on.

[Malsua 1,422]

That reflects my experience.

 

Two midwesterner guys, one being Byron I believe and two Japanese engineers, one speaking better English than the other?