Loading plated VS FMJ

[302w 83]

I need bullets and I am strongly considering buying some plated 200 or 230 grain RN 45 ACP tonight because there is a 5% sale as ridiculous as that is.

 

My Lyman and Sierra books are extremely contradictory on loading with Bullseye. I believe the Sierra because it is about 20 years newer. I know when loading plated you use lead data, but I have read that using FMJ data subtracted by 10% also works. Is that true? Neither book has "enough" information for me.

 

Rainer says to use FMJ data strictly. 

 

I would like to load in the ballpark of 850 FPS. 

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Check on Brian Enos - there's plenty of load data there with plated bullets.

[302w 83]

Just checked. Lyman says 200 grain cast, start 3.5 with 731 fps and max 4.8 at 913 fps. Sierra says jacketed at 5.8 grains (!) at 850 fps max.

 

Ridiculous.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=179229#entry1998459

 

http://thefiringline.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-504465.html

[tony357 386]

EDIT:  had to look but i knew i had found load info when i loaded up my plated bullets had been a while.

http://www.berrysmfg.com/faq-q21-c1-Load_Data_for_Berrys_Preferred_Plated_Bullets.aspx

 

FAQ: Load Data for Berry's Preferred Plated Bullets

Currently published load data is limited to some calibers by Accurate, Western Powders and Hodgdon.  We are working with these companies to get data published for all of our bullets.

 

We recommend using hard cast load data or start with mid-range jacketed data.  Make sure data is below 1250fps unless you are using a Thick-Plated bullet that we list a higher max velocity for like the 9mm 124gr HBRN-TP that can be shot to 1500fps in open class guns like a .38 Super.  Keep in mind that since our plated bullet has the same pressure curve as a hard cast bullet, the published cast data will be very close to what you will get with our plated bullets.  If you use Jacketed data with our plated bullets you can get  from 5% - 8% increase in velocity using that data.

 

Other than the data from Western and Accurate for the 9mm, .40S&W and Hodgdon .40S&W  there is no printed data available.

For further questions you can email [email protected]

 

[T Bill 649]

We used to have a saying when loading 200SWCL 45ACP with BE.

 

For bullseye shooting "Three Five Bullseye",

For ISPC "Five Five Bullseye"

 

Reduced power load required lighter spring, full power, full factory spring minimum, about 175PF.

[AverageJoe 95]

Xtreme bullets get loaded just like FMJ...when I started rolling my own i called them to see if they could provide any load data, they weren't able to due to insurance reasons but they did say I could follow the Speer book no prob. I also suggest picking up a chono start low and work your way up.

[302w 83]

Decided to go with 230 grain. I was reading that felt recoil is actually higher with the lighter weight stuff. 45acp doesn't bother me but if it was easier shooting I would have tried it.

 

I'm going to probably load it with 4.6-4.7 of bullseye with a 1.265 COAL like I do my FMJ. I forget what the listed FPS is but it is low 800s if I remember correctly. I'm curious to see if I notice a difference in accuracy. I probably won't.

 

Again, thanks for all of the help. You guys are great with newbies.

[carl_g 568]

I use those xtreme 230gr RN.

I am loading using FMJ data somewhere in the middle between min and max according to Hodgdons

[sof 0]

Same as carl_g only with 200 gr RN x-treme.

Shoot quite well and any difference in recoil compared with the 230 gr is minimal.

[302w 83]

So.. These plated bullets are a PITA.

 

Is it safe to shoot loaded rounds that I stripped the plating on? Funny how I wasn't stripping the plating on empty brass I was loading. I have 9 rounds like that. The rest of the cases I charged already I just threw an FMJ in out of frustration.

 

Also, I have to bell them so much that they're difficult to fit in my seating die with a bullet in and the round has a tiny flare to it after seating(475 compared to 471 normally) . I suppose I will buy a lee taper die.

[AverageJoe 95]

So.. These plated bullets are a PITA.

 

Is it safe to shoot loaded rounds that I stripped the plating on? Funny how I wasn't stripping the plating on empty brass I was loading. I have 9 rounds like that. The rest of the cases I charged already I just threw an FMJ in out of frustration.

 

Also, I have to bell them so much that they're difficult to fit in my seating die with a bullet in and the round has a tiny flare to it after seating(475 compared to 471 normally) . I suppose I will buy a lee taper die.

Wait, what? Stripped the plating?

[NJKen 23]

Wait, what? Stripped the plating?

Im not sure about 302w but I have stripped the plating once or twice.  You need to bell the case a little more than you would for FMJ .  There is a really, really fine line between too much flare and just rite. 

Ken

[sof 0]

It does seem as if the x-treme plated bullets are a hair thicker, and I too had a couple of rounds where there was a little shaving of the copper in one spot. I disassembled the rounds and neither was through the copper all the way, but I guess that it would have to affect accuracy if I was good enough to see it.  Increasing the expansion a hair made the problem disappear.

[302w 83]

Yes, stripped the bullet plating.

 

I think I have it G2G now. 

 

I readjusted my dies a bit. I am crimping/seating with my 1970 RCBS dies now to a COAL of 1.265" and a .469 crimp all in one pass through my rock chucker. I read that too much crimp will cause horrific accuracy... I would like to get to the range and see how these perform. If they work well, I'm going on a loading frenzy. 

[AverageJoe 95]

What kind of plated bullets you using? I've only used xtreme, which are heavily plated and never done that.

[302w 83]

I'm using xtreme 230gr RN. Very shiney.

[AverageJoe 95]

I'm using xtreme 230gr RN. Very shiney.

Thats odd. I've cut their 9 and .40/10mm in half and it was not easy, that plating was on there thick. Take a pic and post it.

[dman2112 6]

My experience has been to load lead plus 10% and then chrono the results. Look at the primers for anything unusual and that had worked for me. Has worked out to be about mid-way between lead and hot fmj.

[302w 83]

Thats odd. I've cut their 9 and .40/10mm in half and it was not easy, that plating was on there thick. Take a pic and post it.

 

Here you go. From right to left I have one "good" plated round (how does my crimp look?), an FMJ I loaded, and the rest are my "bad" rounds. I loaded another 50 and maybe one or two got slight stripping but I left it.

 

[Mr.Stu 1,918]

Are you trimming your cases? If so are you deburring them throughly?

[carl_g 568]

Here you go. From right to left I have one "good" plated round (how does my crimp look?), an FMJ I loaded, and the rest are my "bad" rounds. I loaded another 50 and maybe one or two got slight stripping but I left it.

 

Wow! I have never had that problem..

[302w 83]

Are you trimming your cases? If so are you deburring them throughly?

 

No. Once I flared my case mouths more the issue went away for the most part.

 

Edit: Is it possible these bullets are defective? I believe it is my fault I stripped the plating, but I don't see much of it on the internet. \

[Krdshrk 3,877]

I've stripped the plating on some - but then I was still adjusting my press...  

[AverageJoe 95]

Thats impressive, never seen that before...how did the lever feel when seating your bullet? Had to have been resistance...What does the pulled bullet look like? Also it seems to be in one focused spot on all of them, sure you're placing the bullet on straight enough? Just thinking out loud, round peg into round hole, the surface touches around the complete circumference, should scrape all the way around, no?

[Tunaman 548]

I would measure the inside of the case before and after resizing and measure the new bullets.  Something is going on there.

[raz-0 1,259]

No. Once I flared my case mouths more the issue went away for the most part.

 

Edit: Is it possible these bullets are defective? I believe it is my fault I stripped the plating, but I don't see much of it on the internet. \

 

Your fault or your die's fault or a bit of both. They were not seated straight, and someone *cough* *cough* pushed real hard like on the handle in that state and shaved the plating. Your answer of belling the case mouth is the appropriate answer. The lee powder through belling die does a pretty nice job without distoritng the case too much. Better than anyone else's in my experience, and I've loaded a lot of plated. 

 

BTW, Don't fire those like that. Good luck getting them out, I'd just toss them. Although it being .45, a kinetic puller might work easier. I've used them with success for .45 plated that's softer than extreme. .40 extreme's though... not worth my time unless I really need something out from inside the case. the destroy kinetic pullers too fast, and collet pullers don't get them out without mangling the bullet beyond any useful purpose. 

 

It also looks like you are using a roll crimp, which isn't the best idea with plated. If you can pull one intact, if it isn't compromising the plating it should be fine. 

[302w 83]

Tunaman, what dimensions do you want? Just the ID at the case neck?

 

Raz-o, I think it is probably my fault. I really didn't jam the bullets home though so I suspect I'm doing something else wrong. I know because I barely flare my brass with FMJ and then use an ever so slight amount of persuasion.

 

I plan on tossing the few bad rounds I loaded in the learning process.

 

Also, I really need to get my crimp together. I'm using 1970 RCBS dies and I don't know how to set up for a taper crimp, or if it is possible with these.

 

Kinda wish I spent the extra $20 and got FMJ.

 

Edit: my Johnson-administration era dies are set up for roll crimping and not taper. SOB.

[Tunaman 548]

Measure the sized case neck (inside) before flaring and measure the diam of the plated bullets.  Just to make sure the bullets are not oversized for some reason.

[carl_g 568]

I am using lee dies with these bullets in both 9mm and 45 ACP and have had no issues.. maybe it is the dies that are being used?