Estate Target Loads Failure To Fire?

[W2MC 1,699]

Has anyone else run into a failure to fire issue with Estate shot shells?

 

I have a couple of cases of Estate 12 gauge #8 target ammo, and it seems that there is one or two shells in each box that won't fire.  

 

I've tried them in three different guns....an 870 wingmaster, a winchester 96 over/under, and another shooter's browning BPS...seems there's one or two duds included with every box.

 

What I do see when looking at the base of the shells is the primer seems more recessed into the shell on some; particularly the ones that won't fire - which I suspect is the problem.  The primer is dimpled, but not hit hard enough to fire; even with repeated firing pin strikes.

 

Has anyone else run into this with Estate's ammo?  If so, any luck with returning them to Estate?

 

Or, am I stuck with a load of crappy Estate shells?

 

[Mikeythumbs 1]

I have only shit a few boxes of 16 gauge and I have not had any Issues but that was only a 100 rounds

[djg0770 481]

I have only shit a few boxes

 

That sounds painful

[W2MC 1,699]

NOW I know what the problem is...Mikeythumbs is the culprit!

[ogfarmer 138]

ewwwwwwww. Mikey

 

 

My buddy ocassionally gets light strikes with Estate in his O/U and semi.

 

I personally have shot a bunch and can't recall any issues beside 1 dud.

[Sell682 1]

I have used estates and have not experienced light strikes however I am not a fan of the recoil. I feel a noticeable increase in recoil with estate shells as compared to similar spec Remington or Herters shells.

[Malice4you 627]

I've shot perhaps a case or two of 12ga Estate 7.5 and probably a half case of 8's through a Benelli Supernova, Stevens 320, and H&R 440A with 0 issues.  How old are the shells?  All from one lot?  Most of the Estates I've shot were purchased a few months ago.

 

For target or game loads that I've shot (primarily Remington, Federal, and Estate), I feel like Federals tend to hit me hardest.

[Damjan 73]

I ve shot about 2 cases of estate. A few didnt go off the first time but went off the second time

[Mikeythumbs 1]

Lol this is why I should not answer posts from my phone

[W2MC 1,699]

I've shot perhaps a case or two of 12ga Estate 7.5 and probably a half case of 8's through a Benelli Supernova, Stevens 320, and H&R 440A with 0 issues.  How old are the shells?  All from one lot?  Most of the Estates I've shot were purchased a few months ago.

 

For target or game loads that I've shot (primarily Remington, Federal, and Estate), I feel like Federals tend to hit me hardest.

New - purchased a month or two ago from Tip's.  I am still on the first case - they are different lots, and I am hoping this issue isn't with the other cases I have.  But it's frustrating...my first round was a 20 (with my last box of Remington) but round 2 was a 17 and i dropped all the way to 12 for round three with the Estates.  All because with each clay pigeon, I'm wondering if the gun will go click or bang....

[W2MC 1,699]

More I think about it, the more I wonder if the various manufacturers are spitting-out the shells a little TOO fast...

[greatgunstatenj 32]

I've had this issue in a 20ga semi. Maybe 1shell out of every few boxes.

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

I started a thread recently about FTF's with my shotgun. Come to think of it, most or all of the time when that happened, I was using Estate ammo. Could there have been defective batches? I would feel a lot better knowing it was my ammo at fault and not my guns.

[jrfly3006 42]

Oh great I just picked up two boxes of this stuff..guess now I know why it was on sale

[W2MC 1,699]

I started a thread recently about FTF's with my shotgun. Come to think of it, most or all of the time when that happened, I was using Estate ammo. Could there have been defective batches? I would feel a lot better knowing it was my ammo at fault and not my guns.

 

If you have any of the shells left-over, take a look at the depth that the primers are set into the shell.  The variation in depth is pretty obvious to the eye, or to the fingertip.

[W2MC 1,699]

Oh great I just picked up two boxes of this stuff..guess now I know why it was on sale

 

Sorry...I thought it was only a problem with rebounding firing pins (the 870 and the BPS), which is why I didn't post this two weeks ago, when they were having problems.  My Winchester over/under has positive firing pins, and neither barrel would fire the problem shells. 

 

Yes, it was pretty cheap by today's standard - $54 or $56 a case (I forget which) back in August/September.

[jrfly3006 42]

Sorry...I thought it was only a problem with rebounding firing pins (the 870 and the BPS), which is why I didn't post this two weeks ago, when they were having problems. My Winchester over/under has positive firing pins, and neither barrel would fire the problem shells.

 

Yes, it was pretty cheap by today's standard - $54 or $56 a case (I forget which) back in August/September.

No worries.. Gonna give it a run in my Benelli Supernova Tac and let you know how I make out

[Parker 213]

If it's happening with three different guns it has to be the shells. "One or two duds included with every box" is abysmal performance. I would contact Estate.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Are they all from the same lot?  I'd contact estate.

 

I went through a couple cases of Estate heavy game loads - they're the target loads that cycle best through my 11-87.

[Mikeythumbs 1]

I know this isn't about estate but cabelas has had Herters on sale for 59 a case for a while pick up a few and only five dollar shipping on the card. I have been getting the 16 g at 69 a case which is a steal for 16 g

[Parker 213]

Are they all from the same lot?  I'd contact estate.

 

I went through a couple cases of Estate heavy game loads - they're the target loads that cycle best through my 11-87.

 

Your 11-87, assuming it's chambered for 2 3/4" & 3" shells, should work minimally with industry standard grade target loads (I.E. 2 3/4" x 1 1/8 oz. x 2 3/4 DE @ 1145 fps.) I have a pair of old 11-87 SP's, almost two decades old now, and they will cycle anything I feed them, including 7/8 oz. & 1 oz. handloads provided velocity is at or above 1200 fps.

 

Just keep the gas ports in the barrel clean with an appropriate size drill bit to scrape out the crud and use as little lube as possible around the gas system.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Nope - it's never worked well with light target loads.  I've always had to use 1200+FPS loads.

[Parker 213]

Nope - it's never worked well with light target loads.  I've always had to use 1200+FPS loads.

 

 

Is it a "newer" 11-87?

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Yep.  about 2 years old now.

[W2MC 1,699]

UPDATE - I've been emailing and UPS'ing back and forth with Estate (Federal).

 

First they had me ship them some of the duds and a box of 25 out of the lot for testing.  

 

A week or two later, they emailed back and said they confirm what I have found and please send them back.  They will send me a check for the two cases that were bad.  I am now waiting for the check.

 

(yes, Federal even paid the UPS charges)

 

 

I have nothing but good to say about Estate and Federal...in everything they've been an honest, stand-up sort of company.  I'll be particularly looking for their ammo from now on.

[ogfarmer 138]

good news

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

I think Federal is a great company.  Love their ammo.  Good to hear that their customer service is equally impressive.

[M4BGRINGO 139]

I really can't imagine how many shot gun shells I have used in the last four years. My guess, 10,000 would be a safe bet. I have never had one that didn't fire. I guess I shall consider myself lucky. I have used a lot of Federal too, I honestly never cared what I used, anything # 7 1/2 or #8, I used it. Tried 3/4 oz #9 on Knockdown Steel once, that didn't work! Called the wife and had her bring a box of "good stuff" so I could continue that day! That stuff had no kick to it at-all.

 

Glad to hear Federal is doing the right thing, good for them!