Update on Right to Carry appeals case, Almeida Vs. Sussex Co.

[NJPatriot 0]

As for swaying people, I don't want to waste time trying to sway hardcore antis. I want us to concentrate on people who may not be for or against anything, or people who are in the middle. I think also that the 2A movement has to be a big tent. It can't just be stereotypical gun nuts, and now we are seeing that changing dramatically - women, minorities, LGBT, immigrants etc. It has to be everybody, and yes it has to cross party lines.

 

 

I agree with you. My wife, 2 daughters (19 & 21) and boyfriends (20 & 21) are now FID holders that improve the diversity of 2A proponents. My 2 nephews (18 & 20) are close to applying also.

[DeerSlayer 241]

Just curious Ryan... What's your thought on us investing in some kind of MSM presence to reach the "neutrals/undecideds..." whether we negotiate for greater control with existing MSM channels, or we invest $$$ into building our own? Is that something worth attempting? It's just that I see all this "anti" karma on the MSM trying to reach the very people we need to reach, and being a whole lot more successful at it because of the control the antis have over the MSM. If we had our own MSM channels (or were able to gain better control over an existing ones), we could ensure that *our* message gets out to the very same audience, only with our spin on it. Right now, we have a very limited presence on some cable and/or streaming media channels, but that's a very small audience compared to the big MSM broadcast networks.

 

Would you think that investing some time/$$$ in to gaining a greater MSM presence worth the effort?

 

Thanks.

Won't happen IMO, even Fox as conservative as they claim to be won't touch much on 2nd amendment issues. The Blaze is the best chance we have for getting that message out. Thankfully that channel is growing monthly and getting into more networks each month. They actually have Daniel Defense commercials, Cheaper than Dirt is also a sponsor. Dana is a big pro 2nd amendment spokeswoman, amongst others on the channel. A mainstream media channel has to be built, takes years. The likelihood of Cam & Co. ever being broadcast on a MSM network are extremely slim.

[Oakridgefirearms 224]

another strategy to employ is one the democrats have used successfully in the past,  That is to change party affiliation to "undeclared" and vote in the democratic primary and choose their candidate for them.    since the republican primary's really don't matter that much to us we can do more by keeping the democratic  incumbents out .   If in a democratic primary there is a challenger to an anti vote against the anti in the primary.      since all we do anymore is vote for the "lesser of two evils"  I don't see much harm being done to us.

IIRC in NJ you can only vote in the primary of the party you are registered with, so independents can't vote in either primary.

 

It would make sense for someone living in a Dem controlled district to register as a Dem, regardless of their true political disposition, if there is a better candidate to vote for in that primary.

[njpilot 671]

IIRC in NJ you can only vote in the primary of the party you are registered with, so independents can't vote in either primary.

 

It would make sense for someone living in a Dem controlled district to register as a Dem, regardless of their true political disposition, if there is a better candidate to vote for in that primary.

Not true. If you register as an Independent, ("undecided") in this state, as I am, you can vote in either primary.

 

Doing so, automatically changes your registration to the party whose primary you voted in. You them go and change it back to "undecided".

[ryan_j 0]

Won't happen IMO, even Fox as conservative as they claim to be won't touch much on 2nd amendment issues. 

 

News to me. Andrew Napolitano is always talking about guns. Hannity talks about guns too and he even has a permit to carry (and he carries). 

 

But they aren't going to go 24x7 talking about guns.

 

(Fox doesn't claim to be conservative either, they claim to be fair and balanced.)

 

Funny you mention Fox as well - Channel 9 which is a Fox owned station in Secaucus NJ has a news show called Chasing NJ. They have been running a LOT of NJ gun stories, featuring people like Anthony, Shyanne Roberts and Frank Fiamingo. We've gotten some very favorable coverage from this program. 

[ryan_j 0]

Not true. If you register as an Independent, ("undecided") in this state, as I am, you can vote in either primary.

 

Doing so, automatically changes your registration to the party whose primary you voted in. You them go and change it back to "undecided".

 

It's actually called "unaffiliated" and you declare your affiliation on election day.

 

You can also change your party affiliation at any time, up to 55 days before a primary. 

 

Since I live up here in Sussex county it is a waste of time registering as a democrat, since we are the strongest Republican county in NJ and local races that matter are decided at the primary, essentially (democrats don't win the general). It's a waste of time doing that in a place like Newark or Jersey City as well, because you're never going to overcome the inner city vote. 

 

But if you live in a swing district, it will be very worth your while to vote DINO (Democrat In Name Only). 

[ryan_j 0]

Just curious Ryan...  What's your thought on us investing in some kind of MSM presence to reach the "neutrals/undecideds..." whether we negotiate for greater control with existing MSM channels, or we invest $$$ into building our own?  Is that something worth attempting? It's just that I see all this "anti" karma on the MSM trying to reach the very people we need to reach, and being a whole lot more successful at it because of the control the antis have over the MSM.  If we had our own MSM channels (or were able to gain better control over an existing ones), we could ensure that *our* message gets out to the very same audience, only with our spin on it. Right now, we have a very limited presence on some cable and/or streaming media channels, but that's a very small audience compared to the big MSM broadcast networks.

 

Would you think that investing some time/$$$ in to gaining a greater MSM presence worth the effort?

 

Thanks.

 

 

I think running some well placed ads has merit.

 

Radio ads are cheap, as are local cable TV ads. 

 

News coverage from local news outlets is good too, and we have been getting that with spots on Fox and CBS now and again.

[DeerSlayer 241]

But they aren't going to go 24x7 talking about guns.

 

^^^ this, when they do talk about guns its almost always favorable. Its just not all the time that they discuss the subject. I like Shawn Hannity, and the old Judge also. I haven't been watching as much Fox news since the Optimum picked up the Blaze. I also DVR NRA news on Sportsman channel at 6pm daily.

 

I agree some pro 2A adds on the right channels would be a more realistic beginning to spread our message.

 

I haven't watched channel 9 since TV's had two dials and my cable box had a slider on it you had to manually move to change the channel lol. I just dated myself... "I want my MTV, they actually used to play music believe it or not. Now they're actually a very anti gun network.

 

 

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Funny you mention Fox as well - Channel 9 which is a Fox owned station in Secaucus NJ has a news show called Chasing NJ. They have been running a LOT of NJ gun stories, featuring people like Anthony, Shyanne Roberts and Frank Fiamingo. We've gotten some very favorable coverage from this program.

 

I have seen the coverage of some pro2A things on "Chasing NJ," including Shyanne. A decent start, but we need to figure out how to do this on one of the larger networks because that's where our constituency hangs out... and the anti's are just chomping away at them.  A Herculean effort, I get... but, hopefully, we can figure some way to compete with the antis on their turf.. or build our own ballpark, in the hope that "they will come."

 

I think running some well placed ads has merit.

 

Radio ads are cheap, as are local cable TV ads.

 

I'd be afraid that the MSM (in its present mindset) would either not allow the ads (a la "Daniel Defense"), or edit them heavily, rendering them moot anyway.  Radio and cable are great, but our primary constituency (the *real* numbers we need) lies in the primary broadcast world.

 

News coverage from local news outlets is good too, and we have been getting that with spots on Fox and CBS now and again.

 

Unfortunately, very little of it (if any) reaches the national MSM... unless there's a way they can spin it towards their anti agenda. Where I see this most often is successful HD/SD incidents. They might get a little coverage on local stations, but unless there's an angle that lets them put an "anti" spin on it, it will never reach the natl. level. I recently watched local coverage on a successful HD/SD event where the anchor begins the report by saying, "Well here's a *wild* one <insert partner anchor's namer>... "     As if HD/SD is a joke to them...

 

Anyway, thanks for your take on it. I wish I could wave a magic wand and make the Natl. MSM (if nothing else) a "fair playing field," but life isn't fair sometimes.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

It's actually called "unaffiliated" and you declare your affiliation on election day.

 

You can also change your party affiliation at any time, up to 55 days before a primary. 

 

Since I live up here in Sussex county it is a waste of time registering as a democrat, since we are the strongest Republican county in NJ and local races that matter are decided at the primary, essentially (democrats don't win the general). It's a waste of time doing that in a place like Newark or Jersey City as well, because you're never going to overcome the inner city vote. 

 

But if you live in a swing district, it will be very worth your while to vote DINO (Democrat In Name Only). 

 

Same as me in Warren County.  It makes no sense for anyone to register as a Dem (for primary voting anyway) as there never seems to be any viable candidates on the ballot to vote for in the primaries. Much of the time, there are no nominees at all... just space for "write ins."   So you may as well register in the party of majority, wherever it is you live. Thankfully, I live in an extremely strong Rep. county as well (I'd say a peer to Sussex ), and we have the reps we do in the 24th district.

[ryan_j 0]

I live in LD24 as well.

[DeerSlayer 241]

Its almost like trying to ask the attendees of a Muslim Mosc if we can hold a quick bikini contest during one of their religious services. I don't know if they would even entertain a monetary offer for such a request.

 

Imagine a Daniel defense add on MSNBC during Hardball with Chris Jerkoff? It would be awesome! But so are Unicorns, Leprechaun's, and Oompa Loompas.

[Old Dog 19]

I live in a community of 100,000 people where 95% are registered Republicans. The anti gun people keep a low profile. Never heard one person speak out about guns in the last 4 years. Life can be good, but not in NJ.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Imagine a Daniel defense add on MSNBC during Hardball with Chris Jerkoff? It would be awesome! But so are Unicorns, Leprechaun's, and Oompa Loompas.

 

Which is why I ask if it's worth it to try and pony up our own access to the broadcast media to compete with them.....

[DeerSlayer 241]

The NRA would probably be the only outlet that could possibly fund a venture like that. Commercials aren't too expensive, but an entire network would be millions. Investors would be needed as well.

[ryan_j 0]

Don't get overly ambitious with prime time TV spots. We should start small with radio, newspaper and cable TV ads. Cable ads can target locally.

 

I'm not just assuming here. I know people who run political campaigns in NJ and across the country and they do this and it works. Radio in particular is a very underestimated medium, but in that MS Senate primary it made all the difference. 

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Don't get overly ambitious with prime time TV spots. We should start small with radio, newspaper and cable TV ads. Cable ads can target locally.

 

I'm not just assuming here. I know people who run political campaigns in NJ and across the country and they do this and it works. Radio in particular is a very underestimated medium, but in that MS Senate primary it made all the difference. 

 

Fair enough... I'm willing to start with baby steps and work up to it.... Might even catch the dragon "sleeping...."

[Fred2 367]

Don't get overly ambitious with prime time TV spots. We should start small with radio, newspaper and cable TV ads. Cable ads can target locally.

 

I'm not just assuming here. I know people who run political campaigns in NJ and across the country and they do this and it works. Radio in particular is a very underestimated medium, but in that MS Senate primary it made all the difference. 

 

I would think that billboards on the highway would be pretty cost effective.

 

Done properly, they could also gain a fair amount of press all on their own.

 

Warning - You are leaving America, and entering NJ (or something like that)

[Newtonian 453]

Today I was at the bullet hole and someone was outside handing out papers with the.number for Christies office and saying to tell them you oppose s993. We need to do this on a large scale. Election time, and for upcoming bills. Go to all ranges and hang out giving out flyers talking to people.

The ranges and shops provide great access for getting out a "please vote" message.

[chris327 30]

I would think that billboards on the highway would be pretty cost effective.

 

Done properly, they could also gain a fair amount of press all on their own.

 

Warning - You are leaving America, and entering NJ (or something like that)

i don't think billboards are the greatest advertisement. we had one for work for about 2 years, right on a major highway that we are off of. It is a high traffic area and all, but you dont get that many people looking at it. You almost have to look for it to notice since most people dont read every billboard. I had customers who noticed it during the 2nd year it was up that passed it every day and said wow did you just put that up? i really dont see it being worth it for billboards unless you gain some news coverage about it.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

i don't think billboards are the greatest advertisement. we had one for work for about 2 years, right on a major highway that we are off of. It is a high traffic area and all, but you dont get that many people looking at it. You almost have to look for it to notice since most people dont read every billboard. I had customers who noticed it during the 2nd year it was up that passed it every day and said wow did you just put that up? i really dont see it being worth it for billboards unless you gain some news coverage about it.

 

And, the problem  being, the news coverage you'd likely get in these parts would be spun towards the "anti" side. If you put a billboard up, the first thing the media would do after reporting on it is contact a Sweeney or a Weinberg and ask for a "comment" on the billboard... who would then spend 90% of the news segment pontificating on the "evils" of guns.... The objective being, more ratings of course! 

 

This, and I wouldn't even put it past the more "activist" fringes of MAIG and similar groups  to have an "unlucky accident befall" that billboard.... "Godfather style..."

[Pythagoras 2]

It's actually called "unaffiliated" and you declare your affiliation on election day.

 

You can also change your party affiliation at any time, up to 55 days before a primary. 

 

Since I live up here in Sussex county it is a waste of time registering as a democrat, since we are the strongest Republican county in NJ and local races that matter are decided at the primary, essentially (democrats don't win the general). It's a waste of time doing that in a place like Newark or Jersey City as well, because you're never going to overcome the inner city vote. 

 

But if you live in a swing district, it will be very worth your while to vote DINO (Democrat In Name Only). 

This is by far the most powerful way to use your vote, and we need to spread this message far and wide.

 

(Unfortunately I live in LD22, where Jerry Green and Linda Stender ran unopposed in the 2013 Demo. primary )

[H.M. Murdock 0]

That is interesting about Chasing NJ.  If I remember correctly Eric Bolling mentioned that show once on the Five.  I think the producers of that show are his people.  Good for them, pro 2A on a local station is always a good thing (in Bergen County no less)

[Oakridgefirearms 224]

Not true. If you register as an Independent, ("undecided") in this state, as I am, you can vote in either primary.

 

Doing so, automatically changes your registration to the party whose primary you voted in. You them go and change it back to "undecided".

Now that you mention it, I do recall that to be the case., but can you go back to being independent once you are affiliated with one party? I know you can change parties at will, but I thought that once you were affiliated with a party, you had to be in one party or another in NJ.

[H.M. Murdock 0]

Now that you mention it, I do recall that to be the case., but can you go back to being independent once you are affiliated with one party? I know you can change parties at will, but I thought that once you were affiliated with a party, you had to be in one party or another in NJ.

 

Yes and you can drop off the form at the post office on your way home from voting.

 

http://www.state.nj.us/state/elections/form_pdf/party-affiliation-form-062011.pdf

[njpilot 671]

Yes and you can drop off the form at the post office on your way home from voting.

 

http://www.state.nj.us/state/elections/form_pdf/party-affiliation-form-062011.pdf

Correct. As long as you change back, I believe, 55 days before the election.

 

A member her is working on posting detailed info on this for those interested in becoming "Unaffiliated" for primary voting.

 

I'm "Unaffiliated" because I can't support either of these parties. The primary voting choice is a by product of that decision for me.

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

Not sure if this has already been discussed on this lengthy thread, but thanks to the wonders of gerrymandering, most districts are solidly either Republican or Democrat.  (All three of my state reps in the 40th District are conservative and strongly pro 2A.)  The good thing about that is that we can focus our finances and other resources in the very few (if any?) swing districts.

[Newtonian 453]

Not sure if this has already been discussed on this lengthy thread, but thanks to the wonders of gerrymandering, most districts are solidly either Republican or Democrat.  (All three of my state reps in the 40th District are conservative and strongly pro 2A.)  The good thing about that is that we can focus our finances and other resources in the very few (if any?) swing districts.

Do your research.

 

Look at the results from the last legislative elections. There are at least five, possibly seven competitive races out of 40 for the senate. That is more than enough to change the (24-16) balance of power.

 

There were SIXTEEN competitive races for assembly seats. Win nine of them and the assembly swings republican (currently 48-32).

 

What's really galling is that several of the assembly races were decided by a couple of hundred votes.

 

See my previous posts on voter participation, gun ownership, etc. I don't know how many goddamn times I have to say it. It would not take a huge get-out-the-vote effort to turn this thing around. The democrats have run out of corpses and comatose absentee voters. 

 

2015 is our last, as in FINAL chance. 

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

Do your research.

 

Look at the results from the last legislative elections. There are at least five, possibly seven competitive races out of 40 for the senate. That is more than enough to change the (24-16) balance of power.

 

There were SIXTEEN competitive races for assembly seats. Win nine of them and the assembly swings republican (currently 48-32).

 

 

Well, I'll admit I'm too lazy to do the research, but I'm more than willing to take your word for it.  

 

By no means am I disagreeing.  I'm merely pointing out (as you may have already done), than any efforts we make only need to be focused on specific areas, not spread out across the entire state.  As you explain, there are somewhere around 21-23 races in play, not the entire 120 that comprise our state legislature.

 

Put that way, it certainly sounds attainable.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

It would make sense for someone living in a Dem controlled district to register as a Dem, regardless of their true political disposition, if there is a better candidate to vote for in that primary.

 

Or, more likely the case that the weaker side in that particular district has no viable candidates on the ballot. I'd never be in favor of just wasting a voting opportunity. You can register on the opposite side and then become a "spoiler" in the primaries... voting for or against whom you either do or don't want to see advance to the "general" election, where one's affiliation doesn't matter.