Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
orangesolo

What the f*** is this shit? - "See a Doctor, Lose your Guns." A2938

Recommended Posts

http://www.nj2as.org/see_a_doctor_lose_your_guns_nj_assembly_votes_on_gun_bill_this_thursday?utm_campaign=drgunban1&utm_medium=email&utm_source=nj2as

 

I understand if you were involuntarily committed, you were detained and had your day in court so yes, you should have it revoked. But what about the folks who voluntarily just want to get some help because of a rough patch. You shouldn't have to feel scared voluntarily going to get help & then having your right to obtain/possess a firearm revoked. Granted it's left up to the doctor on if you should have it revoked or not, but what if you have an anti-2a doctor? I guess just don't even mention that you have firearms to your doctor anymore (I don't know who would anyways). Unbelievable though, but I guess that's what we get for living in this state. 

 

Edit - To moderaters, sorry. I didn't see the "Pending Legislation Discussion" subforum. Please move it to there if needed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

THIS is why "registration", "licensing" is BAD BAD BAD idea to begin with. I came across a NY firearm forum and its littered with scores of people complaining about how "licensing agency" was quick to remove ALL firearms (and they have full list at all times) even for minor things as a son/daughter having a fist fight at school and saying something. 

 

"Attorney General shall only use to determine whether the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm..."

 

Glad to know that Criminals don't have to go through this new law as they would not have FPID, Permit to purchase or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm.  I feel safe already. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nothing that hasn't been written before. They are dusting off all the proposed bills from after Sandy Hook shooting. This one is A3754 from http://c.ymcdn.com/sites/www.anjrpc.org/resource/resmgr/ds-email/gun_control_list_03-22-13.pdf   I've mentioned this a bunch of times that this list is the rough draft of the NJ SAFE Act coming our way. They warned us 4 yrs ago, here it is again. Take notes, especially the newcomers here who may not have seen this list before, its a shocker.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well then, time to rally the 2A voters and see if we can stop this crazy thing.  Low voter turn out will be to our advantage.  Yeah, I know.................but you have to try.

The obvious course of action is to not let a demorat win the gov seat, a long shot for sure. Looks like it may get even harder for a Republican win, seems Joe Piscapo is seriously thinking a Indy run for gov. Was thinking on going on the R platform but doesnt think a R could win so.......way to take away R votes Joe. Dick move.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is an "addition" to an existing law. As usual, they already have enough power, but want more.  And the addition aims to broaden the existing law too. 

 

 

Notice broad reaching language in the proposed addition. One says the patient must have communicated. All the new law needs is "interpretation & judgement" from the person sitting across you.  

 

 

Existing law: The patient has communicated to that practitioner a threat of imminent, serious physical violence against a readily identifiable individual or against himself

 

Addition: in the exercise of reasonable professional judgment, that the patient is likely to engage in conduct that would result in serious harm to self or others,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nothing that hasn't been written before. They are dusting off all the proposed bills from after Sandy Hook shooting. This one is A3754 from http://c.ymcdn.com/sites/www.anjrpc.org/resource/resmgr/ds-email/gun_control_list_03-22-13.pdf   I've mentioned this a bunch of times that this list is the rough draft of the NJ SAFE Act coming our way. They warned us 4 yrs ago, here it is again. Take notes, especially the newcomers here who may not have seen this list before, its a shocker.

I concur on all points.  And agree the 2013 list will be their starting point for next year.  I would assume they have already generated an updated list of anti-2A bills, based off that 2013 list, have them ready to go when the time comes.

 

Moreover, I cannot begin to fully express how disgusted and disrespected I feel as someone who was born, raised, and have raised a family here in NJ.   I increasingly feel like part of an oppressed class of citizens whose politicians are striving to banish from this state.  Is this any different that the many instances in history where populations were persecuted and turned into refugees?   Perhaps a bit dramatic of a comparison, but essentially the same.

 

I have too many family roots here to completely up and move at this time.  However, have begun to give thought to acquiring a 2nd home(vacation/retirement) in Pa.  Perhaps over time make it my primary residence. Have begun floating the idea with my wife as well.  The anticipated onslaught next year may be the catalyst for me to do so.  (Mipa, at some future date, I intend to reach out to you for your wise counsel concerning Pennsylvania.  Thank you in advance.)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I concur on all points.  And agree the 2013 list will be their starting point for next year.  I would assume they have already generated an updated list of anti-2A bills, based off that 2013 list, have them ready to go when the time comes.

 

Moreover, I cannot begin to fully express how disgusted and disrespected I feel as someone who was born, raised, and have raised a family here in NJ.   I increasingly feel like part of an oppressed class of citizens whose politicians are striving to banish from this state.  Is this any different that the many instances in history where populations were persecuted and turned into refugees?   Perhaps a bit dramatic of a comparison, but essentially the same.

 

I have too many family roots here to completely up and move at this time.  However, have begun to give thought to acquiring a 2nd home(vacation/retirement) in Pa.  Perhaps over time make it my primary residence. Have begun floating the idea with my wife as well.  The anticipated onslaught next year may be the catalyst for me to do so.  (Mipa, at some future date, I intend to reach out to you for your wise counsel concerning Pennsylvania.  Thank you in advance.)

 

Your point on persecuted refugees is actually very much on point. I too born, lived my entire life here and recently retired. But definetly feeling boot on ass from the relentless 2A oppression. I can live with the over crowding and expensive life here its part of me but the politics of this state is something else and has turned into something that just doesnt come close to who we are any more, and btw not just the gun stuff. If not for my mom who lives 3 mins away & depends on me I'd be gone. Unfortunatly she will not leave her home but for on a stretcher....All my family is here but scattered and not nearby. And to top things off my wife may be tempted to return to work, there has been some teases with a 6 figure salary again, hard to turn that down. Which would make sense since I cant abandon my mom however I made it clear job or no job we're out of here should my mom leave us. We would have no issue leaving NJ behind first real chance we get.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

My wife and I are just looking at the where we want to go in the south east - I am relatively young (50) so i still need to work - but the bonus is - my kids, neither one of the girls, want to live in NJ.

 

 

Same here, waiting for the last of my kids to graduate high school (spring 2018) and then we are out here, likely coastal SC or GA.

 

Having grown up in NJ I never though I would leave but I am now more than ready.  My wife was itching badly to move to NYC (she gets bored real quick in the suburbs) but having seen the light with all the liberal BS going on she's ready to head south too. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I crossed the Delaware for the last time 5 months ago. I should have done it 5 years ago. It's not until you leave when you find out how really crappy living in nj was, you get used to the smell of poop. It's not even the 2a stuff, it's everyday living. I waited for the kids to graduate high school, and they all wished we moved sooner now. Sure I left an inlaw or two behind, it was a sacrifice :) But it's nice not paying all that money to support a system that was criminalizing me. When I tell my new FL coworkers about life in nj, they don't believe me!

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I crossed the Delaware for the last time 5 months ago. I should have done it 5 years ago. It's not until you leave when you find out how really crappy living in nj was, you get used to the smell of poop. It's not even the 2a stuff, it's everyday living. I waited for the kids to graduate high school, and they all wished we moved sooner now. Sure I left an inlaw or two behind, it was a sacrifice :) But it's nice not paying all that money to support a system that was criminalizing me. When I tell my new FL coworkers about life in nj, they don't believe me!

 

Same here. Where did you settle in FL?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I concur on all points.  And agree the 2013 list will be their starting point for next year.  I would assume they have already generated an updated list of anti-2A bills, based off that 2013 list, have them ready to go when the time comes.

 

Moreover, I cannot begin to fully express how disgusted and disrespected I feel as someone who was born, raised, and have raised a family here in NJ.   I increasingly feel like part of an oppressed class of citizens whose politicians are striving to banish from this state.  Is this any different that the many instances in history where populations were persecuted and turned into refugees?   Perhaps a bit dramatic of a comparison, but essentially the same.

 

I have too many family roots here to completely up and move at this time.  However, have begun to give thought to acquiring a 2nd home(vacation/retirement) in Pa.  Perhaps over time make it my primary residence. Have begun floating the idea with my wife as well.  The anticipated onslaught next year may be the catalyst for me to do so.  (Mipa, at some future date, I intend to reach out to you for your wise counsel concerning Pennsylvania.  Thank you in advance.)

Hmmm... I feel your pain. And I think we will all be feeling much more pain in 2018. But, my grasp of taxes/finance is admittedly poor, so don't laugh when I ask this: isn't there an opportunity here for some enterprising folks? I see an area like Stroudsburg with undervalued homes (beautiful 5 bedroom homes renting for 2K a month)... right over the river from the soon-to-be-even-more-oppressed NJ gun owners, yearning to be free. Is there any law that prohibits, say, 50 NJ gun owners from buying a house and terming it their "residence"? Likewise, as long as the primary residents are quiet, does a town really care if on paper you "sublet" to 10 or 20 people?

 

I mean, of course, best to fight this politically - but the demographics in our state are NOT good. So, if that fails... I'm sure some conniving cookies in PA are going to get creative with real estate. What are the tax implications of all that? If your NJ residence becomes your "secondary" residence? Is there a huge impact... or not? Is this a flight of fancy I'm on...?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have no idea. This has come up before. This is a different question overall than the ATF definition of "residence." For some reason, once I brought that up, people started thinking they could "reside" in any state they wanted for all legal purposes. Not the case.

 

Here is the little I do know. Between PA and Jersey, you pay income taxes in the state you "reside" in. Corporate taxes (such as S Corp K-1s) in the state of the company. If you "reside" in PA you must change your driver's license within 15 days. We also have local taxes that run somewhere around 1% and that does not come in the manual you get when you cross the border. It is up to you to know about it and pay it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well then, time to rally the 2A voters and see if we can stop this crazy thing.  Low voter turn out will be to our advantage.  Yeah, I know.................but you have to try.

It's not time yet. The vast majority of NJ gun owners don't care. Until something personally effects them, they're fine with whatever restrictions they state wants to create.

 

We haven't hit rock bottom yet.  Until NJ comes for the shotguns and black powder rifles, 95% or more of NJ gun owners are fine with NJ's laws.  Doesn't effect me and my deer hunt so I don't care.

 

Like a junkie, either it will get so bad that we'll finally decide to change our lives by fighting or the 2A will just die.  Either way, it's not time yet.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With regards to the A2938 bill and laws of it's type, there is no doubt it should dissuade people from seeking any kind of mental health treatment, even something as benign as obtaining advice related to child rearing, marriage, work challenges, etc.  Also, when I go for my yearly physical and my doctor asks "How's your stress level on a scale of 0-10"; my answer is now always zero.  Or,  to quote another forum member's post from a while back:  "The only person I open my mouth for is my dentist."

 

The danger is that most people are not as focused as we are on issues such as this.  Many will unknowingly dig themselves into a hole only to find out later they are listed in a database with mental health disqualifers.

Our anti-2A legislators are playing a strategic long game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm... I feel your pain. And I think we will all be feeling much more pain in 2018. But, my grasp of taxes/finance is admittedly poor, so don't laugh when I ask this: isn't there an opportunity here for some enterprising folks? I see an area like Stroudsburg with undervalued homes (beautiful 5 bedroom homes renting for 2K a month)... right over the river from the soon-to-be-even-more-oppressed NJ gun owners, yearning to be free. Is there any law that prohibits, say, 50 NJ gun owners from buying a house and terming it their "residence"? Likewise, as long as the primary residents are quiet, does a town really care if on paper you "sublet" to 10 or 20 people?

 

I mean, of course, best to fight this politically - but the demographics in our state are NOT good. So, if that fails... I'm sure some conniving cookies in PA are going to get creative with real estate. What are the tax implications of all that? If your NJ residence becomes your "secondary" residence? Is there a huge impact... or not? Is this a flight of fancy I'm on...?

A good "thinking out of the box idea", but not practical from a number of perspectives, not to also mention the aforementioned need to spend most of your time in Pa.  Don't forget, your EZPass and cellphone data could be easily used to prove/disprove where you resided throughout the year.  So push comes to shove, you can't fudge that.

 

On a related note, worth mentioning that Gunsitters (gunsitters.com)  has now opened a branch in Easton, Pa.  So, if in 2018, NJ reclassifies my already neutered  M&P 15/22 22 long rifle  as an "assault weapon", it will have a new home at Gunsitters in Easton, until such time it then moves to my eventual Pa residence.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A good "thinking out of the box idea", but not practical from a number of perspectives, not to also mention the aforementioned need to spend most of your time in Pa.  Don't forget, your EZPass and cellphone data could be easily used to prove/disprove where you resided throughout the year.  So push comes to shove, you can't fudge that.

 

On a related note, worth mentioning that Gunsitters (gunsitters.com)  has now opened a branch in Easton, Pa.  So, if in 2018, NJ reclassifies my already neutered  M&P 15/22 22 long rifle  as an "assault weapon", it will have a new home at Gunsitters in Easton, until such time it then moves to my eventual Pa residence.

 

I've never had an EZPass! No, I don't normally wear a tinfoil hat... nor do I expect to be runnin' from the law at any point in my life (LOL!)... that said, the whole "big brother", tracking your every move aspect of it just irks me to no end.

 

Without it, I think it would be very hard for anyone to prove where you laid your head at night. Your cell phone can't show where you slept.

 

Gunsitters is an interesting option though --- seems they're on to a smart long game and anticipating the same issues as the rest of us. Again, enterprising individuals will make money off the great disparity in laws between these 2 states - especially as those disparities grow wider.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've never had an EZPass! No, I don't normally wear a tinfoil hat... nor do I expect to be runnin' from the law at any point in my life (LOL!)... that said, the whole "big brother", tracking your every move aspect of it just irks me to no end.

 

Without it, I think it would be very hard for anyone to prove where you laid your head at night. Your cell phone can't show where you slept.

 

Gunsitters is an interesting option though --- seems they're on to a smart long game and anticipating the same issues as the rest of us. Again, enterprising individuals will make money off the great disparity in laws between these 2 states - especially as those disparities grow wider.

Having clients that sanctuary their state income. You would be very surprised.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Your cell phone can't show where you slept.

It not only can, it does. Right now. Tonight while you are sleeping. The data is collected automatically, no warrant or suspicion required. And most companies save it for at least a year, before we even get to the NSA. And the cops can get access to it without a warrant. They do it all the time.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It not only can, it does. Right now. Tonight while you are sleeping. The data is collected automatically, no warrant or suspicion required. And most companies save it for at least a year, before we even get to the NSA. And the cops can get access to it without a warrant. They do it all the time.

 

Not to be too tinfoil-hattish, boys... but if I don't answer my phone... any data showing what towers the calls bounced off only show where my PHONE was... isn't that correct? It doesn't necessarily show where "I" was. Soooo: Yes... your honor, I frequently work at my second residence in NJ and take my calls there as you'll see on the phone records... but then, I typically leave my phone there when I go to spend the night at my main residence in Pennsylvania. Why do I do that, you ask? Because my life is hectic, and I've developed the habit of fully disconnecting from all technology and gadgetry as often as possible. I find it very soothing to my jangled nerves. :-)

 

My point is, I believe a prosecutor would have a burden of PROVING that you didn't spend 50%+ of your year sleeping at the PA residence. Sounds nearly impossible to prove to me without a damn EZ pass giving away your every damn move. Burn your EZPass. Get a place in PA away from the prying eyes/wifi cameras of neighbors... all will be OK.  (I swear, I'm onto something here... you can't shake me from my plan, dammit! LOL.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...