Consensus on BCM Gunfighter Comp

[njitmetal 2]

The last topic I could find on the subject was from March. Is there any new opinions/info that can say definitively that this comp is legal in NJ? It's the comp I'd like to try on my current build but just want to be sure. It's sold as a compensator, so I don't see why it wouldn't be legal but it seems that there are those who say "use at your own risk".

Thanks, and sorry for the repeat. Just wanted to solicit any new thoughts.

[Vlad G 345]

I would look at something else, for both legal and performance issues.

[RUTGERS95 890]

if it didn't have bcm on it, no one would use it

 

it's ok....just ok

[redtornado23 0]

i have the MOD1 on my most recent build and have the PWS FSC556 on my older AR.  I actually like the MOD1 better, i think it offers slightly more control of the muzzle and it's quieter than the FSC556.  My 2 cents...

[pbkid6974 1]

It definitely doesn't blow the sound back like some other comps. And it keeps me on target pretty well. I would recommend it. I don't know why some people think it's illegal. It doesn't hide the flash at all.

[Vlad G 345]

It doesn't really matter if it hides flashes, as long as NJs nebulous notion of a flash hider comes into play. I dunno if it is really an issue but it is more flash hider looking then most and this is NJ

[intercooler 41]

The package says compensater

[pbkid6974 1]

It doesn't really matter if it hides flashes, as long as NJs nebulous notion of a flash hider comes into play. I dunno if it is really an issue but it is more flash hider looking then most and this is NJ

And what is njs nebulous notion of a flash hider? Because im fairly certain I could take a washer and weld it on an A2 birdcage flash hider and negate its flash hiding ability and use that on anything. And that really looks like a flash hider. So who cares what it looks like.

[raz-0 1,259]

And what is njs nebulous notion of a flash hider? Because im fairly certain I could take a washer and weld it on an A2 birdcage flash hider and negate its flash hiding ability and use that on anything. And that really looks like a flash hider. So who cares what it looks like.

It's not looks it's the assembly method vs. the highly scientific "can I poke my finger in the end" test njsp says they use. The bcm appears to be cast/machined for a torx bit that would allow your finger to poke in even though the bullet passes through an opening only slightly bigger than the bullet in conjunction with ad material that claims reduced flash.

 

It's not about what it is, it's about guessing what njsp will say if push comes to shove on the issue.

[pbkid6974 1]

I can't poke my finger in the end... and if you can then you should probably eat something skellator. Now please stop spreading fear and letting the state win. Unless it's banned by name or sold as a flash hider you'll be fine. The bcm is sold as a COMPENSATOR which is what it is and is 100% legal in nj as long as it is attached correclty.

[Sell682 1]

I also have a bmc and like it's performance . It's a compensator and shooting at dusk proves it with the flash produced .

[Shane45 807]

pbkid6974, sounds like your willing to pony up the cash for legal fees for anyone following your advice! Being cautious in a state that is out to get you is not spreading fear, it is being wise. Other comps that arguably perform better and have no ambiguity about them simply makes more sense to protect against the possibility of a LE interaction where the interacting agency is less than 2A friendly. You are in a state where all things firearms related finds you guilty until proven innocent.

[Shane45 807]

Sell, the point is not if it actually hides flash or not, the point is, under less than ideal circumstances you are not going to be proving your case on the side of the road or when officers are at your house while you were cleaning your rifle, (insert innocent interaction here) they are simply going to kick it upstairs for decision making and the most likely outcome is you will get to prove your case in court. From the officers I have talked to about this compensator specifically, what raises their concern is not the "insert your finger" test, its based in the description or understanding of a compensator. Their understanding is that the hole in the face of the compensator is very slightly larger than the diameter of the projectile. In the case of the BCM, it is not a circle which makes the perceived opening considerably larger than the diameter of the projectile. And that ambiguity is what could land you in the position of having to prove your case. I would personally not pick the BCM unless funds for a legal defence was not an issue and I had full faith in the NJ legal system.

[pbkid6974 1]

it is spreading fear. there are plenty of people in NJ who have them, use them, and like the performance. i am one of them. i will not hesitate to suggest something that i have and use legally to someone else that is interested. until the state says, "BCM Gunfighter Comps are banned" i will continue to support them. we have enough problems as gunowners in this state already.

[checko 180]

I don't think being prudent with potential legal penalties is spreading fear. Especially when you can probably find a better comp without the ambiguity.

 

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

 

 

[Shane45 807]

pbkid, you don't seem to get it. The question is not if that comp is ultimately legal, the issue is you may find yourself in court defending its legality due to its ambiguity. Please illuminate exactly what led you to your position on how NJ LE may view this device. Indeed we do have problems in this state, that is the problem. And possibly creating more victims is not a solution. Is a 5,10, or 20k in legal fees, should you have an unfavorable interaction, worth it to use that device over another? What exactly is the down side or negative impact on gun ownership in NJ by choosing say a Battlecomp instead? How exactly does that contribute to our problems as you claim?

[mag1 0]

Just read..I am agreeing with Shane on this 1

[vladtepes 1,060]

flash hider is really touchy in NJ and anyone that says otherwise should put up some facts...

 

NJ does NOT define flash hider.. they simply use the term "flash hider"

that means from a legal standpoint if the muzzle device hides flash then IMO they COULD try to make a case out of it...

 

unfortunately MANY brakes reduce flash signature slightly..

so your best bet? put something on there that looks MOST like a brake and LEAST like a hider... because if they ever really wanted to push the issue you would find yourself in court.. in front of a jury of people that are mostly likely not gun advocates faced with the following case..

 

"the law says you can not have a flash hider on this gun"

"tests conclude that this muzzle device does in fact reduce signature.. therefore it is the states standing that the item qualifies as a flash hider, and thus turns this rifle into an assault weapon which is illegal in NJ"

 

there is NOTHING stated in NJ law that binds them to the ARF definition or opinion letters regarding muzzle devices..

[lunker 274]

Vlad's post made me think...

God, I am so glad I don't have to put up with NJ gun laws any more. New Hampshire is an improvement in just about every way (although I haven't been through a New England winter yet).

 

Of course I have new considerations. I live and work near the Mass border. I often take a Mass highway (495) to work. Getting pulled over in Massachusetts with even a spent shell casing in your car, and you are looking at jail time unless you have a Mass firearms license. I may get a non-resident one as a just-in-case. It requires a face to face interview with the police. 

More fun facts: Massachusetts is the one state in the country whose DWI jail sentence is so severe, that getting one there turns you into a "prohibited Person" and no longer eligible to own firearms. 

 

 

flash hider is really touchy in NJ and anyone that says otherwise should put up some facts...

 

NJ does NOT define flash hider.. they simply use the term "flash hider"

that means from a legal standpoint if the muzzle device hides flash then IMO they COULD try to make a case out of it...

 

unfortunately MANY brakes reduce flash signature slightly..

so your best bet? put something on there that looks MOST like a brake and LEAST like a hider... because if they ever really wanted to push the issue you would find yourself in court.. in front of a jury of people that are mostly likely not gun advocates faced with the following case..

 

"the law says you can not have a flash hider on this gun"

"tests conclude that this muzzle device does in fact reduce signature.. therefore it is the states standing that the item qualifies as a flash hider, and thus turns this rifle into an assault weapon which is illegal in NJ"

 

there is NOTHING stated in NJ law that binds them to the ARF definition or opinion letters regarding muzzle devices..

[pbkid6974 1]

Like vlad said, nj doesn't define them. So until they do or ban something by name I will continue to use anything labeled and sold as a comp. If that lands me in hot water then I will deal with it then. But I'm 99.9% confident that it won't. So I will use it and tell other who are interested in it that I use it and like it. The only way we're going to get our rights back is by pushing the envelope. So that's what im doing in some people's eyes.

[vladtepes 1,060]

Like vlad said, nj doesn't define them. So until they do or ban something by name I will continue to use anything labeled and sold as a comp. If that lands me in hot water then I will deal with it then. But I'm 99.9% confident that it won't. So I will use it and tell other who are interested in it that I use it and like it. The only way we're going to get our rights back is by pushing the envelope. So that's what im doing in some people's eyes.

 

 

you will not get your rights back by breaking the law (or even pushing the law) and then fighting it... just look at the lady from PA that got caught with the gun.. NJ sees how ridiculous the law is.. they recognize public outcry.. but do they change the law? create some way to honor out of state permits? nope.. they just make an exception and sweep it under the rug..

 

just to be clear.. I agree it is VERY unlikely that YOU or anyone else will ever be arrested for a flash hider.. hell I will even go as far as to say you could have an A2 hider on there and it is unlikely a cop would ever make a case out of it.. BUT at the same time I am warning that IF they did.. if something silly happened and your evil looking black rifle ended up in front of a jury.. understand that the jury will more than likely NOT be filled with your gun loving peers.. it will be filled with people that at BEST will be indifferent to guns.. but statistically more likely to be filled with people who wonder why you would even want a "military style machine gun".. so my point was simply this.. there are plenty of tame looking comps out there.. ones that do not reduce flash signature.. so for me personally.. if I still lived in NJ.. I would stick with that type of setup.. because a brake that might be questionable is not with my time.. money.. or freedom.. trying to defend..

 

you.. personally are free to do what you like.. you are an adult.... but I think as a whole gun owners in NJ need to be very cautious.. all it takes is one car accident on the way home from the range for your gear to be scrutinized.. and if that scrutiny comes from the wrong person.. right or wrong.. you might be in for a fight.. and losing that fight might cost a lot more than ANY brake is worth..

[raz-0 1,259]

Like vlad said, nj doesn't define them. So until they do or ban something by name I will continue to use anything labeled and sold as a comp. If that lands me in hot water then I will deal with it then. But I'm 99.9% confident that it won't. So I will use it and tell other who are interested in it that I use it and like it. The only way we're going to get our rights back is by pushing the envelope. So that's what im doing in some people's eyes.

Yes, it is sold as a comp. Quoting bcm, it is sold as having:

 

"Tuned slots and interior cone offer maximum in recoil mitigations, compensation of muzzle-rise, and flash reduction."

 

So. You are trusting that, in the land of everything gun related is an affirmative defense, where they have banned a 22lr as an m-1 carbine because they mentioned m-1 carbine in an ad, that there is no way it could be construed as a flash suppressor?

 

Gotcha. BCM going to be your expert witness?

 

[pbkid6974 1]

Nope but video showing that there is a flash next to widely accepted counterparts should clear things up. It does not hide and of the flash just spits it out differently.

[Vlad G 345]

Nope but video showing that there is a flash next to widely accepted counterparts should clear things up. It does not hide and of the flash just spits it out differently.

 

You are a funny guy.

[vladtepes 1,060]

Nope but video showing that there is a flash next to widely accepted counterparts should clear things up. It does not hide and of the flash just spits it out differently.

 

you do understand that there are "flash hiders" that do not completely eliminate flash right?

[Shane45 807]

I want an oompa loompa now!

 

 

Do everyone a favor pbkid, just direct anyone you advise to this thread so they can make an informed decision.

 

Me, I will continue to be wary of the state I review case after case of people being arrested erroneously like the mom arrested for airsoft guns locked in the trunk of her car on her way home from playing airsolft with her son but without a handgun permit, or people arrested for paintball guns, or the ones arrested for legally owned guns.....

[pbkid6974 1]

do what you want. ill do what i want. im not afraid of the state or the laws as i have done nothing wrong. if someone wants to arrest me for doing something completely legal then so be it. it wouldnt be the first time. like i said, ill cross that bridge when i get there.

[Vlad G 345]

ill cross that bridge when i get there.

 

Good luck, the tolls are expensive, and you are taking that chance for a comp that is nothing special and outclassed by 20 or more different comps on the market.

[pbkid6974 1]

what 20 or more comps is it outclassed by? i've shot all the big names out there and honestly don't find much difference between any of them besides noise.

[Vlad G 345]

To be fair I didn't shoot the BCM one, but the internet tells me it compares to the battlecomp and that I've shot. Plus, I can look at it and know it will have limited effectivness due to its design.

 

Highly effective comps are really shaped in two ways, and none of them work with longitudinal ports, it is basically a single chamber low pressure comp. It can be cool looking and have all the logo's engraved but fluid dynamics are an unforgiving bitch.

 

The more effective comps are multi-chamber, some with high pressure chambers, some without. They direct the gases through either round or vertical ports, and either slanted ports or smaller top mounted high pressure ports.

 

Take a look the SJC Titan, Rolling Thunder, Seekings, Dynamic Resistance, Dreadnought F2, Miculek, JP/Coolie, Fortis Red, etc. There are lots of them in that type of design, some of them like the newer ones (Seekings, DR) designed with heavy computational fluid dynamics work before anyone touches metal. They look like this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And yes, all of those are LOUD and blasty, but that's how physics works. They are far more effective comps, and there are a lot of varieties using those design elements.

 

If you are curious about the science behind them and the kind of analysis that goes into them

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you want something the looks cool, has a tactical brand, and does some amount of recoil and movement control, by all means get a battlecomp, dynacomp, Fc556. or BCM comp. They do indeed what they say on the tin, but they are not in the class of full zorch comps, because they worry about flash and so on.