Jump to content
danw77

Penalty for Pistol on WMA Range

Recommended Posts

I have a friend who continues to shoot his .22 pistol at one of the WMA ranges. I told him many times that it isn't allowed, but since "no one has bothered him" he continues to do it and doesn't see a problem with it. I've tried to persuade him to stop, but he continues. Does anyone know what the penalty is if he gets caught? I'm hoping if he knows what's at stake he might stop shooting his pistol there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Definitely a ticket from a CO, at the least. And possible confiscation of his gun as well. When you mess up in the field they can take your gun or equipment depending on the offense. Being on WMA property, with a gun not approved for the range or hunting, is a great way to donate your gun back to the state. Bet your buddy thinks all CO's show up in uniform in state marked trucks too. Sometimes they're dressed just like we are, and hang out sighting in their guns for hunting seasons as well. Your friend will find out the hard way sooner or later.

 

BTW any tickets from fish and game can result in loss of hunting and fishing privileges for a minimum of 2 years. It happened to me, and it sucks!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IANAL, but I wouldn't consider driving to a RANGE (even a WMA Range) with a gun to be a crime, even if it's a hand gun!  Just leave it in the car's trunk and play with your rifles and scatterguns at a WMA!

 

Driving from a LEGAL (WMA) range to a commercial range to punch paper with a hand gun is an EXEMPTED activity in my book, so ONLY the act of USING the forbidden CREATURE known as a hand gun should be afoul of the laws.  If by chance mere possession or transportation of a hand gun to a state run range is a problem, then somebody better tell Fish and Game to stop holding black powder hand gun NRA certification classes there, since that's where I took mine!

 

Dave

NRA Certified Instructor Muzzleloading Pistol (and others, lol)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

WMAs are not exempted locations.

 

For a handgun, he's looking at 2nd degree unlawful possession of a weapon 2C:39-5(b).

 

That's a Graves Act offense and carries a mandatory minimum sentence of 5 years in state prison, without a mandatory 3 year parole disqualifier.

 

 

If he has hollowpoints, those are an additional (4°) charge.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

WMAs are not exempted locations.

 

For a handgun, he's looking at 2nd degree unlawful possession of a weapon 2C:39-5(b).

 

That's a Graves Act offense and carries a mandatory minimum sentence of 5 years in state prison, without a mandatory 3 year parole disqualifier.

 

 

If he has hollowpoints, those are an additional (4°) charge.

Where does it say that?  I read the WMA rules.  How can a RANGE not be an EXEMPTED location?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dave:

 

First, let me say that I'm 100% opposed to these stupid, unconstitutional laws.

 

 

That said, the OP specifically mentioned "I have a friend who continues to shoot his .22 pistol at one of the WMA ranges."

 

All it takes is one jerk who sees him to call the locals and his life is ruined.

 

As for "holding black powder hand gun NRA certification classes there"...

 

That's the same as transporting to buybacks: It's illegal, until a govt agency declares it ok. By fiat. Because we're a democracy, lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^^^I concur with regards to the idiot actually using the hand gun.  He more than likely gets away with it since a hand gun with standard velosity .22's barks about as much as a .22 carbine with Stingers (HV).  If he does get caught, he faces a ticket for between $50-$1,500 depending, on the 1st offense.  On this we agree sir.

 

My frame of reference may be jaded or more complete than yours since we've never met.  I have yet to re-read the 2C statutues to ascertain as to whether or not such infraction occurs with mere possession on WMA property or whether or not you actually have to be caught pumping lead into the ground.  Be that as it may, I'm having a problem with a RANGE not being an EXEMPTED location.  Here's another example:  I wanna go shoot at paper at OBRPC's indoor range.  I put my unloaded hand guns in the trunk of my car, and an unloaded scattergun to use at the outdoor range (on my next stop) and drive directly there.   I finish with one type of platform and drive to the outdoor range to shoot the other.  BOTH are EXEMPT locations, but I'm NOT required to make a special trip to go get my scattergun to shoot clays in the air...  We have Range Rules posted on the internet, just like the Division does, which forbid the use of scatterguns at the indoor range.  But nobody is telling me that I'm committing a CRIME by having them secured in my car trunk while parked on Club property.... 

 

So I guess it's time to go to the archives and take a gander....

 

Oh, did I mention that we did our practical for bp hand guns there too, and NOT just the classroom?  So I'm entertained by your last line, lol!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Where does it say that? I read the WMA rules. How can a RANGE not be an EXEMPTED location?

A: I wouldn't even recommend transportinga handgun to a WMA and leaving it in your trunk.

You might be able to argue that even though handguns are specifically prohibited by the WMA, it still counts as an exempted location to transport a handgun. Even though you can't shoot it there.

But even if that worked out for you, it would be after you were arrested, charged, the gun(s) seized, you put up a $50-75k bail and paid through the nose for a good lawyer.

 

Again, that's if it never comes out of the car.

 

___________

B: If you do bring it out and load it (nevermind shooting it like the OP's buddy), you can no longer claim the transportation exemption:

 

All weapons being transported under paragraph (2) of subsection b., subsection e., or paragraph (1) or (3) of subsection f. of this section shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported, and in the course of travel shall include only such deviations as are reasonably necessary under the circumstances.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 Be that as it may, I'm having a problem with a RANGE not being an EXEMPTED location.

From the law....(b) Directly to or from any target range, or other authorized place for the

purpose of practice, match, target, 

 

WMA's qualify as ANY TARGET RANGE, but I think we'd agree that they are not an authorized place for the purpose of pistol target practice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If WMA does not allow handguns, then as far as the state would be concerned, it's not a "range" for handguns.   It's simply state property where they allow the use of long guns.

 

They have more expensive lawyers than you can afford.  They would win the dictionary battle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a friend who continues to shoot his .22 pistol at one of the WMA ranges. I told him many times that it isn't allowed, but since "no one has bothered him" he continues to do it and doesn't see a problem with it. I've tried to persuade him to stop, but he continues. Does anyone know what the penalty is if he gets caught? I'm hoping if he knows what's at stake he might stop shooting his pistol there.

Good job of ratting out your friend.

 

Probably will be a stake out now.

 

I've seen people do it BTW

 

I don't think you thought this out before you posted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah Kings-over, I think we do agree for the most part.

 

Being a Shooter for over 45 years now (since i was a kid myself), I'll add some more gas to the fire:  

 

If I was a WMA Cop and saw a guy/gal and his/her kid out plinking with a Ruger hand gun after first watching them sweep-up a thoroughly disgusting pile of empty shotgun hulls, beer cans, broken glass beer bottles, brass of every caliber known to man, and paper and plastic target refuse blowing all over MY range, I'd go over and hand them some more .22's to have fun with and say thanks for cleanin'-up after all of the SLOBS who used the Range before you.....but that's just me.  

FWIW I got this story from the Dad who took the Ruger to the Range.  Sometimes being nice and respecting a Range gets you some slack.  IANAL and I don't recommend anyone ever try this, so don't think I'm saying to violate a WMA rule and risk a fine!  So keep yer hand guns in yer trunk till ya get to the commercial or private range, and buried under a blanket for good measure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the mostly helpful feedback. I don't see how this is ratting out my friend. His position was that since it was a .22, it was allowed. He wasn't saying "F- the law, I'm going to do what I want."

 

I wasn't sure if worst case was a slap in the wrist type punishment or unlawful possession, as was mentioned. To me, this post is very informative and hopefully will help other people too. Even if we don't agree with the law, isn't it in everyone's best interest to make sure we're following it? If that's not thinking things through, then I apologize.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I go and shoot clays at my local WMA (Millville) all the time. Most of the time I see some yahoo's shooting pistols on the "rifle" range. I always figured that no one is that stupid to shoot handguns right next to a sign that states "no handguns" So, I always presumed that they were LEO's who know they can do anything they want.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Target Practice

Only archery, shotgun, muzzleloading shotgun, muzzleloading rifle and modern .17 and .22 caliber rimfire rifle shooting is allowed in designated hunter training ranges. One member of the shooting party must have a current, valid New Jersey hunting license.

The following types of ranges are available on designated WMAs statewide:

Shotgun Range
: for use with clay birds and the patterning of fine shot (lead-free only shot at Assunpinkand Colliers Mills);

Archery Range
: approved backstops at select ranges, no broadheads allowed;

Muzzleloading Rifle and Shotgun Slug Range: for sighting in with shotgun slugs or buckshot, modern .17 and .
22 caliber rimfire rifles;
muzzleloaders; and air-guns in the calibers legal for small game hunting.
No other firearms allowed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

His position was that since it was a .22, it was allowed.

 

I am curious how he came to this conclusion.  Is it because the round is called 22 long rifle?  If so, I guess the FN 5.7 is OK to use because it is mainly a rifle round?  or an AR pistol is OK to use because it shoots .223 (rifle round), etc..  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

WMAs are not exempt locations for handguns of any caliber. And no you can't drive there with handguns in the trunk, shoot your rifles, then drive to the range to shoot your handguns. Why would anyone do that anyway? Are there ranges that don't allow .22 caliber and below?

 

 

I don't see how possession at a WMA would be any different from the law's perspective as possession at Shop Rite. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The designated ranges at the state's WMA locations are technically called "Hunter Training Areas." They were set up to allow the use of firearms that you can legally hunt with in the state to "train." Lawful use of of Hunter Training Areas require you or one member of your party to be in possession of a valid New Jersey hunting license. Since handguns are not a viable firearm legal for hunting in New Jersey, it would stand to reason that they might be excluded. Centerfire rifles are excluded as well, despite their legal use for hunting in limited applications in the state.

I don't know why anyone would think that handguns are allowed.

Keep in mind that some ranges have been closed due to EPA restrictions in the last few years, while others have had limits placed on their use thanks to complaints from neighbors due to "noise." I would hate to see more closed due to misuse.

Note: There are designated "dog training areas" in some of these same WMA's. It is only in these areas that you can train and run your hunting dog on specific dates in-season or out-of season. You can't let your dog run just anywhere on state WMA land except during certain times of the year either. PS - The dog also needs to be "properly licensed" in addition to the dog owner.

New Jersey...............where fun goes to die.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There may be a time when the State says enough is enough, too many people shooting handguns at these locations. Could lead to more restrictions or closing of wma"s. Breaking gun laws only hurts our fight. The better option would be to start a case pushing for a .22lr handgun exemption. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There may be a time when the State says enough is enough, too many people shooting handguns at these locations. Could lead to more restrictions or closing of wma"s. Breaking gun laws only hurts our fight. The better option would be to start a case pushing for a .22lr handgun exemption.

 

Honestly, most center fire should be allowed at WMA ranges too.

 

22lr handguns should be allowed at WMA ranges

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...