What causes a squib?

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

Had my first squib and am not too happy about it.

 

Here is the back story.

 

I loaded 30 rounds, first setting the primers, then weighing each specific powder measure, and then setting the bullet and crimping. 

 

So step one, set primer x 30.

 

Step 2, weigh case, tare scale, load powder, weigh powder throw and record result, set aside (in order).

 

Step 3, seat bullet head and crimp, 1 at a time, in order, and record COAL results, and load into box in specific order.

 

Step 4, (at range) load magazines from round 10 to 1 so that when they are fired during chrono test I can record results 1 to 10 (in order).

 

I'm testing the rounds in 3 guns (10 rounds per gun).

 

Round number 24 squibbed. 

 

So what could it have been?  Bad primer?  Operator error in that I got confused during the process and mixed up one of the steps (very plausible)?

 

By the way, the other rounds performed very well, so that is good news.

[lunker 274]

Most often it is a primer with no powder just like a kaboom is a double powder charge. It is one reason I like slower powders. They occupy more volume in the case, making it easy to spot a no powder situation and making a double charge impossible.

[MidwestPX 172]

In my experience, a lack of powder.

[Respect2A 0]

Pull the bullet and inspect for powder.

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

OK, I knocked the bullet out of the barrel and kept it. 

 

What am I looking for as evidence of powder?

 

I'll post a photo tonight.

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

It is one reason I like slower powders.

Would you consider Titgroup to be a slower or faster powder?

 

2nd question...what would you consider to be a slower powder?

 

I'm loading 9mm.

[A-Tech 8]

Titegroup is a great powder for 9mm..highly sought after....are you certain that you didn't skip a case when dropping the powder? Get distracted at all? If it only happened to one case, I would think it's lack of powder.

[lunker 274]

You would need to check a powder burn chart. I know that Bullseye, W231, and Unique are pretty fast powders. I prefer using Blue Dot when I can.

[Heavyopp 167]

It's gonna be hard to tell what caused it --  Most likely a lack of powder --  The pulled bullet and empty case will still be black with residue even on just a primer 

 

Don't sweat it Mike --  use it as a learning experience and move on --  It really doesn't matter what caused it -- your still going to reload ammo

 

and your still going to be careful --  just consider it operator error

[AverageJoe 95]

In my experience its also been lack of powder. But what about over crimping? Or a combination of both.

[AverageJoe 95]

It's gonna be hard to tell what caused it --  Most likely a lack of powder --  The pulled bullet and empty case will still be black with residue even on just a primer 

 

Don't sweat it Mike --  use it as a learning experience and move on --  It really doesn't matter what caused it -- your still going to reload ammo

 

and your still going to be careful --  just consider it operator error

IMO I have to disagree. I definitely matters what caused it...so it can be remedied and not happen again.

[Heavyopp 167]

IMO I have to disagree. I definitely matters what caused it...so it can be remedied and not happen again.

 

My point is there probably isn't a remedy -- He missed a powder charge while making a special run of bullets for the chrono

 

This wasn't while he was making bulk ammo -- he knows he has to have powder in the case -- one got by -- The only real remedy is be more careful which he already knows

 

Now, if he has a run of squibs then something needs fixing...

[AverageJoe 95]

My point is there probably isn't a remedy -- He missed a powder charge while making a special run of bullets for the chrono

 

This wasn't while he was making bulk ammo -- he knows he has to have powder in the case -- one got by -- The only real remedy is be more careful which he already knows

 

Now, if he has a run of squibs then something needs fixing...

Right, if one gets distracted and missed a charge, the distraction is the cause and the squib could be the result. Distractions happen, I've experienced them and squibed  a 10mm, heard the difference and stopped shooting...good thing wasn't practicing quick shots. If I have to stop for any reason, I now write down where I'm at and tape it to the handle, thats my way of remedying a distraction, there are ways to put safeguards in place.

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

I'm going to chalk it up to operator error.  Somehow I must have not charged the case with powder.  The only thing that confuses me is that round # 24 shows 3.9 gr and round #25 (squib round) shows 4.1 gr.  Now, rounds numbered 26 to 29 also show 4.1 gr. 

 

As Jer mentioned these were 30 test rounds.  The other 170 I pressed off performed fine.

[Parker 213]

Would you consider Titgroup to be a slower or faster powder?

 

2nd question...what would you consider to be a slower powder?

 

I'm loading 9mm.

 

Titegroup is relatively fast. This burn rate chart should help.

http://www.reloadbench.com/burn.html

[NJKen 23]

I'm going to chalk it up to operator error.  Somehow I must have not charged the case with powder.  The only thing that confuses me is that round # 24 shows 3.9 gr and round #25 (squib round) shows 4.1 gr.  Now, rounds numbered 26 to 29 also show 4.1 gr. 

 

As Jer mentioned these were 30 test rounds.  The other 170 I pressed off performed fine.

Look at the bright side, you where paying enough attention while shooting to identify a squib.  If you are not paying attention and the squib load has enough energy to cycle a new round in you are in trouble.  If you are shooting a revolver its even easier to do if your not paying attention.

I did it once with a 223 round, squib that is, and would have swore that all rounds had powder.  I did miss one though.  Funny thing is it was a small batch for load development just like yours.  It taught me to pay more attention while reloading and it has not happened again yet.

Ken

[2Alpha 6]

I'm going to chalk it up to operator error.  Somehow I must have not charged the case with powder.  The only thing that confuses me is that round # 24 shows 3.9 gr and round #25 (squib round) shows 4.1 gr.  Now, rounds numbered 26 to 29 also show 4.1 gr. 

 

As Jer mentioned these were 30 test rounds.  The other 170 I pressed off performed fine.

 

I'm confused,

your squid round had powder in it?  And the bullet was still on the case?  Then that is not a squib

Did the primer light off?  Was there a pop?

[SmartAss 11]

Could there have been some tumbling media stuck in the flash hole?

[Vlad G 345]

I'm going to chalk it up to operator error.  Somehow I must have not charged the case with powder.  The only thing that confuses me is that round # 24 shows 3.9 gr and round #25 (squib round) shows 4.1 gr.  Now, rounds numbered 26 to 29 also show 4.1 gr. 

 

 

 

Err ? shows how? Is this from your notes or what? I'm confused.

[djg0770 481]

Step 2, weigh case, tare scale, load powder, weigh powder throw and record result, set aside (in order).

 

 

Are you tare-ing the scale for each brass case?  Brass cases vary quite a bit in weight, so if you tare only one, you're playing the lottery, and it's not a winning lottery iykwim.

[silverc6 0]

OK, I knocked the bullet out of the barrel and kept it.

It's an obvious squib if you had to knock the bullet out. Did you inspect the case and was the primer detonated?

[Heavyopp 167]

Could there have been some tumbling media stuck in the flash hole?

 

Interesting thought -- Does not apply here but still interesting -- Would a piece of nutshell or corncob be enough to stop the powder from igniting upon primer detonation?  

 

Reason it does not apply is Mike tumbles wet with stainless media -- no dry media to get stuck in the flash hole

 

This does bring up another thought --  Mike Is it possible that the case was a little wet inside?  Inside the case where it would just get to the powder and not affect the primer

 

I would have to imagine that the wet, un-burt powder, would have been obvious between the case and the bullet --  The barrel became a sealed container -- powder would have been in there

 

 Did you inspect the case and was the primer detonated?

 

The primer had to detonate --- What else would push the bullet into the barrel?  

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

I'm confused,

your squid round had powder in it?  And the bullet was still on the case?  Then that is not a squib

Did the primer light off?  Was there a pop?

Primer went off, bullet lodged in the barrell.

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

Could there have been some tumbling media stuck in the flash hole?

Not possible, as HeavyOp noted.

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

Err ? shows how? Is this from your notes or what? I'm confused.

Yes, my handwritten notes.  I note the measurments on an lined index card. 

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

Are you tare-ing the scale for each brass case?

Yes, each time.  Put case on the scale, hit tare, charge with powder, weigh, mark down result, repeat with a new case.

 

I'm sure this is where I screwed up.

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

This does bring up another thought --  Mike Is it possible that the case was a little wet inside?  

Nothing is impossible, but this would be so very unlikely.

 

The brass was deprimed and tumbled weeks, if not months ago. 

[Heavyopp 167]

Nothing is impossible, but this would be so very unlikely.

 

The brass was deprimed and tumbled weeks, if not months ago. 

 

I would doubt it was wet --  I was thinking the brass was tumbled a few days before loading --  Even then I've never taken more then 24 hours to dry

 

I would have to think the wet, pasty powder would have been evident too

 

Operator error --  sounds like it's this simple -- no need to over-think it

[Krdshrk 3,877]

What did it sound/feel like when you had the squib?  was it a small pop or did you hear a bang?

[tony357 386]

What type of powder measure are you using ?