Zeke 5,504 Posted October 31, 2017 Just now, tattooo said: I think its more of " don't wanna be that guy to have to pay Nappen a ton of bread to find out because of a grey area syndrome " .... lol Nappen would not be my guy 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,764 Posted October 31, 2017 46 minutes ago, Zeke said: Nappen would not be my guy Me neither of all the lawyers in nj he'd be at the very end of my list 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tattooo 220 Posted October 31, 2017 It was more to get the point across not about the particular lawyer. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tattooo 220 Posted October 31, 2017 Nappen would not be my guyFair point 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted October 31, 2017 28 minutes ago, tattooo said: It was more to get the point across not about the particular lawyer. There is one test case already pages up in this thread. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
galapoola 102 Posted October 31, 2017 I reached out to the NJSP via their website and was redirected to the Citizens Services and Relations Office of the Attorney General. The director wrote back and here is the response, BTW the memo he refers to is the same two pager that has been linked to http://14544-presscdn-0-64.pagely.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/New-Jersey-stun-gun.pdf That should cement things, possession and carry per the NJAG is legal. I have a request into my local PD asking pretty much the same thing, namely do the officers on the job know about the consent decree and have they been advised not to arrest a non felon 18+ year old citizen in possession of a stun gun. Here's the email from the AG: Mr. : As of October 22, 2017, in accordance with a Consent Order entered in the United States District Court, prior statutory prohibitions against selling or possessing stun guns in New Jersey have been declared unconstitutional. By virtue of this ruling, New Jersey is now on similar footing as 39 other states that allow stun guns with limited or no restrictions so, unless there is a change to the law, no permit or license will be required to obtain or possess a stun gun. However, the State Police have proposed a rule, expected to be adopted in December, prohibiting minors under the age of 18 from obtaining or possessing stun guns. Law enforcement has been directed to adhere to this rule, pending adoption and thereafter. In addition to the proposed regulations, current statutory provisions that establish restrictions on stun guns remain in force and effect, including laws that prohibit felons and incompetent persons from possessing stun guns, possession on school grounds, possession for an unlawful purpose, and possession under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for such lawful uses as a stun gun may have. At this time, nothing has been published on the State Police website regarding stun guns. Regarding your question about all law enforcement officers having knowledge of the change in status of stun guns, please refer to the memo discussed in our previous correspondence. The purpose of that memo was to inform law enforcement throughout the state of the changes based on the Consent Order. I hope that this has been helpful. Sincerely, Jeffrey E. Lenox Director Citizens Services and Relations Office of the Attorney General 25 Market Street P.O. Box 080 Trenton, NJ 08625-0080 (609) 984-5828 www.facebook.com/NJAttorneyGeneralsOffice www.twitter.com/NewJerseyAG www.instagram.com/njattorneygeneralsoffice 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted October 31, 2017 "... no permit or license will be required to obtain or possess a stun gun. ..." This won't be good enough for the naysayers, because it doesn't say "carry". 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
galapoola 102 Posted October 31, 2017 10 minutes ago, PK90 said: "... no permit or license will be required to obtain or possess a stun gun. ..." This won't be good enough for the naysayers, because it doesn't say "carry". " possession on school grounds " is not in your home or place of business so it's everywhere else. " no permit or license will be required to obtain or possess a stun gun " is pretty clear. NJ law is famous for the way they skirt around the common sense plain meaning of things so without actually saying, "hey you can possess a stun gun everywhere except schools for its intended legal purpose, namely self defense", this may the best we can hope for. Just look at the way they carved out AR-15 possession, the statute is still there but the NJSP responded that the evil Colt semi and the ones we see at a NJ FFL are not the same and therefore legal to possess. It's the bass ackwards way they do things 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted October 31, 2017 "... no permit or license will be required to obtain or possess a stun gun. ..."This won't be good enough for the naysayers, because it doesn't say "carry".Yup. Honestly though who cares what the naysayers have to say. It's almost as if they like being controlled. I try and avoid dangerous areas with my family. If I had to go to a high crime area in say Camden, Newark, or Trenton with my family I will carry whatever I feel is needed to protect them. I won't be buying a stun gun because I don't think it offers adequate protection. If I did I certainly would carry it without worry with the statements made by AG and NJSP. As I said in the sentence though I choose to avoid such dangerous areas with my family. Life is all about choices. I make my decisions based on risk vs reward. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted October 31, 2017 25 minutes ago, PK90 said: "... no permit or license will be required to obtain or possess a stun gun. ..." This won't be good enough for the naysayers, because it doesn't say "carry". Well f em. Then 5 hours ago, 4theboys said: See my earlier post if you want to know what 2C laws where amended and what 2C laws are still in effect and shall continue to be enforced per AG letter dated 10/20/2017. You went full retard Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted October 31, 2017 For those that have bought or are shopping, what manufacturer / models? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted October 31, 2017 4 minutes ago, CMJeepster said: For those that have bought or are shopping, what manufacturer / models? @High Exposure has recommended the pulse. I trust his knowledge. This is just a stepping stone . Ccw is still required as citizens. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krdshrk 3,872 Posted October 31, 2017 9 minutes ago, CMJeepster said: For those that have bought or are shopping, what manufacturer / models? I bought a Taser M26c. It's BIG. Too big to carry IMO. It would be a bag or glovebox defense device. I also want the Taser Pulse. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tattooo 220 Posted October 31, 2017 I reached out to the NJSP via their website and was redirected to the Citizens Services and Relations Office of the Attorney General. The director wrote back and here is the response, BTW the memo he refers to is the same two pager that has been linked to http://14544-presscdn-0-64.pagely.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/New-Jersey-stun-gun.pdf That should cement things, possession and carry per the NJAG is legal. I have a request into my local PD asking pretty much the same thing, namely do the officers on the job know about the consent decree and have they been advised not to arrest a non felon 18+ year old citizen in possession of a stun gun. Here's the email from the AG: Mr. : As of October 22, 2017, in accordance with a Consent Order entered in the United States District Court, prior statutory prohibitions against selling or possessing stun guns in New Jersey have been declared unconstitutional. By virtue of this ruling, New Jersey is now on similar footing as 39 other states that allow stun guns with limited or no restrictions so, unless there is a change to the law, no permit or license will be required to obtain or possess a stun gun. However, the State Police have proposed a rule, expected to be adopted in December, prohibiting minors under the age of 18 from obtaining or possessing stun guns. Law enforcement has been directed to adhere to this rule, pending adoption and thereafter. In addition to the proposed regulations, current statutory provisions that establish restrictions on stun guns remain in force and effect, including laws that prohibit felons and incompetent persons from possessing stun guns, possession on school grounds, possession for an unlawful purpose, and possession under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for such lawful uses as a stun gun may have. At this time, nothing has been published on the State Police website regarding stun guns. Regarding your question about all law enforcement officers having knowledge of the change in status of stun guns, please refer to the memo discussed in our previous correspondence. The purpose of that memo was to inform law enforcement throughout the state of the changes based on the Consent Order. I hope that this has been helpful. Sincerely, Jeffrey E. Lenox Director Citizens Services and Relations Office of the Attorney General 25 Market Street P.O. Box 080 Trenton, NJ 08625-0080 (609) 984-5828 www.facebook.com/NJAttorneyGeneralsOffice www.twitter.com/NewJerseyAG www.instagram.com/njattorneygeneralsofficeThat is awesome and thankfully not too good to be true ...thank you for forwarding that clarification. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,764 Posted November 1, 2017 This is on Taser website: WE'RE COMING TO YOU, NEW JERSEY! OCT 20TH 2017 TEAM TASER On Sunday, New Jerseyans will score a victory: The ban on TASER products will be lifted across the state, allowing consumers to legally own products like the TASER Pulse and Bolt! Not only do the updated regulations give a modest boost to the state’s economy by bringing new products to the market, but they also offer residents an effective way to defend themselves through ownership of a TASER device. New Jerseyans will have access to the same technology trusted by police departments across the world. Our products are safe to own, easy to use, and rarely cause long-term harm to a target. Our self-defense products like the Pulse and Bolt knock down a bad-guy for 30 seconds from 15 feet away, giving the owner time to run and call the police. That's great news, but who buys a TASER device? The simple answer? Anybody who needs an extra boost of confidence to get out the door for their early morning run or nighttime adventure on the town. Our products are sleek and easy to carry, giving you the ability to be brave in any situation. Currently, our analysis shows that TASER products are most popular with gun owners who want a non-firearm option to carry in areas where guns are prohibited. But we also see an opportunity to revolutionize self-defense for runners, hikers, and active people who may not be comfortable owning guns. We’re excited to introduce our products to New Jersey in the coming weeks and months. The new regulations will allow us to help fill a void for New Jersey residents who haven’t had a viable, non-firearm option for defense. How does a TASER work compared to a stun-gun? TASER devices work by sending electricity through two barbed darts fired from the device at a distance of 15 feet or fewer. Once the darts connect with the attacker, that electricity causes involuntary muscle contraction that render the attacker unable to move. Stun guns, on the other hand, use a zap of electricity across the front of the device to inflict pain on a target. Stun guns require direct contact with the target for the effect to be felt, and even then, a motivated attacker can fight through the pain. Are devices like the TASER Pulse hard to use? Back in August, we took a survey of 479 of our customers and took away some key insights. According to our data, 78% of our customers were confident in their ability to effectively use their TASER device. We think this is attributable to the user-friendly, intuitive design of our products. However, we will be unveiling new training resources in the coming months to get the remaining 22% up to speed. With a little practice, it's not difficult to gain some confidence in your ability to use our devices under pressure! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tattooo 220 Posted November 1, 2017 Not sure why they say coming weeks and months if its good to go now ? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,764 Posted November 1, 2017 2 minutes ago, tattooo said: Not sure why they say coming weeks and months if its good to go now ? I suspect it was posted weeks ago. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tattooo 220 Posted November 1, 2017 I suspect it was posted weeks ago.Makes sense 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,764 Posted November 1, 2017 13 minutes ago, Downtownv said: I suspect it was posted weeks ago. Article posted WE'RE COMING TO YOU, NEW JERSEY! OCT 20TH 2017 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tattooo 220 Posted November 1, 2017 Article posted WE'RE COMING TO YOU, NEW JERSEY! OCT 20TH 2017Skimmed right past the heading.....missed the date Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,764 Posted November 1, 2017 52 minutes ago, Downtownv said: I suspect it was posted weeks ago. Article posted WE'RE COMING TO YOU, NEW JERSEY! OCT 20TH 2017 2 minutes ago, tattooo said: 39 minutes ago, Downtownv said: Article posted WE'RE COMING TO YOU, NEW JERSEY! OCT 20TH 2017 Skimmed right past the heading.....missed the date Me too.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NJGF 375 Posted November 1, 2017 1 hour ago, tattooo said: Not sure why they say coming weeks and months if its good to go now ? I guess everyone is having a hard time believing any expanded rights come to NJ 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,764 Posted November 1, 2017 Funny, no one worries about their gun rights in Newark, Asbury, Camden or Trenton....And rarely is anyone prosecuted for the illegal gun. sorry for getting off topic.... 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted November 1, 2017 31 minutes ago, Downtownv said: Funny, no one worries about their gun rights in Newark, Asbury, Camden or Trenton....And rarely is anyone prosecuted for the illegal gun. sorry for getting off topic.... Why jury duty is sooo important. We should not let this pacify us. CCW is our right as citizens 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted November 1, 2017 58 minutes ago, Downtownv said: Funny, no one worries about their gun rights in Newark, Asbury, Camden or Trenton....And rarely is anyone prosecuted for the illegal gun. sorry for getting off topic.... The only jury that I had been seated on dealt with possession of a weapon / firearm by a "certain person" (convicted felon). We found him guilty. That was the only charge presented to us. He was from Trenton. There was no mention of any permit to carry. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,764 Posted November 1, 2017 I moved this subject to a new thread here: https://www.njgunforums.com/forum/index.php?/forum/69-current-gun-law-discussion/&do=add I Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NJGF 375 Posted November 1, 2017 So I found at least one seller that has updated their web site and now ships Tasers to NJ: New Jersey Citizens Can Now Buy a TASERhttp://www.defenseproducts101.com/statestatutesummary_page2/tasers-now-legal-in-new-jersey.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
galapoola 102 Posted November 1, 2017 3 hours ago, tattooo said: Not sure why they say coming weeks and months if its good to go now ? I'm sure big box stores need to pass it by legal, may take a while. FFL's may take a wait and see. You guys remember the Auto Ordnance M1 Carbine fiasco? Dealers began selling these because of a letter from the NJSP. A bunch were sold and in people's possession when someone from the NJAG office jumped in. They ordered all the rifles returned. If I recall the NJAG office was not aware until someone asked them. That's what we are up against in NJ. We really need full consent from all parties, they all have to be on the same page, which I believe they are. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted November 1, 2017 3 minutes ago, galapoola said: I'm sure big box stores need to pass it by legal, may take a while. FFL's may take a wait and see. You guys remember the Auto Ordnance M1 Carbine fiasco? Dealers began selling these because of a letter from the NJSP. A bunch were sold and in people's possession when someone from the NJAG office jumped in. They ordered all the rifles returned. If I recall the NJAG office was not aware until someone asked them. That's what we are up against in NJ. We really need full consent from all parties, they all have to be on the same page, which I believe they are. Cheyenne Mt. Outfitters in Bordentown had Shockwaves pretty darn quick after that got passed and I believe that they’re taking orders for stun guns right now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
galapoola 102 Posted November 1, 2017 3 minutes ago, CMJeepster said: Cheyenne Mt. Outfitters in Bordentown had Shockwaves pretty darn quick after that got passed and I believe that they’re taking orders for stun guns right now. Cool, that's a family owned business, good for them. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites