Cheap optics for a Stag Model 3

[irishpete 2]

Myself & the wife picked up a pair of Stag model 3's friday with no sights.

I have been looking at the below sights as a cheap way to kit them out with optics.

My only real requirement would be that the rifle has a minimal setup if i need to use for 3 gun or tactical courses.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AU68V46/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0019SS8CE/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

I also plan to put a cheap set of offset iron sights on it as well.

I would welcome some constructive input on the above optics .

[Krdshrk 3,877]

I've looked at both and passed on both.  Do you want magnification or just red dots?

 

I've run with a Vortex SPARC and Vortex Strikefire red dots.  I prefer the SPARC as it's smaller.

 

I however have just made the decision to switch to a magnified optic.  I picked up a BUshnell AR Optics 1-4x24mm BDC scope from Palmetto's Black Friday deals.  It arrived - Now I just need a good mount for it... Probably will get a Burris PEPR.

[jrfly3006 42]

I have the Bushnell TRS25 for about 3 years now...beat it up...hasn't missed a beat...keeps zero...new ones come with a riser mount as an option...Ive seen them recently on Slickguns for under $60

[Sandy 44]

I already have a Vortex Striker , it is on the gun already as you know , since you only need to buy one optic splurge a little. And the apostrophe is in the wrong place in your siggy. But yes please , advice on offset iron sights.

[rightisright 3]

Offset Irons: http://www.amazon.com/Advanced-Optics-45-Degree-Transition-Backup/dp/B006X9DLQM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1417632917&sr=8-1&keywords=offset+iron+sights

 

I have a set of those.  I usually shy away from inexpensive gun stuff because most of it is cheaply made.  But after reading all the positive reviews, I dropped a Jackson on them and am suitably impressed.  While the finish on these isn't as nice as the ridiculously overpriced Duecks my buddy has, for 1/10th the price, they are quite nice. 

[Mr.Stu 1,921]

Grammar Nazi alert!

 

And the apostrophe is in the wrong place in your siggy. But yes please , advice on offset iron sights.

Did you really start a sentence with "And" and then another one with "But", swiftly followed by the use of "advice" when you meant "advise", all in the same paragraph as criticizing the placement of an apostrophe?

 

It's time you updated your siggy, I think.

 

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[Sandy 44]

Grammar Nazi alert!

 

 

Did you really start a sentence with "And" and then another one with "But", swiftly followed by the use of "advice" when you meant "advise", all in the same paragraph as criticizing the placement of an apostrophe?

 

It's time you updated your siggy, I think.

 

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Casual text speak on a forum is not nearly the same as completely f'ing up a contraction.

 

Would you like some advice? I'll give you some advice. I'd advise you go though every post you made for the last 6 months and edit anything that is not perfect grammar . I'm home all day , and I am not afraid to waste my time. 

 

I fixed my siggy. There. 

 

Like Donkey Kong.

 

All kidding aside , can someone recommend decent offset iron sights for an AR15

[irishpete 2]

Currently the Barska 1-4x28 IR Riflescope is leading the pack

Here's the offset sights I will probably get

 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009EVIXLY/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3CJ9G8HQZVZBJ

 

P.s. I already splurged on the ARs so untill the wallet heals up - not anytime soon, cheap it will have to be

[Mr.Stu 1,921]

If you are going to get offset iron sights, consider going for a higher magnification optic. I have a 2-8x Nikon which I'm considering changing for something a bit more powerful. On the 2x setting there is not much difference or advantage to switching to the irons. A 1x would obviously have no difference at all.

 

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[irishpete 2]

On the !X optic usefullness, it depends on your viewpoint of offset sights, if you believe bateries can die and you need to have something available to sight with in a hurry , offsets seem to fulfill that role.

If they are viewed as purely for close up work, then yes a higher - even Fixed - mag scope might be a better compliment 

[Mr.Stu 1,921]

True, I didn't think of that view point as my scope has no batteries.

 

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[Mr.Stu 1,921]

Would you like some advice?

You say that as if I have a choice

 

I'll give you some advice. I'd advise you go though every post you made for the last 6 months and edit anything that is not perfect grammar . I'm home all day , and I am not afraid to waste my time.

This, I know to be true. You really would, wouldn't you?

 

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[Sandy 44]

Anywho....

So , the Vortex and the iron sights are redundant . Batteries be damned. Wonder if I should go with something else after all?The Vortex is not what I would have picked , it came with an M&P Sport we picked up during the Black Rifle Crisis.  I prefer iron sights close quarters. What Nikon scope do you have?

[Mr.Stu 1,921]

I have the M-223 2-8x32mm with the nikoplex reticle. It retails for around $300. I'm not sure if that is within your budget - you did say cheap.

 

Do you want it?

 

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[checko 180]

I'm confused as to what the op is looking for? If looking for a cheap magnified optic I look at primary arms.

https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_Rifle_Scopes_s/919.htm

 

 

 

 

[Lalo 13]

I'm confused as to what the op is looking for? If looking for a cheap magnified optic I look at primary arms. https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_Rifle_Scopes_s/919.htm

+1

[ronhonda 86]

I'm a firm believer of buy once cry once. I would get some decent Iron sights (magpul) and practice with the rifle and get a "better quality" scope when the wallet is fully recovered. That being said I would get this scope for roughly the same amount as the ones you posted; https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_1_4X_24_Illuminated_Scope_PA14X_p/pa14x.htm

I've seen many of those scopes at work and they always seem to leave a bad taste in their owners gullets. The primary arms scope has received favorable reviews on many sights.

As far as off set iron sights go, you pay for what you get. The Dueck sights are the most popular and the most expensive.

Magpul is releasing/released a off set sight based on their Pro iron sight with a $190 street price for the pair http://store.magpul.com/category/MBUS

I have a set of the cheapo off set sights and you are welcome to have them just let the Boss know and she can grab them at GFH.

Another option you can try is the JP Short Range tactical Sight http://www.jprifles.com/1.6.4.1_sights.php

My friend is getting rid of his sight and rail, let me know if interested.

Again, If you plan on competing, self defense, zombies, whatever, save up and buy quality. Worst thing is regretting purchases you made and having to replace things.

I'm sure others like Vlad or raz-o will chime in and offer more advice. 

[Mr.Stu 1,921]

Another thought, Pete - you are left eye dominant and shoot rifles left handed. I don't know if that makes finding offset sights any harder.

 

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[irishpete 2]

No, I believe they can just be turned around and offset on the far side.

[ronhonda 86]

pete are you right handed or left?

[Sandy 44]

He is right handed but left eye dominant.

[ronhonda 86]

has Pete tried to cover his left eye with a patch or something and force him to use his right?

I rather try this than to force someone to shoot opposite their dominant hand.

FWIW, the new shooters that come in to work have great success with it.

[High Exposure 5,664]

He is right handed but left eye dominant.

Most shooters that I know that have this issue find it easier to shoot long guns lefty and handguns righty.

[Sandy 44]

He actually cross shoulders it . I can't see that being comfortable , but he seems to prefer it to shooting lefty .

[Sandy 44]

has Pete tried to cover his left eye with a patch or something and force him to use his right?

I rather try this than to force someone to shoot opposite their dominant hand.

FWIW, the new shooters that come in to work have great success with it.

I would ask him to try that , if only for the photo op.

[Mr.Stu 1,921]

has Pete tried to cover his left eye with a patch or something and force him to use his right?

I would ask him to try that , if only for the photo op.

I think you're going to need a hook and a parrot to really carry it off

 

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[checko 180]

Most shooters that I know that have this issue find it easier to shoot long guns lefty and handguns righty.

I have this issue and find it easy to shoot long guns righty and line up my handguns sights with my left eye

[Krdshrk 3,877]

I think you're going to need a hook and a parrot to really carry it off

 

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And a peg leg

[Vlad G 345]

For what you have mentioned (3gun or tactical courses) you basically have two major options. Either a red dot (which it sounds like you already have) or a low power variable scope. 

 

I'll talk about the scope part, as you already have the red dot option. 

 

In the IDEAL world you might want a 1-6x or 1-8x scope with true 1x, daytime illumination, and bulletproof construction. The problem is that we are now talk about $1000-$3000 and thats probably not what you want to spend. I personally run a Vortex 1-6x and I can't sing its praises enough, it is true 1x and the illumination is brighter then my aimpoint, it is just as fast as a reddot, although quite a bit heavier. The 6x lets you see and hit reasonably sized targets (say 10 inches) out to 500y or so. . Even if the battery dies you still have the crosshair, and the scope if very rugged.  It is pretty much the go-to scope for 3gun at this point, but it costs about $1400.  Do yourself a favor and don't even look through one, because you will then do nothing but think which organs you can sell so you can buy one. I know, because I'm still selling blood and bone marrow to pay off the mortgage on mine. I won't even tell you how much 1-8x scopes cost.  

 

But that is not the kind of money you want to spend, so we need to look lower. 

 

There are now some cheaper 1-6 scopes, but in my opinion they give up to much on optics clarity to make the 6x work while maintaining a lower price. I believe it is better to "downgrade" to 1-4x scopes, you get more optic quality for your money. 

 

Unfortunately I can't recommend any of the scopes I've seen in the price range of the things you've linked. They all suffered from bad optics, to the point that I rather use a cheap red dot with no amplification then crummy lenses. Also the illumination on them is an afterthought, possibly useful in a dark house, but outside in daylight it is pointless, though thats really true for anything under $500 that I've seen. 

 

Of the scopes I've personally seen and played with, the "cheaper" ones I would recommend, in order of price, would be the Millet DMS 1-4x, Burris Tac30, Burris MTAC, and the Vortex Viper PST. All of these are more expensive then what you initially linked, the DMS can be found for just about $200, the PST is $450 if you shop around, the others are in between. I have seen both the Primary Arms scopes (1-4 and 1-6) and I found them very lacking, at least for my eyes, I like their red dots, but not their scopes. I have no experience with the Nikon M-223 or the Bushnell AR-optic but they might be worth looking into.

 

The PEPR mount is pretty decent for what it is, and you do need a mount, so all together I would say  if you are looking at less the $300 (DMS + PEPR) you will probably end up throwing away your money when you want to replace them with something better, which eventually you will. 

 

Personally, I'd say that if $300 is too much for this project (and I'd say try to hit $500 and get the cheaper Vortex), then you would be better off with just a red dot you already have. 

 

I don't run iron sights on my 3gun rifle, at all, and after a while everyone removes theirs. Modern scopes are pretty darn reliable and the 1x means you never use the iron sights for close range.

[irishpete 2]

Thanks for the info Vlad, Something to chew on.

I am left eye dominant and right handed. I shoot pistol with both eyes open and have to shoot lefty with a long gun so my left eye can get down and sight along the barrel.

It feels awkward manipulating the Rifle with my off hand but i cannot get my left eye along the gun sights when I shoulder it on the right so I have no choice there.

I do believe I have a pirate hat lying around somewheres so the photo Op would be still on