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Election and National Carry Reciprocity

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NH has it on their application now that you must include your home state ccw permit. I have my Florida and was looking to get my NH. Was that on their application when you got yours?

That's been on the application. They haven't printed new ones yet. I sent in NJ FID, Fla CCW, Utah CCW, and NJ Driver's License. Many guys just sent in NJ Driver's License. Took 6 weeks for NH to get to me.

 

 

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NH has it on their application now that you must include your home state ccw permit. I have my Florida and was looking to get my NH. Was that on their application when you got yours?

NOT THIS AGAIN!  Send the completed form, Ignoring the CCW spot with a check for $100. DO NOT SEND COPIES OF ANYTHING!!!!

They won't even contact your references!  You WILL get your CCW permit that is good in PA.................For now!

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That's great. I'll get it out asap.

 

What about the castle law. Will all this force them to adopt a castle law in our state? Times are changing and we need to be able to protect our selves with repercussions.

Highly doubtful.

 

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So is the consensus to get a NH first as it is the simplest for us in NJ? And if I read this correctly PA will honor a NH permit even if it is issued to a non NH resident, right?

 

Keep in mind that Shapiro will be AG in PA come January. He stated while he was running that he's going to go after reciprocity agreements: https://www.joshshapiro.org/agenda/getting-tough-on-gun-violence/ 

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Keep in mind that Shapiro will be AG in PA come January. He stated while he was running that he's going to go after reciprocity agreements: https://www.joshshapiro.org/agenda/getting-tough-on-gun-violence/

Won't matter if legislature passes reciprocity law which they say is in the works in PAFOA. They also have enough votes to override Veto.

 

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Won't matter is legislature passes reciprocity law which they say is in the works in PAFOA. They also have enough votes to override Veto.

 

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Are you referring to the PA state or Federal Legislature?

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I just read a news report on the proposed reciprocity law. If the story is true it confirms my suspicion that it only applies to individuals who hold licenses in their home states -- to resident licensees in other words. By the time this passes, and the law is delayed while NJ appeals all the way to the Supreme Court, and then a NJ resident files an equal protection lawsuit, and NJ appeals or defends all the way to the Supreme Court, and by now like the song goes, "In the year 2525"... I'll be able to glue my NH and UT licenses together with snot and pretend to be a secret agent but that's about it unless I buy an ATM business serving greater Camden, Irvington, and Paterson. Hey remember that theme!? OMG LOL!!

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For anyone who is still not convinced that none of the reciprocity laws will allow NJ residents to carry in NJ with an out of state permit, listen to Scott Bach's interview on the most recent GFH radio podcast,  He breaks it down quite clearly.  Definitively, these bills will not help us directly.  Only litigation will do that, and that will take a very long time.  It will be fun to watch the fallout however.

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..........and by now like the song goes, "In the year 2525"... I'll be able to glue my NH and UT licenses together with snot and pretend to be a secret agent but that's about it unless I buy an ATM business serving greater Camden, Irvington, and Paterson. Hey remember that theme!? OMG LOL!!

 

There is a much "easier" way. First publish you real name, home address, and telephone number. Second publicly call out one of the gang bangers that is not currently in prison and tell him why he is pond scrum (it might be tough to find a publication that he reads though). Third: wait until he personally threatens your life. Fourth apply for a NJ carry permit and in a few months you will have it. At that point you probably had better move far away to PA. Oh if you had done that first you wouldn't have had to do the other stuff. Oh well. :laugh:

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For anyone who is still not convinced that none of the reciprocity laws will allow NJ residents to carry in NJ with an out of state permit, listen to Scott Bach's interview on the most recent GFH radio podcast,  He breaks it down quite clearly.  Definitively, these bills will not help us directly.  Only litigation will do that, and that will take a very long time.  It will be fun to watch the fallout however.

Problem is listening to an entire podcast.

 

BTW I tried to contact the bill's sponsor, I believe a congressman from WVa. Glory be he only accepts emails from his constituents. 

 

Now THIS would be a good thing to send letters and emails about. The universe of legislators who vote against resident license reciprocity and non-resident reciprocity is unity. OTOH it should be no skin off of NH's nose whether I can carry there AND NJ or just there.

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 Scott Bach's legal analysis is that a "two way" reciprocity bill that is applicable to residents in their home state would almost certainly not withstand constitutional challenge, but a "one way" bill (the type that is now considered) in which a state is only forced to accept permits held by citizens of other states almost certainly would.  If that is true, there is probably little or no chance that any congressman or senator will submit a two way bill that would help us and the NRA would not support it.

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Said it before and I will say it again. Jersey carry is going nowhere ATM. Your only hope in sight is for America to do something. This would be the biggest pressure that could be brought to bear. We are thinking about the three states that don't issue, although MD will issue for certain normal people reasons. None of these states are going to support this law, so their reps are off the table. However, we have a number of states that do issue AND don't allow their citizens to carry on out of state licenses, or don't allow anyone to carry on non-res licenses. This thing is not exactly going to get a 100 to 0 vote in the senate, even if it makes it that far to begin with. That's the reason for this provision. I suggest everybody continue to bring it to the sponsors of the bills to get a more sweeping result. But if this is what it takes to wheel and deal, it will still put Jersey in a better position than anything that has happened in the last 50 years. And I would not assume it will take a 5 year or longer court fight to turn Jersey around. It is quite possible that Jersey decides to come up with something before they get their asses handed to them like Illinois did. This could happen with pressure from the public, out of fear in the legislature, or it could simply blossom after JERSEY itself goes to court trying to stop people from coming to the state armed. There's like a half dozen ways to win in the aftermath of this.

 

Again, not suggesting you avoid pressuring for the whole enchilada. You should. But don't lose enthusiasm if that is not in the cards, we need this either way. And your US reps and senators are not the only people you are allowed to talk to. Assuming this comes up (fingers crossed) we will have a committee to deal with and we will need cosponsors. Paul "d-b#&" Ryan does not represent the interests of Wisconsin, he represents the interests of America and the Republican party. Well... anyway, you get the point, he's supposed to. Same thing with committee leaders and members. They can't do their job if they simply represent their own state or district. Hit all the players.

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I just read a news report on the proposed reciprocity law. If the story is true it confirms my suspicion that it only applies to individuals who hold licenses in their home states -- to resident licensees in other words. By the time this passes, and the law is delayed while NJ appeals all the way to the Supreme Court, and then a NJ resident files an equal protection lawsuit, and NJ appeals or defends all the way to the Supreme Court, and by now like the song goes, "In the year 2525"... I'll be able to glue my NH and UT licenses together with snot and pretend to be a secret agent but that's about it unless I buy an ATM business serving greater Camden, Irvington, and Paterson. Hey remember that theme!? OMG LOL!!

 

I wonder how this will affect someone in my situation? I am a NJ resident, this is where I work, pay taxes and vote. I also own a house in NYS where pay property taxes, utilities etc. Thanks to a NYS Court of appeals ruling, Osterweil vs Bartlett I have an unrestricted carry permit for all of NYS (except NYC). The ruling basically grants permits to part time residents of the state, so my carry permit is a RESIDENT permit, not a non-resident permit. NYS does not issue unrestricted permits to non-residents. So if there was national carry reciprocity that only applied to resident permits from other states, that would mean I could carry in NJ, no?? I guess it would depend on how the law was worded.

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I wonder how this will affect someone in my situation? I am a NJ resident, this is where I work, pay taxes and vote. I also own a house in NYS where pay property taxes, utilities etc. Thanks to a NYS Court of appeals ruling, Osterweil vs Bartlett I have an unrestricted carry permit for all of NYS (except NYC). The ruling basically grants permits to part time residents of the state, so my carry permit is a RESIDENT permit, not a non-resident permit. NYS does not issue unrestricted permits to non-residents. So if there was national carry reciprocity that only applied to resident permits from other states, that would mean I could carry in NJ, no?? I guess it would depend on how the law was worded.

Your thinking is right on. The first thing I thought when I read the proposed bill was it's time to buy a vacation home again.

 

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I believe some version of national reciprocity will pass quickly after the new administration takes office.  Once out of state permit holders are able to carry unrestricted, I don't think it will be too long before NJ and other restrictive states will have to comply.  I imagine there will be an immediate flood of lawsuits once non-residents are able to carry in NJ but the state's OWN residents are still restricted!  We'll see...  I'm hopeful the Dems in Trenton will finally have to cave...    

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I believe some version of national reciprocity will pass quickly after the new administration takes office.  Once out of state permit holders are able to carry unrestricted, I don't think it will be too long before NJ and other restrictive states will have to comply.  I imagine there will be an immediate flood of lawsuits once non-residents are able to carry in NJ but the state's OWN residents are still restricted!  We'll see...  I'm hopeful the Dems in Trenton will finally have to cave...    

Yup there will be a flood of lawsuits. A flood, drop by drop.

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IMHO we have been attacking the leftist stranglehold in this state all wrong. Our focus has been mostly on the second amendment and they couldn't possibly care any less about the constitution, and they most certainly don't care about our safety and well being as we are an overwhelmed minority. We spend time and treasure on an issue that the majority of voters neither understand nor care about. Our strategy is falling on deaf ears. This is what makes the SAPPA RICO case so intriguing. It's a slightly different view on the same problem. Where I believe if it's successful, it will make some headway and weaken the iron curtain, I also believe that they still have the will and ability to ignore or work around the result. I also think that attacking them for their corruption is a non-starter, however the cost of that corruption, and the resulting loss of jobs, and revenue in the state along with the unnecessarily high cost of everything from property taxes, to rents, road construction and now gasoline are a direct result of the sustained control of one party in the legislature. If we want to change our fortunes in the second amendment fight, we need to reshuffle the deck. The greatest shared issue in this state is cost, which affects most of the voting public. Maybe people are so used to the high cost of living here that they don't care, but in my estimation it will most certainly garner more support and possibly a more middle of the road legislature. It's not a stretch to think that significantly more people are affected by high costs in the state than by the idiotic gun laws. It won't happen overnight, but nothing worthwhile ever does. Moving from a deep blue legislature to a light blue or even purple won't be fast or easy but it can be done. How do you eat and elephant? One bite at a time...

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 Scott Bach's legal analysis is that a "two way" reciprocity bill that is applicable to residents in their home state would almost certainly not withstand constitutional challenge, but a "one way" bill (the type that is now considered) in which a state is only forced to accept permits held by citizens of other states almost certainly would.  If that is true, there is probably little or no chance that any congressman or senator will submit a two way bill that would help us and the NRA would not support it.

I've raised the point that if even a one-way law passes, NJ residents might have a basis for suing on an obvious equal protection" basis.

 

If the law comes up as one-way (I assume that means only resident licenses count) then we're screwed until various equal protection suits are resolved, which won't be for a long time. If the two-way bill is promoted democratic senators like Manchin from gun-happy states will be in a pickle. If they vote no reciprocity for THEIR citizens is dead, which is bad politically. If they vote yes they have to withstand evil sneers from Chuck Schumer for a while but that will ultimately blow over.

 

BTW the Manchin background check law, which would have inconvenienced most of us only marginally if at all, was promoted by the 2AS's Gottlieb as a bargaining chip for reciprocity, which it is alleged Obama would not have been all that unfriendly to. I don't know if this is all BS but that is what I was reading lo! those many years ago. If it is true then NRA essentially sold NJ, MD, and HI down the river, as well as facilitating thousands of arrests each year of the likes of Shaneen Allen.

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http://freebeacon.com/issues/national-reciprocity-bill-will-apply-non-resident-gun-carry-permits/

 

This may just change the game for us here in New Jersey. Dunno how valid it is tho I can only hope and pray.

 

 

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I don't think for one minute that NJ will let this happen. Even if the federal legislation passes, they'll dishonor it and impose other restrictions that make the federal law moot in NJ. Things like, "you must be a resident of the state who's permit you are using.  Don't like it? Take us to court!  It will take years, and we've got all the time and legal power in the world!"

 

 

The only way to put teeth in the federal law is to tie compliance to the receipt of federal funds.  I know they got rid of that a while back, but they could bring it back in this case.

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IF this bill is passed as written, I'll bet NJ starts issuing CCW's to get in on the $$$ it would collect by issuing them. I for one would not get a NJ CCW and look to see which state issues the cheapest out of state CCW and get theirs. For all the years they have been denying us, it would put a smile on my face to be carrying in NJ and knowing that not one dime for the permit I have is going to this state. I would hope that others fell the same way, as they say "payback is a bitch."

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