njpilot 671 Posted January 9, 2014 Thanks Jeremy, way to go and congrats for your victory! He needs Republican/conservative/Pro 2A voters more than we need him. I think NJ2AS and ANJRPC are right to put the screws to him, they will be getting more donations from me shortly--- We need lobbyists in Trenton working Christie. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silverado427 10,675 Posted January 9, 2014 Great job. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Malsua 1,422 Posted January 9, 2014 Thank you Jeremy for being the guinea pig. Your rights had to take a back seat but the benefits will be enjoyed by many others. Fantastic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dan 177 Posted January 9, 2014 Unfortunately, I doubt it will prevent future shenanigans with forms. Without accountability and consequences, pd's can continue to break the law without a worry in the world. It seems they thought this guy was bluffing, but turned out he was happy parting with his time and bags of money to continue the fight in court. At least it paves the way for any future court actions. I just wish there were consequences for the police not following the laws. You know, like there are for civilians. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seamusSU 0 Posted January 9, 2014 Jeremy- if you have any legal fees that you need help with I would be happy to kick in some $ as I'm sure others would. Post up a donation site and I'm sure you can get some help for fighting the good fight Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Duppie 73 Posted January 9, 2014 Unfortunately, I doubt it will prevent future shenanigans with forms. Without accountability and consequences, pd's can continue to break the law without a worry in the world. It seems they thought this guy was bluffing, but turned out he was happy parting with his time and bags of money to continue the fight in court. At least it paves the way for any future court actions. I just wish there were consequences for the police not following the laws. You know, like there are for civilians. I agree as I'm sure there will remain some PD's that will thumb it's nose at this ruling but it is a excellent starting and arguing point to use on those Departments who issue additional criteria just to see if it will stick. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shane45 807 Posted January 9, 2014 IIRC when a department is made aware they are operating outside the law, they can actually be held accountable for continuing to do so with real and significant penalties. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fumanchu182 23 Posted January 9, 2014 If you read the statement the judge remanded, so that means the courts still have to consider criminal charges against the Paterson Police Department. I am taking half a day off tomorrow to give the local police department a copy of the ruling along with my money order from April and my three other forms I printed out just for them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Duppie 73 Posted January 9, 2014 IIRC when a department is made aware they are operating outside the law, they can actually be held accountable for continuing to do so with real and significant penalties. ...such as? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pizza Bob 1,488 Posted January 9, 2014 So is this an actual law now? What happens next? This has been the law - I fail to see why he had to take them to court to uphold it. Isn't that the county prosecutor's job? IIRC when a department is made aware they are operating outside the law, they can actually be held accountable for continuing to do so with real and significant penalties. 2C:30-2 Official Misconduct If a government entity knowingly violates the law they can be investigated/prosecuted under the Official Misconduct statute. Thank you Jeremy, but it seems that this maybe should have been handled by the County Prosecutor or the State AG. It's a shame that you had to spend the money to get them to uphold an existing law. If I were you, I'd be looking to the state or county for reimbursement of your legal expenses. Adios, Pizza Bob <---IANAL Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
10X 3,296 Posted January 9, 2014 So is this an actual law now? What happens next? It was the actual law before. Towns that didn't believe they had to follow the law are why Jeremy(my hero!) had to establish a case to force the courts to remind the towns that they had to comply. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spartiati 63 Posted January 9, 2014 Great win, however what's to stop some other town from still disregarding the law regardless of this case and require additional requirements and deny if not met? Wouldn't an individual still need to sue the town? Like many have said this has always been the law... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
galapoola 102 Posted January 9, 2014 So is this an actual law now? What happens next? it's always been the law, the court just reminded the dopes at the PD that they need to follow the law just like the rest of us. When I went to Toms River a few years back for a new pistol permit they had all the extra forms, when an family member went down recently only the forms in the statute were required. I'm guessing the NJ2AS had everything to do with this, bravo to the judges Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom-NJ2AS 31 Posted January 9, 2014 it's always been the law, the court just reminded the dopes at the PD that they need to follow the law just like the rest of us. When I went to Toms River a few years back for a new pistol permit they had all the extra forms, when an family member went down recently only the forms in the statute were required. I'm guessing the NJ2AS had everything to do with this, bravo to the judges You bet they did. I live in toms river and was not happy when I first saw those forms. Just an FYI I went down today to pick up my conceal carry app and some handgun permits and no extra paperwork. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JeremyP 0 Posted January 9, 2014 Jeremy- if you have any legal fees that you need help with I would be happy to kick in some $ as I'm sure others would. Post up a donation site and I'm sure you can get some help for fighting the good fight I appreciate the offer. Had anyone asked at the time I started, I would have gladly accepted the financial help. I used what little I had saved at the time to hire legal council. I'm doing ok these days and cannot in good conscience accept any money from the 2A community. Anyone that would have felt compelled to donate should send the money to the NJ2AS and ANJRPC. These guys still have a lot of fighting to do for us. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seamusSU 0 Posted January 9, 2014 I appreciate the offer. Had anyone asked at the time I started, I would have gladly accepted the financial help. I used what little I had saved at the time to hire legal council. I'm doing ok these days and cannot in good conscience accept any money from the 2A community. Anyone that would have felt compelled to donate should send the money to the NJ2AS and ANJRPC. These guys still have a lot of fighting to do for us.You sir, are a class act! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
galapoola 102 Posted January 10, 2014 You bet they did. I live in toms river and was not happy when I first saw those forms. Just an FYI I went down today to pick up my conceal carry app and some handgun permits and no extra paperwork. so the firearm permit lady actually slid a carry application under the glass? I'm surprised anyone even knew the form existed. I will say her tone has changed. I always got a "why do you need a gun sonny" vibe from her. When I accompanied a female family member she seemed very supportive of a first time FID & PP applicant. Might be a comradery thing but it was a better experience for sure. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bhunted 887 Posted January 10, 2014 This has been the law - I fail to see why he had to take them to court to uphold it. Isn't that the county prosecutor's job? 2C:30-2 Official Misconduct If a government entity knowingly violates the law they can be investigated/prosecuted under the Official Misconduct statute. Thank you Jeremy, but it seems that this maybe should have been handled by the County Prosecutor or the State AG. It's a shame that you had to spend the money to get them to uphold an existing law. If I were you, I'd be looking to the state or county for reimbursement of your legal expenses. Adios, Pizza Bob Something messed up. Just replied here with quote and its not showing. Weird. Again, Passaic County Officials are so crooked and messed up, they are beyond hope till someone stops them. They can care less what you want, say or think and do what they want. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
W2MC 1,699 Posted January 10, 2014 Jon Stewart's take on this - its a scream! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWCv0j7cRX0 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bhunted 887 Posted January 10, 2014 Jon Stewart's take on this - its a scream! That's a take on the bridge and typical NJ corruption. Nothing gun related but it is funny. Sent from my iPad 2 using T2 Pro Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,777 Posted January 10, 2014 Jon Stewart's take on this - its a scream! Wrong thread? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom-NJ2AS 31 Posted January 10, 2014 so the firearm permit lady actually slid a carry application under the glass? I'm surprised anyone even knew the form existed. I will say her tone has changed. I always got a "why do you need a gun sonny" vibe from her. When I accompanied a female family member she seemed very supportive of a first time FID & PP applicant. Might be a comradery thing but it was a better experience for sure. She was not in that day. Another woman helped. But I know who you are talking about! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
W2MC 1,699 Posted January 10, 2014 W2MC, on 10 Jan 2014 - 12:39 PM, said: Jon Stewart's take on this - its a scream! Wrong thread? Yup - wrong thread (now HOW did I do that.....) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kman 56 Posted January 11, 2014 Anyone have a link to the written decision of the court, or a citation? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
illy 1 Posted January 11, 2014 For those who wish to read the complete ruling: http://www.judiciary.state.nj.us/opinions/a0498-12.pdf And read about the Judges who made the ruling: http://judgepedia.org/Jane_Grall http://judgepedia.org/Allison_E._Accurso Thank you, Your Honors! Job well done. Anyone have a link to the written decision of the court, or a citation? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,777 Posted January 11, 2014 Very nice! This just made my day! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnnyB 4,321 Posted January 12, 2014 I appreciate the offer. Had anyone asked at the time I started, I would have gladly accepted the financial help. I used what little I had saved at the time to hire legal council. I'm doing ok these days and cannot in good conscience accept any money from the 2A community. Anyone that would have felt compelled to donate should send the money to the NJ2AS and ANJRPC. These guys still have a lot of fighting to do for us. You are a class act JeremyP! You give hope to and set an example for your comrades in the PRNJ. Words mean nothing.....Action is everything and you took action. I thank you sir! I am now off to renew my expired membership with the NJ2AS. Done. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Silence Dogood 468 Posted January 13, 2014 Great news but tragic that basic rights in New Jersey require judicial action rather than simple compliance. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
robs609 2 Posted January 14, 2014 bravo to those who stand up for our rights! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisJM981 924 Posted January 22, 2014 Hmm my town is still requiring an information waiver. Now how do I prove that my police chief received... certified mail with a return receipt? No...I'd say email, but I don't know how I'd prove the attachment's contents. I'm sure he will not comply. He's quite an obnoxious, pretentious, and condescending fellow. Offical misconduct would suit him well. Jeremy, thank you for your time, patience, money spent, and faith for this cause. Donation to help fight the good fight will be sent out. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites