Pizza Bob 1,488 Posted December 16, 2015 I'd start by finding people who feel similarly and then schedule an appointment to speak to the mayor. Adios, Pizza Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pizza Bob 1,488 Posted December 16, 2015 Double post. Sorry. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luso 6 Posted December 16, 2015 Total time spent 1hr. Behind closed doors just checked for completeness of application. Had no problem telling me it would take at least 4 months for permits. So much for 30 days. It took 4 and 6 weeks to get my Utah and Florida CCW. How can another state be that much more efficient than the town I have lived in for 37 out of 41 yrs of my life. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk You should have gotten this on tape, we could have used it. Would be gold to have a department say it will take 4 months for permits, that they only accept typed applications, and that they only take applications by appointment a few times a month Go back there and ask again how long it will take and get the time frame recorded on your iPhone. We can use that Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted December 17, 2015 You should have gotten this on tape, we could have used it. Would be gold to have a department say it will take 4 months for permits, that they only accept typed applications, and that they only take applications by appointment a few times a month Go back there and ask again how long it will take and get the time frame recorded on your iPhone. We can use that Actually we don't need a recorded conversation. They are so brazen that all 3 (typed, days, wait) are right on the Manalapan Township Website. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted December 17, 2015 Another thing that Manalapan does that I do not believe is allowed is they send a letter to your employer. There is no spot for name of manager on application but in the "back room" I was asked my employers name so that he knew who to address the letter to. I'm self employed so it didn't affect me, but it did not seem right. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HBecwithFn7 296 Posted December 17, 2015 Another thing that Manalapan does that I do not believe is allowed is they send a letter to your employer. There is no spot for name of manager on application but in the "back room" I was asked my employers name so that he knew who to address the letter to. I'm self employed so it didn't affect me, but it did not seem right. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Actually, the "Employer Name, address and telephone" is Question 12 of the STS-033 application form. So, in essence, they have the right to verify that info. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pizza Bob 1,488 Posted December 17, 2015 Actually, the "Employer Name, address and telephone" is Question 12 of the STS-033 application form. So, in essence, they have the right to verify that info. That info is requested simply to verify employment (don't know why) and can be done with a simple phone call to HR. Too many PD's, and I'll bet Manalapan is among them, use it as a third reference and violate the privacy clause found in the NJAC by disclosing the reason for the inquiry. It would also be adding content beyond the scope of the application to ask an employer's name - as said, the call should simply be made to HR and the reason shouldn't be disclosed. This municipality is obviously one that needs to be reported to the ANJRPC Strikeforce. Adios, Pizza Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HBecwithFn7 296 Posted December 17, 2015 That info is requested simply to verify employment (don't know why) and can be done with a simple phone call to HR. Agreed. But once you've given them the keys to the barn door..... They might call HR, and then they might demand the name / phone of the employee's supervisor from HR (who shouldn't give it), etc. etc. etc.... Too many PD's, and I'll bet Manalapan is among them, use it as a third reference and violate the privacy clause found in the NJAC by disclosing the reason for the inquiry. It would also be adding content beyond the scope of the application to ask an employer's name - as said, the call should simply be made to HR and the reason shouldn't be disclosed. This municipality is obviously one that needs to be reported to the ANJRPC Strikeforce. Also agreed. And I also agree that practice is wrong. If, for example, the interviewing LEO asks for the employee's direct supervisor, etc. that's unacceptable. If the LEA advises the employer that the purpose of the call is to verify the employee's worthiness to own a "firearm" (i.e. they use that word "firearm")... I also believe that "beyond the scope" as well. It's none of the Employer's business. And, if it's a real "anti" employer, the employee could face disciplinary action and be terminated simply for their desire to own firearms. In my case, thankfully, as with the above poster, I own my own business so I was able to use that as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted December 19, 2015 I confirmed Manalapan does contact boss/manager as additional reference Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HBecwithFn7 296 Posted December 19, 2015 I confirmed Manalapan does contact boss/manager as additional reference Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk That's wrong, then, and it should be reported to Operation Strike Force... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9X19 125 Posted December 29, 2015 I get a kick out of how people have been trained to accept how the police "allow" them to do things their way.Sent from an undisclosed location. Yeah but all you did was just move..... Unfortunately most of us will do the same. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted December 31, 2015 For additional handgun permits is it normal to have to pay State Police $20 for background check? I don't remember going online and paying $20 for initial FID and handgun permits. Just curious if this is the norm? Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HBecwithFn7 296 Posted December 31, 2015 For additional handgun permits is it normal to have to pay State Police $20 for background check? I don't remember going online and paying $20 for initial FID and handgun permits. Just curious if this is the norm? Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Yes. For each STS-033 turned in, you have to get a criminal background check. Most municipalities are using the electronic 212A form, which costs $20.00 (previous paper version cost $18.00). The reason you didn't do it (most likely) for your initial FID and P2Ps, is that you probably paid about $60.00 to get fingerprinted (usually by Safran Morpho), and that was the initial criminal background check. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted December 31, 2015 Yes. For each STS-033 turned in, you have to get a criminal background check. Most municipalities are using the electronic 212A form, which costs $20.00 (previous paper version cost $18.00). The reason you didn't do it (most likely) for your initial FID and P2Ps, is that you probably paid about $60.00 to get fingerprinted (usually by Safran Morpho), and that was the initial criminal background check.That's what I kind of figured but a friend of mine was telling me he didn't pay for background check on renewal. I think he may have forgotten he did. I knew I didn't pay on initial but it being part of fingerprint fee makes sense. Just seems redundant that you pay for background check for permits that are only good for 90days (180 if extended) then each time you get a firearm (other than private party Resident to Resident) you pay for NICS background check again. I guess the state's reasoning is to make sure you didn't get in legal trouble between permit issuing and firearm purchase. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HBecwithFn7 296 Posted December 31, 2015 That's what I kind of figured but a friend of mine was telling me he didn't pay for background check on renewal. I think he may have forgotten he did. I knew I didn't pay on initial but it being part of fingerprint fee makes sense. Just seems redundant that you pay for background check for permits that are only good for 90days (180 if extended) then each time you get a firearm (other than private party Resident to Resident) you pay for NICS background check again. I guess the state's reasoning is to make sure you didn't get in legal trouble between permit issuing and firearm purchase. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Well, also, remember that it's the local municipality (or the affected NSJP barracks) that is doing that 212A check for issuing FID/P2Ps. And Only NJ (and/or other Nanny States) do this. When you're actually purchasing a firearm, it's a federal NICS check, per Federal law, but some states piggy back onto that by being POC states (NJ is one). It's the only way NJ can enforce things like OGAM. So, it's a different kind of check for the State. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted December 31, 2015 Well, also, remember that it's the local municipality (or the affected NSJP barracks) that is doing that 212A check for issuing FID/P2Ps. And Only NJ (and/or other Nanny States) do this. When you're actually purchasing a firearm, it's a federal NICS check, per Federal law, but some states piggy back onto that by being POC states (NJ is one). It's the only way NJ can enforce things like OGAM. So, it's a different kind of check for the State.We paying the $20 to the NJSP for 212A check correct? So the NJSP do their own investigation then the municipality further looks into the information for the FID and P2P, but they don't use NICS for this process? Is that correct? Then NICS is a Federal System Check? If so does anyone know what PICS is? Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HBecwithFn7 296 Posted December 31, 2015 We paying the $20 to the NJSP for 212A check correct? Correct. So the NJSP do their own investigation then the municipality further looks into the information for the FID and P2P, but they don't use NICS for this process? Is that correct? I think it's more like the NJSP reports back to the municipality as to whether or not they have any further information on the individual, based on their SBI #. The municipality then decides how to interpret it. Remember, the State criminal background check is for the issuance of the docs. NICS is more about "eligibility to purchase a firearm" in a federal context. Is there overlap? Most likely. But NICS exists for federal purposes, especially for states that don't require the extra bureaucracy that NJ etc. require. Then NICS is a Federal System Check? If so does anyone know what PICS is? NICS is a federal system, operated by the FBI. It's purpose is to ensure that, from a federal perspective, a prospective gun buyer is in not a "prohibited person" and is entitled to purchase the gun. A state has the option of having its FFL's contact NICS directly, or becoming a "Point of Contact" (POC) state, meaning that the State will contact the FBI on behalf of the FFL. The FFL enters the required info to the "state's" NICS system, and the State then passes it onto the FBI NICS system. Pennsylvania, like NJ, (and like Florida) is a POC state. Thus PICS is the Pennsylvania NICS POC for PA FFLs. NJ has one also, operated by the NJSP. Florida uses the FDLE (Fl. Dept. of Law Enforcement, the Investigative authority in FL, similar to Georgia's GBI). One reason a state might do this is to be able to enforce any state laws regarding waiting periods in between handgun purchases or other such restrictions (eg. NJ's OGAM). I'm sure there are others. Hope this helps. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted December 31, 2015 Correct. I think it's more like the NJSP reports back to the municipality as to whether or not they have any further information on the individual, based on their SBI #. The municipality then decides how to interpret it. Remember, the State criminal background check is for the issuance of the docs. NICS is more about "eligibility to own a firearm" in a federal context. Is there overlap? Most likely. But NICS exists for federal purposes, especially for states that don't require the extra bureaucracy that NJ etc. require. NICS is a federal system, operated by the FBI. It's purpose is to ensure that, from a federal perspective, a prospective gun buyer is in not a "prohibited person" and is entitled to purchase the gun. A state has the option of having its FFL's contact NICS directly, or becoming a "Point of Contact" (POC) state, meaning that the State will contact the FBI on behalf of the FFL. The FFL enters the required info to the "states" NICS system, and the State then passes it onto the FBI NICS system. Pennsylvania, like NJ, (and like Florida) is a POC state. Thus PICS is the Pennsylvania NICS POC for PA FFLs. NJ has one also, operated by the NJSP. Florida uses the FDLE (Fl. Dept. of Law Enforcement, the Investigative authority in FL, similar to Georgia's GBI). One reason a state might do this is to be able to enforce any state laws regarding waiting periods in between handgun purchases or other such restrictions (eg. NJ's OGAM). I'm sure there are others. Hope this helps. This is the best explanation I have ever heard. +1,000,000 to you sir. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted December 31, 2015 That was a great explanation. Finally I understand why 15 years ago I was able to purchase a handgun in South Carolina within minutes of the FFL swiping my SC DL through a machine. I assume SC was not a POC State and NICS came back instantly because there was no other agencies involved. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HBecwithFn7 296 Posted January 1, 2016 That was a great explanation. Finally I understand why 15 years ago I was able to purchase a handgun in South Carolina within minutes of the FFL swiping my SC DL through a machine. I assume SC was not a POC State and NICS came back instantly because there was no other agencies involved. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Apparently, SC is not a POC state... NICS POC States... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted January 15, 2016 Well today is day 30 since I applied for my handgun permits. Needless to say it is not ready. Manalapan now gives you a number and when your permit is ready they post it online. The closest number to mine is 15274 which is over 200 numbers lower than mine which means there are over 200 people ahead of me. Since applying the highest number was 15225 so less than 50 permits were issued in the last month. At this rate it will be at least 4 months before my handgun permits are ready. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RobCo 16 Posted January 15, 2016 Well today is day 30 since I applied for my handgun permits. Needless to say it is not ready. Manalapan now gives you a number and when your permit is ready they post it online. The closest number to mine is 15274 which is over 200 numbers lower than mine which means there are over 200 people ahead of me. Since applying the highest number was 15225 so less than 50 permits were issued in the last month. At this rate it will be at least 4 months before my handgun permits are ready. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk You're not alone my friend. I am going on a six months wait in Plainfield for my handgun permits. They told me they were overwhelmed with them now, But four months, six months...comeon. If I took that long to do anything at my work...I'd be canned. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chris327 30 Posted January 15, 2016 have you guys contacted anjrpc strikeforce? or NJ2as about doing a video on these towns? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RobCo 16 Posted January 15, 2016 have you guys contacted anjrpc strikeforce? or NJ2as about doing a video on these towns? NJ2AS contact me about doing a video but I don't have time to take off to do that....plus it would be tricky. I am working on composing a letter Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted January 15, 2016 I did send email to NJ2AS but never got a response Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lambo2936 297 Posted January 16, 2016 Woodbridge is one of the largest municipalities in NJ and I consistently get mine back in less then 30 days. There is only one person that I'm aware of who processes permits. If she can handle the load and get them all out on time then these other towns have no excuse. Glad to see this! I just applied a week and a half ago and i am going NUTS waiting for my FID!! Looks like i may be lucky and not have to wait 6 months, haha. I Wish i read this post first, as i would apply for multiple pistol permits. I thought with the initial FID card app you can only get one handgun permit so i only applied for the one. Good news is by the time ill get a 2nd Handgun permit, i'll have the money to buy a 2nd one, haha. I dont want to spend 4k+ all at once. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom C 0 Posted January 17, 2016 What town in NJ gets permits done in 3 weeks? Are towns allowed to arbitrarily deny extensions? Personally I enjoy collecting military rifles more than handguns, but part of the reason I gloss over handguns for sale is how long the permit takes. However if I have some on hand I do tend to use them. I think I will apply for new permits; 6 of them. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Gun newbie chiming in..... After hearing about horror stories in NJ, I became legal in just 11 days here in Rockaway Township. The police and admin clerk could not have been more informative and pleasant. I think it helps if you live in a Repub town. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted January 17, 2016 Gun newbie chiming in..... After hearing about horror stories in NJ, I became legal in just 11 days here in Rockaway Township. The police and admin clerk could not have been more informative and pleasant. I think it helps if you live in a Repub town. Manalapan is a Republican town. Not strong Republican but traditionally Republican none the less. Problem is most NJ Republicans like Christie are RINOs. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted February 6, 2016 Manalapan took down their number system from the website. I guess they didn't want how slow they are being public record. For the record it is now day 50 and no permits. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted April 5, 2016 Day 110 and still no permits. Called twice and emailed twice yet received no response. Tomorrow is one of the 2 days per month PD deals with firearm applications. Guess I will go in person to try and get an update. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites