Question about pistol permits and private sales in NJ

[stuckinNJ 81]

So my PD, like most in the state, can take a few months to issue my pistol permits. My problem is that I like to periodically browse for handguns to purchase. Now, for an online sale, I can buy and have it sit at my FFL until the permit matures.

The problem for me arises when it comes to a private/face to face sale. If I want to buy and avoid FFL and NICS fees, it would mean that I'd need a pistol permit ready. But since they can take months to process, this is rarely the case. Obviously one solution is to involve a FFL and pay more fees. 

One other solution is to just apply for pistol permits every 6 months since they are valid for that long (including extension). This way I suppose I could always be ready for a local NJ private sale (and let them expire if I don't find anything I like)... 

Would there be any legal problems with this? Any other ideas or solutions? What do you do if you like to buy pistols relatively often?

 

[Zeke 5,504]

2 minutes ago, stuckinNJ said:

So my PD, like most in the state, can take a few months to issue my pistol permits. My problem is that I like to periodically browse for handguns to purchase. Now, for an online sale, I can buy and have it sit at my FFL until the permit matures.

The problem for me arises when it comes to a private/face to face sale. If I want to buy and avoid FFL and NICS fees, it would mean that I'd need a pistol permit ready (in addition to a COE, of course). But since they can take months to process, this is rarely the case. Obviously one solution is to involve a FFL and pay more fees. 

One other solution is to just apply for pistol permits every 6 months since they are valid for that long (including extension). This way I suppose I could always be ready for a local NJ private sale (and let them expire if I don't find anything I like)... 

Would there be any legal problems with this? Any other ideas or solutions? What do you do if you like to buy pistols relatively often?

 

Most apply for 3. And get extensions. 

Many here constantly keep permits on hand.

The current Nj law is only 1 purchase per month.

Does that answer your question?

i would suggest you also introduce yourself in the "introductions" section .

[stuckinNJ 81]

5 minutes ago, Zeke said:

Most apply for 3. And get extensions. 

Many here constantly keep permits on hand.

The current Nj law is only 1 purchase per month.

Does that answer your question?

i would suggest you also introduce yourself in the "introductions" section .

Thanks for the reply. I'm not new at all to (the misery of) guns in NJ since I already have a few, but just wanted to know what people generally did specifically regarding p2p's. It seems your response is pretty much what I figured i.e. just always applying and having them on hand. I usually apply for 2 or 3 at a time. The awful part is waiting months, not to mentions $20 for the background checks and another $2 per permit... it's like $50 a yr on permits I may not even use!

[Zeke 5,504]

7 minutes ago, stuckinNJ said:

Thanks for the reply. I'm not new at all to (the misery of) guns in NJ since I already have a few, but just wanted to know what people generally did specifically regarding p2p's. It seems your response is pretty much what I figured i.e. just always applying and having them on hand. I usually apply for 2 or 3 at a time. The awful part is waiting months, not to mentions $20 for the background checks and another $2 per permit... it's like $50 a yr on permits I may not even use!

It's helping to fight crime.

[stuckinNJ 81]

Just now, Zeke said:

It's helping to fight crime.

Right lol just look at Newark, Camden, Trenton, East Orange..... I need to move

[My1stGlock 144]

9 minutes ago, stuckinNJ said:

Thanks for the reply. I'm not new at all to (the misery of) guns in NJ since I already have a few, but just wanted to know what people generally did specifically regarding p2p's. It seems your response is pretty much what I figured i.e. just always applying and having them on hand. I usually apply for 2 or 3 at a time. The awful part is waiting months, not to mentions $20 for the background checks and another $2 per permit... it's like $50 a yr on permits I may not even use!

Such blasphemy! Permits that don't get used????? LOL. At least use two in a 6 month period. (After one extension of course)

[stuckinNJ 81]

3 minutes ago, My1stGlock said:

Such blasphemy! Permits that don't get used????? LOL. At least use two in a 6 month period. (After one extension of course)

I know, right? But my problem is that I like to buy things that I want and on my terms. In other words, I do not want to buy a pistol just bc I have a permit that may expire. I need to buy a pistol that I want and that I've researched. I can't buy under pressure/urgency of a permit.

Sad reality here

[Zeke 5,504]

3 minutes ago, stuckinNJ said:

Right lol just look at Newark, Camden, Trenton, East Orange..... I need to move

When you move and I move. Who will be left with common sense?

[Maksim 1,504]

Always have permits on hand....

The second solution, if you run across a great F2F deal, have it sent to an FFL you have a GOOD relationship with.  The forum is a GREAT place to start that.  Typically your smaller FFL's will be okay with it.

the other option, particularly if it is another forum member who has a good reputation/trader feedback score, pay for the gun, have them hold it until you get your permits.

I have done both.  Hope that helps.

[Zeke 5,504]

1 minute ago, stuckinNJ said:

I know, right? But my problem is that I like to buy things that I want and on my terms. In other words, I do not want to buy a pistol just bc I have a permit that may expire. I need to buy a pistol that I want and that I've researched. I can't buy under pressure/urgency of a permit.

Sad reality here

The scheme has actually failed. Guns used in crimes are not legally purchased. Law abiding Nj resident purchase more do to that " permit " pressure. It's microcosm Obama. Good job Nj Dems. 

[Maksim 1,504]

@stuckinNJ btw, welcome to the community. =)

[stuckinNJ 81]

1 minute ago, Maksim said:

Always have permits on hand....

The second solution, if you run across a great F2F deal, have it sent to an FFL you have a GOOD relationship with.  The forum is a GREAT place to start that.  Typically your smaller FFL's will be okay with it.

the other option, particularly if it is another forum member who has a good reputation/trader feedback score, pay for the gun, have them hold it until you get your permits.

I have done both.  Hope that helps.

Yes, but wouldn't that FFL then need to charge for at least a NICS when I return with a permit? Also, if I find someone to buy from, say on a diff forum, how can I trust that he'll keep it on hand (until I return with the p2p) after I pay?

1 minute ago, Maksim said:

@stuckinNJ btw, welcome to the community. =)

Thanks

[Maksim 1,504]

2 minutes ago, stuckinNJ said:

Yes, but wouldn't that FFL then need to charge for at least a NICS when I return with a permit? Also, if I find someone to buy from, say on a diff forum, how can I trust that he'll keep it on hand (until I return with the p2p) after I pay?

Thanks

Yes, they would charge for Nics + Transfer typically, since the gun would be on their books.  It is cheap insurance versus passing up a really good deal or a rare gun.  $40 is quite reasonable.

Well, if on a different forum, I would not leave them with the gun there since no one knows those people.  Here, after time you develop relationships and trust folks. =)

[stuckinNJ 81]

3 minutes ago, Maksim said:

Yes, they would charge for Nics + Transfer typically, since the gun would be on their books.  It is cheap insurance versus passing up a really good deal or a rare gun.  $40 is quite reasonable.

Right, so I guess the only real solution here is to just always have them on hand. So for example, if I get them in January, they'll be good till June. However, assuming my PD takes 3 months, I should already apply in April so I can have permits from July till year end.... Then repeat in Sept for Jan of year 2..... this make sense?

[Zeke 5,504]

6 minutes ago, stuckinNJ said:

Yes, but wouldn't that FFL then need to charge for at least a NICS when I return with a permit? Also, if I find someone to buy from, say on a diff forum, how can I trust that he'll keep it on hand (until I return with the p2p) after I pay?

Thanks

Either way,lost permits or transfer it's a cost. 

And remember, it's keeping crime down.

1 minute ago, stuckinNJ said:

Right, so I guess the only real solution here is to just always have them on hand. So for example, if I get them in January, they'll be good till June. However, assuming my PD takes 3 months, I should already apply in April so I can have permits from July till year end.... Then repeat in Sept for Jan of year 2..... this make sense?

Or get extensions 

[stuckinNJ 81]

3 minutes ago, Zeke said:

Either way,lost permits or transfer it's a cost. 

And remember, it's keeping crime down.

Or get extensions 

I included extensions (hence "A January permit good until June"). But if I waited until June to reapply, I'd be permitless from June till I get new permits

[GRIZ 3,369]

13 minutes ago, Maksim said:

Always have permits on hand....

The second solution, if you run across a great F2F deal, have it sent to an FFL you have a GOOD relationship with.  The forum is a GREAT place to start that.  Typically your smaller FFL's will be okay with it.

the other option, particularly if it is another forum member who has a good reputation/trader feedback score, pay for the gun, have them hold it until you get your permits.

I have done both.  Hope that helps.

I have never used an FFL in a private sale although that is a viable alternative.

I always have permits in hand as others have suggested.  I have run into situations where the one gun a month rule is the issue.

I have had the seller just hold it for a week or so until the 30 days pass. Sometimes leave a deposit, sometimes pay in full.  I have had a seller I've dealt with multiple times hold on to a gun for 2 months because I didn't have a permit.

If I wanted to buy more than one from the same seller I have the seller fill out the paperwork.  Sometimes give a deposit or even pay in full.

If you're asking a seller to hold on to a gun for you, you just need to agree on terms that both of you feel comfortable with.

[Maksim 1,504]

Sometimes permits take less, particularly if you get them every 6 months.

Also again depending on on your town.

In reality though... buy a few guns and transfer at same time, ie can apply for exemptions.

$40 though should not be a big deal buying firearms...  It is a few boxes of ammo or a walk on fee + a box of ammo.

the gun and the transfer fee are the CHEAPEST part of shooting. =)  

[Zeke 5,504]

Reapply before time is up. Law says 30 days, but we are finding the state is not adhering to the law. If you're an active enthusiast, it's the cost of the hobby

[stuckinNJ 81]

6 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

I have never used an FFL in a private sale although that is a viable alternative.

I always have permits in hand as others have suggested.  I have run into situations where the one gun a month rule is the issue.

I have had the seller just hold it for a week or so until the 30 days pass. Sometimes leave a deposit, sometimes pay in full.  I have had a seller I've dealt with multiple times hold on to a gun for 2 months because I didn't have a permit.

If I wanted to buy more than one from the same seller I have the seller fill out the paperwork.  Sometimes give a deposit or even pay in full.

If you're asking a seller to hold on to a gun for you, you just need to agree on terms that both of you feel comfortable with.

Thanks. This is helpful. The issue for me is that I can see on a forum when a few people are interested in the gun for sale, so any delay on my part may cause me to lose the gun to someone else. At which point I suppose it's worth getting a FFL involved to just hold it for me.

[stuckinNJ 81]

14 minutes ago, Maksim said:

Sometimes permits take less, particularly if you get them every 6 months.

Also again depending on on your town.

In reality though... buy a few guns and transfer at same time, ie can apply for exemptions.

$40 though should not be a big deal buying firearms...  It is a few boxes of ammo or a walk on fee + a box of ammo.

the gun and the transfer fee are the CHEAPEST part of shooting. =)  

I'm pretty sure an exception would really only be granted in very special cases, like antique collectors, etc. (I've looked it up pretty recently). 

[Oakridgefirearms 224]

1 hour ago, stuckinNJ said:

I'm pretty sure an exception would really only be granted in very special cases, like antique collectors, etc. (I've looked it up pretty recently). 

Generally, the NJSP FIU will approve exemptions for any legal handgun if you are a collector or are buying from someone who inherited handguns- including brand new modern handguns, they do not need to be C&R or antique.

[Maksim 1,504]

1 hour ago, stuckinNJ said:

I'm pretty sure an exception would really only be granted in very special cases, like antique collectors, etc. (I've looked it up pretty recently). 

Don't know about now, but I had zero issues getting exemptions.  I believe they were just automatically approved and I never had any issues from my township.

[stuckinNJ 81]

2 minutes ago, Maksim said:

Don't know about now, but I had zero issues getting exemptions.  I believe they were just automatically approved and I never had any issues from my township.

Well I wouldn't rely on it, seeing as NJ gun laws are enforced incredibly inconsistently across our 565+ municipalities. As Oak Ridge said, the form pretty much singles out antique collectors and inheritances.

[Maksim 1,504]

Just now, stuckinNJ said:

Well I wouldn't rely on it, seeing as NJ gun laws are enforced incredibly inconsistently across our 565+ municipalities. As Oak Ridge said, the form pretty much singles out antique collectors and inheritances.

All you have to say is "collecting."  you don't have to prove anything.

Furthermore, it is the state police that approves them, NOT your municipality.

I have yet to hear of anyone that has had the form denied however.  =)

[stuckinNJ 81]

10 minutes ago, Maksim said:

All you have to say is "collecting."  you don't have to prove anything.

Furthermore, it is the state police that approves them, NOT your municipality.

I have yet to hear of anyone that has had the form denied however.  =)

This is interesting. I think I will actually try this. How does it work? Apply before buying, get approved, then buy 2 handguns at once? What are the steps? Whats the response time? Should I already apply now?

[GRIZ 3,369]

55 minutes ago, Maksim said:

All you have to say is "collecting."  you don't have to prove anything.

Furthermore, it is the state police that approves them, NOT your municipality.

I have yet to hear of anyone that has had the form denied however.  =)

I sent in an exemption form just the other day.  It clearly states "Collector of handguns...enhancement of collection ....historical ...investment ...recreational.. .or any other lawful related purpose".

I've alway sent straight it to NJSP and got it back in about 2 weeks.  They send a copy to your local pd.

 

[GRIZ 3,369]

I have the seller fill out their form and send it in together with mine.   Saves them time in having to match them up.

[stuckinNJ 81]

25 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

I sent in an exemption form just the other day.  It clearly states "Collector of handguns...enhancement of collection ....historical ...investment ...recreational.. .or any other lawful related purpose".

I've alway sent straight it to NJSP and got it back in about 2 weeks.  They send a copy to your local pd.

 

Right I see that. Here is my scenario, and from some research I've been doing I'm still unclear. I want to get gun #1 which is already sitting now at my FFL. Obviously I don't need an exemption for that. However, gun #2 is from a classified and will be a private sale. How do I proceed? I understand that I need the serial # (I assume just for gun #2) on the request form, but how exactly do I go about picking up gun #2 from the private sale?

22 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

I have the seller fill out their form and send it in together with mine.   Saves them time in having to match them up.

You mean the seller must send their SP-016 along with my SP-015? And then we just wait for approval?

[GRIZ 3,369]

2 ways to do this:

This is how I'd do it:

1.  Buy the private sale as you normally would.

2.  Pay the FFL for the gun and submit the paperwork for an exemption for that gun.  The FFL shouldn't mind holding the gun for a couple of weeks if he's been paid for it.

That's what I'm doing now but both guns are private sales from the same seller.

You can buy 10 guns from 10 different people with an exemption or whatever.  You list all guns, serial numbers, and seller's info on your form.  Each seller lists your info and gun info on their forms.  

It says on the seller form it must accompany your application.  If you're buying 10 from 10 different people you'll have 10 seller forms to attach to yours.

PITA but that's what you need to do.