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How do you ccw ?

Glock CCW (one in chamber or not)  

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  1. 1. Do you CCW your Glock

    • Condition 0 (ready to rock and roll)
    • Condition 3 (is it childproof? - loaded mag / chamber empty)


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Why are there so many people carrying with a cocked hammer and no safety? Are you guys looking to ND?

So then you're implying that any gun without a true safety (not trigger safety), a glock or M&P, should never be carried with one in the chamber? Or is this about a cocked hammer vs striker fired hair trigger issue?

 

Not challenging you just trying to learn a detail here. What I think everybody above should clarify is what their weapon is. Does cocked and locked only refer to a hammer fired? Or is it being generally referred to anything condition 1?

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Quick Point of Order:

 

Glock has three mechanical safeties that are engaged when the weapon is charged - the firing pin safety, the drop safety, and the trigger safety. These 3 safeties are automatically disengaged as you press the trigger with no need to press any other levers or buttons to render the gun "hot". Glocks are also only partially cocked when charged, meaning your trigger press completes cocking and releases the striker - technically making a Glock a double action only pistol if we are sticking to traditional auto-pistol nomenclature.

 

Therefore a Glock, when carried with one in the chamber as it should be, is technically in condition 1.5. However, for the sake of the ease of conversation it is generally referred to as being in Condition one as the striker is around 60% cocked (M&P series pistols, and I think XD series as well, are around 80%-90% cocked) when charged.

 

The same applies to other common striker fired pistols - M&P, Xd, etc...

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Quick Point of Order:

 

Glock has three mechanical safeties that are engaged when the weapon is charged - the firing pin safety, the drop safety, and the trigger safety. These 3 safeties are automatically disengaged as you press the trigger with no need to press any other levers or buttons to render the gun "hot". Glocks are also only partially cocked when charged, meaning your trigger press completes cocking and releases the striker - technically making a Glock a double action only pistol if we are sticking to traditional auto-pistol nomenclature.

 

Therefore a Glock, when carried with one in the chamber as it should be, is technically in condition 1.5. However, for the sake of the ease of conversation it is generally referred to as being in Condition one as the striker is around 60% cocked (M&P series pistols, and I think XD series as well, are around 80%-90% cocked) when charged.

 

The same applies to other common striker fired pistols - M&P, Xd, etc...

From a mechanical standpoint this is all true of course, from a practical functional standpoint it doesn't make sense to me though. To me condition 1 implies, from a practical standpoint that I draw my gun and before I can fire it I have to perform a separate action to disengage a safety, only then can I pull the trigger and make the gun go bang. If all I have to do to make the gun go bang is draw it and pull the trigger then to me that's effectively condition 0, regardless of the mechanics going on inside the gun.

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Quick Point of Order:

 

Glock has three mechanical safeties that are engaged when the weapon is charged - the firing pin safety, the drop safety, and the trigger safety. These 3 safeties are automatically disengaged as you press the trigger with no need to press any other levers or buttons to render the gun "hot". Glocks are also only partially cocked when charged, meaning your trigger press completes cocking and releases the striker - technically making a Glock a double action only pistol if we are sticking to traditional auto-pistol nomenclature.

 

Therefore a Glock, when carried with one in the chamber as it should be, is technically in condition 1.5. However, for the sake of the ease of conversation it is generally referred to as being in Condition one as the striker is around 60% cocked (M&P series pistols, and I think XD series as well, are around 80%-90% cocked) when charged.

 

The same applies to other common striker fired pistols - M&P, Xd, etc...

 

 

I agree with John... 

 

it can have 10 "safeties" but with a Glock the end user experiences none of those.. the ONLY safety is keeping your finger off the trigger.. 

 

 

again I understand what you are explaining.. carrying the gun is safe.. but to me a safety is a dummy lever switch in between the user and discharging the weapon (even if that thought process is not technically correct)

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Getting into debates about ND and which systems allow or disallow that (pin blocks etc) is a whole different topic. I like hearing who carries what and how. But this just made me think of something else. For those that carry and use a safety do you do it that way because you PREFER the safety? Or is it that you just love that gun regardless of a safety?

 

In other words, do 1911 guys carry cocked and locked because the safety is there? If that same person carried a glock would they stil carry in the chamber? Or vice versa, a glock guy who switches to a 1911 would he not use the safety?

 

It seems we all agree 1 in the chamber is mandatory but now in intrigued about views on safeties is it the individual training or is it the gun that dictates it?

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condition 1 to me means that there is a manual safety, such as a 1911, that is engaged. condition 0 would be that the manual safety is not engaged. i would consider Glocks to be carried in condition 2. the "hammer" is not fully cocked and since there is no manual safety it cannot be turned on or off as required for conditions 0 or 1. if you have one of the M&Ps with the manual safety that can be in condition 0 or 1. in that case 0 is the stupid way 1 is correct. when i get my holster and can practice some more with the DA/SA trigger on my new Sig that will be carried in condition 2.

 

 

Getting into debates about ND and which systems allow or disallow that (pin blocks etc) is a whole different topic. I like hearing who carries what and how. But this just made me think of something else. For those that carry and use a safety do you do it that way because you PREFER the safety? Or is it that you just love that gun regardless of a safety?

In other words, do 1911 guys carry cocked and locked because the safety is there? If that same person carried a glock would they stil carry in the chamber? Or vice versa, a glock guy who switches to a 1911 would he not use the safety?

It seems we all agree 1 in the chamber is mandatory but now in intrigued about views on safeties is it the individual training or is it the gun that dictates it?

that is all personal preference. i always feel better knowing there is one in the chamber no matter what pistol. i would never buy one that wasn't meant to be carried with one in the chamber. if there is a safety, i use it. a decocker, i use that. internal mechanical safeties, then i don't have to worry about anything other then the trigger. it really depends on what gun i have available and how it was designed to be carried.

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Just read thru this thread and Im understanding everything but the "mexican carry" references?

 

I don't know why it has that moniker but it is the practise of stuffing the gun down the front of your pants, pointing right at the crown jewels, with no holster.

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just tucked into your pants. no holster or anything.

 

I don't know why it has that moniker but it is the practise of stuffing the gun down the front of your pants, pointing right at the crown jewels, with no holster.
Thank you and pb for clarification. No thanks on that for me. If its 2 things I dont wana lose its my balls lol.

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Mexican Carry is the original concealed carry method.

The term comes from the days of single-action revolvers and gun belts.

At that time in Mexico regular citizens weren't allowed to carry, but many did anyway.

If they saw the authorities coming, they usually had enough time to ditch/hide the gun, but not all that leather. So they took to carrying IWB with no holster.

 

Perfectly safe with a SA wheel gun (hammer down on an empty chamber).

However, carrying a Glock that way is best reserved for geniuses like Plaxico Burress.

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Quick Point of Order:

 

Glock has three mechanical safeties that are engaged when the weapon is charged - the firing pin safety, the drop safety, and the trigger safety. These 3 safeties are automatically disengaged as you press the trigger with no need to press any other levers or buttons to render the gun "hot". Glocks are also only partially cocked when charged, meaning your trigger press completes cocking and releases the striker - technically making a Glock a double action only pistol if we are sticking to traditional auto-pistol nomenclature.

 

Therefore a Glock, when carried with one in the chamber as it should be, is technically in condition 1.5. However, for the sake of the ease of conversation it is generally referred to as being in Condition one as the striker is around 60% cocked (M&P series pistols, and I think XD series as well, are around 80%-90% cocked) when charged.

 

The same applies to other common striker fired pistols - M&P, Xd, etc...

great info. and the answer to the question: why non of the above have as crisp a trigger as a 1911.

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Nice video....but I hope he had the moose butchered. I hate to see an animal killed then left to rot.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I don't know if it would be legal for him to claim it. Its stupid but I know fish and game laws are like sometimes. But a dead animal in the wild never goes to waste. Something will eat it...

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That guy has got to be the biggest asshole in the Wilderness. Guess he felt it was more important to not lose 5 mins and justified killing the moose. -Oh, he got right up to the animal, and clapped his hands so I guess that justifies an escalation of force. Sad son of a bitch.

 

 

I agree......   Could have took out a camera and took some pics...   I mean, isnt the whole reason to be out in the wilderness is to enjoy everything about it?   Or.... if you are in a rush, find another path to get around. That animal died for NO reason......  

< I am not against hunting..... but that was just murder>

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Don't know what I would've done.

 

FWIW, the description says he had his kid behind him. Turning those snowmobiles around may not have been an option or even possible and there was nowhere to go right or left.

Still, before drawing the gun, he stood up to make himself look bigger and made a lot of noise.

And he still didn't draw after the first time the moose charged. He only pulls out the gun after the second charge, when moose actually makes contact.

Whether he should've done something different before then is up for debate, but he did show a lot of restraint once the distance was closed.

Probably too much, in fact. He and/or his son could've been killed or seriously hurt on that first charge. Even just a broken arm or leg out in the middle of nowhere can be disastrous.

 

Again, I don't know what I would have done, but I can't second guess a father protecting his son and himself in that situation.

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One could argue that he was 2X wrong for putting his child at risk like that. I mean running-up to the moose that close that quickly? One of the favorate sayings on NJGF: Play stupid games win stupid prises. I am cetainly no moose experts but from what I have seen, they are not the type of animal to be intimidated easily.

 

I thought were he first paused was a good place to assess. And IF the moose charged him at that range and he couldn't get out of there, yes, fire if you must. But, he didn't assess jack, he just barreled down there and created a no win situation. -Totally unecessary with a little restraint.

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IMO...empty chamber = one less shot. As long as the hammer isn't cocked, why carry an empty chamber?

With a modern revolver that has a hammer block there's no need to, before that technology existed though if there was a round in the chamber and the hammer was down then a bump to the hammer could set it off.

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That guy did nothing wrong in my opinion. He was out riding on a narrow trail. He came across a territorial animal and couldn't turn around. He tried multiple times to scare it off including firing a shot above the animal before he shot the animal. When stuff like that happens you dont have time to think. If this guy wasn't armed he would probably be dead. My only gripe is that he is carrying in condition 3 instead of condition 2 (round in chamber).

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N

Getting back on topic, I remember a long time ago, people used to recommend carrying a revolver with an empty chamber under the hammer. Has this been outmoded by modern technology, or was it always a dumb idea, or is it still a good idea?

An empty chamber under the hammer was and still is safety requirement with traditional SA revolver designs. Note I say design not old revolver as there are SA sixguns still made this,way. A hammer down on these revolvers has the firing pin sitting right on the primer. A blow to the hammer will set off the round. Ruger Blackhawks were made this,way until the early 70s.

 

DA revolvers pre-WWII are relatively safe to carry fully loaded. However, during WWII a sailor dropped his S&W Victory Model and it discharged killing him. Since then S&W incorporated the safety lever which prevents firing pin from contacting the primer.

 

Empty chambers are not required with modern DA designs.

 

Also a word on Mexican Carry. I first learned about it from Skeeter Skelton who knew what he was talking about. Skeeter spent most of his life as a LEO on the Mexican border. He would tell stories of going down to Mexico in the 50s and 60s on the hunt for old Colt SAAs. Skeeter defined it more as a matter of convenience not only for concealment. It was not stuffing it in the front of your pants. Try that with any handgun with a barrel of 4" or longer and you'll know why. Mexican Carry according to Skeeter was stuffing the gun in your pants about 4 o'clock. If it was a Colt SA you also opened the loading gate to prevent the gun from slipping down.

 

I spent time working on the Mexican border and it still is done. Not the smart way to carry a Glock or other striker fired pistol though. Ask Plaxico Burres.

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