Tonight 2/19 7:00 "60 Minutes" - "Remington 700"

[Mrs. Peel 7,157]

I just noticed that this is on tonight - a continuing saga of the recalled triggers on the Remington 700. My guess is that focus will be on: tearful bereaved family members, Leslie Stahl looking pensive and stricken, gun companies portrayed as "evil incarnate"... and much hysteria about the 1Mill guns that did NOT have the trigger replaced.

 

I don't discount the concern, mind you... if there's a real problem. I'm just preparing for a very overwrought spin on the story. Maybe we'll be delightfully surprised...and see a rational, measured presentation? Doubt it.

[Cereza 106]

I didn't watch it, but I read the online piece: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/popular-remington-700-rifle-linked-to-potentially-deadly-defects/

 

There would appear to be a defect with the Remington 700 rifle which is the focus, though count on 60 minutes to get their dig in at 2A:

 

And regulators couldn’t do anything because their hands are tied: the government is allowed to recall toy guns, but not real ones.

 

Robert Chaffin: In the world of firearms there is no such thing as a consumer product agency that can force any firearms makers to recall the gun. Does not exist.

 

Lesley Stahl: ‘Cause of the Second Amendment, correct?

 

Robert Chaffin: Well, the right to bear arms, yes. Any recall has to be voluntary.

 

 Remington already issued a recall on the triggers so I don't see much of a point to the report. 

[Zeke 5,504]

This is like 10 yrs old with the 700.

Jeebus

They gonna start remaking Star Trek next?

[W2MC 1,699]

Old news...    http://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/remington-700-massive-fix-countrys-most-popular-gun-n262721

 

My question is 'why is CBS bringing this up now???'

[GRIZ 3,369]

Old news...    http://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/remington-700-massive-fix-countrys-most-popular-gun-n262721

 

My question is 'why is CBS bringing this up now???'

Hey, don't you know, it's Trump's fault?

 

Seriously, I know someone who was unslinging his 700 as his son was climbing up to a tree stand. The gun discharged and almost hit his son. I know this guy well enough that if he says he didn't touch the trigger. A few days later he heard about the recall and sent the gun back. There's no telling how many incidents are around like thus where no one gets hurt.

[W2MC 1,699]

Understood...But I think at this point, "everyone" knows there was an issue with the Rem 700 trigger...there was a court case in 2010, it was in the Rifleman and Hunter mags, as well as a lot of the hunting mags that there is an issue, and you could sent it back to Remington for a fix.  

 

I am at a loss to understand why this is NOW so newsworthy...

[Bully 749]

It's newsworthy now because nothing has happened of late to vilify the Second.  

[SOG 7]

Understood...But I think at this point, "everyone" knows there was an issue with the Rem 700 trigger...there was a court case in 2010, it was in the Rifleman and Hunter mags, as well as a lot of the hunting mags that there is an issue, and you could sent it back to Remington for a fix.

 

I am at a loss to understand why this is NOW so newsworthy...

Not to poke a stick in your cage, but do you have any idea how many of the 700's have been repaired ?

What happens when someone just starts hunting and has no idea that Remington 700's have had bolt/firing pin issues.

Everyone doesn't read or have the knowledge most of us have

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[W2MC 1,699]

Not to Ike a stick in your cage, but do you have any idea how many of the 700's have been repaired ?

What happens when someone just starts hunting and has no idea that Remington 700's have had bolt/firing pin issues.

Everyone doesn't read or have the knowledge most of us have

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

According to various internet sources...only a tiny fraction have been repaired.  

 

But....ignoring any culpability issues; what is Remington supposed to do?  They have advertised, they have notified, they have let the world know...you can even see it on the internet!  https://xmprecall.remington.com/

 

But now what are they supposed to do?

 

Ruger has had a similar recall on their single action six-shooters going on for nearly 30 years...you can read about it here.   http://www.ruger.com/pdf/safetyOfferAd.pdf

 

Where is 60 minutes on that one?

[Parker 213]

The 700 trigger mechanism shares the same trigger housing as the competition benchrest-grade 40-X platform of rifles. A solid and proven performer. My triggers are pre-82, meaning you have to move the safety to the "off" position in order to open the bolt. (Boy, does that sound dangerous!? That might be akin to lowering the hammer on a lever gun or DA revolver.) However, I have no intention to change them. They are fine and adjusted properly and have given me good service for decades.  

 

If you adjust your 700 trigger to infinity without knowing what you are doing, you can make it "dangerous" where a bump on the buttstock, or "pulling the trigger while the safety is on then moving it to the off position" (who would do this and why?) will discharge the gun. Fault of the gun, or fault of the kitchen-gunsmith-tinkerer? 

 

 

Maybe Remington should have not scrapped the three-position safety found on the earlier 725 which blocked the sear and enabled the bolt to be opened? 

 

 

 

 

Or maybe they should have designed a simple trigger mechanism like the Winchester M70??? 

 

[SOG 7]

According to various internet sources...only a tiny fraction have been repaired.

 

But....ignoring any culpability issues; what is Remington supposed to do? They have advertised, they have notified, they have let the world know...you can even see it on the internet! https://xmprecall.remington.com/

 

But now what are they supposed to do?

 

Ruger has had a similar recall on their single action six-shooters going on for nearly 30 years...you can read about it here. http://www.ruger.com/pdf/safetyOfferAd.pdf

 

Where is 60 minutes on that one?

What CBS was trying to point out that Remington should recall all the rifles that are effected. I personally saw a Remington 700 discharge while it was being unloaded. The owner got rid of it the next day. Remington knew there was a design defect for along time. They knew what was required to make the fix. They ignored the advice of the design engineer. I don't feel sorry in any away for a company that put profit in front of safety. This is another good reason to make sure your weapon is pointed in a safe direction when unloading it.

I partially blame the gun design and stupid people.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[124gr9mm 859]

Understood...But I think at this point, "everyone" knows there was an issue with the Rem 700 trigger...there was a court case in 2010, it was in the Rifleman and Hunter mags, as well as a lot of the hunting mags that there is an issue, and you could sent it back to Remington for a fix.  

 

I am at a loss to understand why this is NOW so newsworthy...

 

I think it's newsworthy (to them) now because it's pretty clear that Trump is a pro-2nd amendment President, so CBS is looking to get on the anti-2nd amendment bandwagon before any legislation or court action happens.  They can say "w've been reporting since XXXX about XXXX" and position themselves as the go-to source for quotes and sound bytes.

 

As to your other point, I'm not so sure.  I'm a pretty new shooter and I have a large caliber bolt gun on my short list.  I had no idea how long the challenges with the Remington 700 have been going on.  It has been on the short list for a while, but I just took it off.  No reason to take a chance and be one of the unlucky ones.

[124gr9mm 859]

According to various internet sources...only a tiny fraction have been repaired.  

 

But....ignoring any culpability issues; what is Remington supposed to do?  They have advertised, they have notified, they have let the world know...you can even see it on the internet!  https://xmprecall.remington.com/

 

But now what are they supposed to do?

 

 

Responsible thing to do is to buy them all back.

Unfortunately actuaries have probably crunched the numbers and determined that it's more cost-effective to deal with lawsuits as they come.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

I think the point that you are all missing, and the reason for this piece on 60 Minutes, is that Remington changed the design of the trigger (the Walker trigger) in 2006, after the first round of complaints. It was changed to the X-Mark Pro, but the replacement trigger also had the same propensity for "triggerless" discharge. Remington admitted that the X-Mark Pro had a defect and recalled those rifles (1.5 million). X-Mark Pro triggers in Remington products manufactured from 2014 onward are supposedly free of the defect.

 

While there was some hyperbole in the 60 Minutes piece it was pretty straight forward. While I think most of us were aware of the initial accidental discharge issue (and this truly would be an AD), I, personally, was unaware that the trigger design had been changed in 2006, but that the problem continued. Remington recalled the guns using the X-Mark Pro trigger that were manufactured 2006 to 2014, but have yet to admit any defect in the older - and much more prodigious (7.5 million guns) - Walker trigger equipped guns.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

 

PS: The kid still should have gone to jail. Pointing a loaded gun at anyone carries the potential risk of a bad outcome, which is why it is covered by one of the cardinal rules of gun safety.

[GRIZ 3,369]

According to various internet sources...only a tiny fraction have been repaired.  

 

But....ignoring any culpability issues; what is Remington supposed to do?  They have advertised, they have notified, they have let the world know...you can even see it on the internet!  https://xmprecall.remington.com/

 

But now what are they supposed to do?

 

Ruger has had a similar recall on their single action six-shooters going on for nearly 30 years...you can read about it here.   http://www.ruger.com/pdf/safetyOfferAd.pdf

 

Where is 60 minutes on that one?

Big difference between the Remington and Ruger issues. Remington 700s have a defecr where the gun discharges when it isn't supposed to.

 

The Ruger issue is incorrect operation of a traditional SA revolver. Don't carry a live round under the hammer when it's down.

[High Exposure 5,661]

Remington Fights Back Against Fake News 60 Minutes Attack

 

https://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/remington-fights-back-fake-news-60-minutes-attack/?utm_source=email&utm_medium=20170224_FridayDigest_110&utm_campaign=/blog/remington-fights-back-fake-news-60-minutes-attack/

[124gr9mm 859]

Remington Fights Back Against Fake News 60 Minutes Attack

 

https://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/remington-fights-back-fake-news-60-minutes-attack/?utm_source=email&utm_medium=20170224_FridayDigest_110&utm_campaign=/blog/remington-fights-back-fake-news-60-minutes-attack/

 

 

Respectfully, I don't think that article is written very well. 

 

Here's a direct link to Remington's response (which I think is very well done):

 

https://www.remington.com/news/2017/remington-responds-60-minutes

[High Exposure 5,661]

Remington's response is linked directly in the article I posted.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

I feel so used 

[124gr9mm 859]

Remington's response is linked directly in the article I posted.

 

 

Oh yes, I saw that.  I guess i was just turned off by the article itself and wanted to make sure we had a direct link to the Remington response.

[W2MC 1,699]

It was 1992 when NBC staged the "exploding pickup". 

 

It was 2007 when Dan Rather did the bogus Bush/National Guard letter on 60 Minutes (And Rather STILL refuses to admit he was wrong!).

 

It was 2013 when 60 Minutes admitted their Bengazi "eyewitness" was bogus. 

 

 

I guess they haven't learned much in the last 25 years.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

Let's not forget the Audi 5000 unintended acceleration. Trump is right - the media is the enemy.