Rural neighbors get into gunfight...

[124gr9mm 859]

...because of the fence that divides their property??!?!?!?!?!?!

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFzCYLqJtq8

I wonder if the angry guy who started the encounter with "Hey asshole" and is in intensive care is having second thoughts?

 

Seems like they've been building to this point for several years.  It was only a matter of time before one of them shot the other:

http://www.dailyjournal.net/2017/06/29/ongoing_feud_turns_violent/

The prosecutor’s office has reviewed multiple reports involving Weigle and the Kellers in the past.

Since 2009, residents of the two homes have called police at least 16 times on each other, according to reports from the Johnson County Sheriff’s Office.

The disputes have ranged from Weigle reporting being bitten by the Kellers’ dog in 2009 to multiple reports of arguments about a fence that separates the two properties as recent as last year.

In 2010, the Kellers got a protective order against Weigle after two reports where they said Weigle threatened to shoot their dog and challenged Dean Keller to a fight. The order later lapsed, though deputies had recommended more than once to get a new one, according to police reports.

In 2011, sheriff’s deputies were called to the home after a fight. Weigle told police the Kellers’ dog ran at him, and Dean Keller told police Weigle called for the dog. The two ended up on the ground fighting, and Weigle stabbed Dean Keller in the arm, requiring stitches, the report said. Dean Keller told police he had bit Weigle during the fight, according to the sheriff’s office report.

The Kellers had also reported instances where they felt threatened by Weigle, including Dean Keller reporting that Weigle had told him he had a gun and would use it, reports said. They also reported Weigle had driven up and down the road in front of their home on his motorcycle, thrown fireworks toward Lisa Keller and their dog and threatened Dean Keller with a bat, reports said.

Nancy Phillips, 79, who owns the home where Weigle lives, told police that earlier this week, Dean Keller had threatened to kill Weigle, but no report was made to police.

In the last two years, the dispute mostly centered on the fence between the properties. Residents from both homes called police when Dean Keller would remove ties or rings Weigle or Phillips would put onto the fence.

More than once, the disputes turned physical.

Over the years, Dean Keller reported Weigle had spit at him, stabbed him with a fork and hit him in the head. Lisa Keller reported Weigle had struck her with a broom.

And Weigle reported that Dean Keller had tried to hit him with a pipe and stabbed him with needle-nose pliers, police reports said.

 

[bhunted 887]

Oh No! The Hatfields and McCoys are at it again Mamma... Break out the Moonshine! We gotta see this. Make sure our one eyed bloodhound ain't near dem!

[124gr9mm 859]

10 minutes ago, bhunted said:

Oh No! The Hatfields and McCoys are at it again Mamma... Break out the Moonshine! We gotta see this. Make sure our one eyed bloodhound ain't near dem!

LOL!!

Definitely Hatfields and McCoys stuff.

Guy took 4 bullets to the chest...because of an argument over a fence.

The older guy was just renting a room so it wasn't even HIS fence!!!

 

[Smokin .50 1,907]

4 to the chest?  And got-up & walked-away?  Still talking?  Looked to me like the guy riding the mower pulled his piece first, and did so after instigating the encounter.  How fortunate to have a video camera right there.  It's almost like he knew it's gonna happen  

[Zeke 5,504]

The article gave me a headache.

[antimatter 139]

WTF

[Malsua 1,422]

33 minutes ago, Smokin .50 said:

4 to the chest?  And got-up & walked-away?  Still talking?  Looked to me like the guy riding the mower pulled his piece first, and did so after instigating the encounter.  How fortunate to have a video camera right there.  It's almost like he knew it's gonna happen  

 

The older guy brandished and the other guy opened up on him.    In NJ, the shooter is toast since he could have retreated in perfect safety.  That said, it goes to show how stupid brandishing is.

 

 

[Smokin .50 1,907]

4 minutes ago, Malsua said:

 

The older guy brandished and the other guy opened up on him.    In NJ, the shooter is toast since he could have retreated in perfect safety.  That said, it goes to show how stupid brandishing is.

 

 

Brandishing isn't stupid if done correctly.  Some consider open carry "brandishing"!  There's a fine line when employing the "art of brandishing" to control a situation long enough to make an exit w/o having to pop the initial aggressor.  These two have a history that's well documented, so in this case the victim fired in self-defense.

More on the art of brandishing & when/how to properly deploy it to de-escalate a situation.  Of particulat interest to women who purse carry:

 

"I've been teaching the California, UT, AZ, FL, CCWs for many years and as you know, most states do allow for a legal form of brandishing. Utah’s law states that it can be done if the person reasonably believes the action to be necessary in compliance with Section 76-2-402 (Use of force) with the purpose to prevent another’s use of unlawful force. California’s law states that brandishing may be done if the person reasonably believes you or another person is to suffer imminent harm, and you fight back with no more force than is reasonably necessary to defend against that danger.

While I absolutely agree with you that the law requires that it never be done in a fight or quarrel unless you’ve done everything reasonable to de-escalate, I wouldn’t say that it should “never” be done. I always tell me students that it’s a dangerous game to play because once you introduce the gun into the conversation, the attacker can try and call your bluff and you have to be willing to use it if the situation escalates. Then you have all the concerns of witnesses misunderstanding the threat like you have mentioned.

Where some instructors get into trouble- and I’m not suggesting this is what you meant- is when they tell students that the gun should never come unholstered until they’ve decided to shoot. I always include drills where we clear the shirt to access or even draw from the holster, but don’t shoot. I don’t want it ingrained within them to shoot every time the gun is gripped or drawn. For example, a man with a machete is yelling at me from across the street, starting to walk toward me, and saying he’s going to chop me up. He’s about 35 feet away and outside of the “21-foot rule”. Although not a hard and fast rule, many would argue that the threat isn’t imminent enough yet to justify pulling the trigger. You better believe however that I’m going to draw my firearm in a “defensive display” and give the attacker demands as I back up and look for cover and/or an escape route. This of course would be considered brandishing, but in a legal manner. I can also envision a situation where a woman is walking late at night and alone through a parking lot to her car. She notices that she’s being followed by a shady character and there’s no reasonable explanation why this person is following her (i.e. there’s no other cars in the lot, it’s not a shortcut to anywhere, etc.). She first makes eye contact to let him know she’s not an easy target, then tries to engage in conversation by asking if he’s lost. He keeps coming straight toward her, picking us his pace. She finds her vehicle or a cement pillar to place between them and she walks a circle around it, but he obviously and deliberately follows her move. I would first recommend a less-lethal option like a Taser. If she doesn’t have one however, she then accesses the gun compartment of her purse and places her hand on the gun. At this point, she’s getting behind the time curve as he tries to close the distance between them. She greatly fears she’s about to become a victim of a forcible felony or is about to suffer serious bodily injury because of a size and strength disparity. She can yell at him forcefully to get back. If this doesn’t work however, it’s reasonable to assume in her situation that anyone who continues an advance is about to commit a serious crime. This is a good example of when informing the attacker that she has a gun and/or displaying it is the last best option short of actually firing the gun in self-defense. Shooting an unarmed attacker can be a very difficult decision, but the decision should quickly become clear once the gun is displayed or the attacker is informed she has one. The ball is in his court. If the situation escalates and he continues the approach instead of turning and running, then she must be willing to use the gun. Like you had mentioned, all other options have been exhausted and a person must first be justified in presenting the gun in the first place.

While I don’t have exact stats, it’s understood that a good portion of such dangerous conflicts are avoided just by the presence of the gun. While I believe the main thrust and intent of your article was regarding those wanting to engage in fighting, I just wanted to insert my opinion that in certain situations, brandishing against an armed or even an unarmed attacker can be an effective and legal manner to avoid a lethal conflict, just short of pulling the trigger. I would also always call the police right after. In California, many sheriffs require the CCW holder to inform them of an incident where they draw their weapon. Some criminals have the audacity to even call the police on the victim after a botched attack to report a brandishing. It’s always a good idea to let the police know right away so they can establish who the true victim is. Thanks for your great articles Luke. I share them a lot with my students."

[Malsua 1,422]

There's a huge difference between brandishing, what the old guy did, and unholstering.  

The old guy pulled the gun out of his pocket, waved it in the air as a threat, i.e. offensive.

Removing your gun from your holster, keeping your gun at low ready, sul or just pointed down to the ground is defensive and I agree, it can de-escalate the situation.

 

[124gr9mm 859]

2 hours ago, Smokin .50 said:

How fortunate to have a video camera right there.  It's almost like he knew it's gonna happen  

The camera appears to be there because of the history of angst/stupidity with the fence.

 

[Zeke 5,504]

5 minutes ago, 124gr9mm said:

The camera appears to be there because of the history of angst/stupidity with the fence.

 

I agree. 

[antimatter 139]

i didnt see that cranky guy pull his gun..

and how the hell did he get up???

[bhunted 887]

4 to the chest?  And got-up & walked-away?  Still talking?  Looked to me like the guy riding the mower pulled his piece first, and did so after instigating the encounter.  How fortunate to have a video camera right there.  It's almost like he knew it's gonna happen [emoji4] 

It's the moonshine I tell ya! Makes ya like sum dang superman.

I saw a catfish once take a sip and it kicked the hell out of all the minnow bait. It was a blood bath I tell ya! [emoji23]

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[Mrs. Peel 7,157]

Sorry to be a Debbie Downer... but this is the kind of crap that I fully expect the MSM will get a hold of and play it to DEATH... making ALL gun owners look bad because of these 2 yoyos and their silly-ass immaturity. Complete imbeciles! But make no mistake, WE pay the price for their stupidity.

[124gr9mm 859]

1 hour ago, antimatter said:

i didnt see that cranky guy pull his gun..

and how the hell did he get up???

At :53 in the video clip (as soon as the reversing mower comes into view) you can see angry-man reach into his right pocket and pull out the pistol, so it's in his hand pretty much as soon as he re-enters while riding in reverse.

Firefighter doesn't seem to notice until a few seconds later when angry-man raises/brandishes the pistol, so he definitely had the drop on firefighter.

[124gr9mm 859]

13 minutes ago, Mrs. Peel said:

Sorry to be a Debbie Downer... but this is the kind of crap that I fully expect the MSM will get a hold of and play it to DEATH... making ALL gun owners look bad because of these 2 yoyos and their silly-ass immaturity. Complete imbeciles! But make no mistake, WE pay the price for their stupidity.

I agree.

Senseless.

Grown men fighting for YEARS over stuff that doesn't matter at all.  Ego and the need to be "right" lead both to the point where common sense and judgement flew out the window.

All the media will show is guns, guns, guns.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

There are times, even as a staunch Second Amendment Patriot & VP of NJ's busiest 2A group, I have to admit that not EVERYBODY should have a gun.  THIS is one of those times...........

[Ray Ray 3,566]

I wish they both got shot.

[124gr9mm 859]

8 hours ago, Nickjc said:

...

 

Ha !

 

 

Did u just go there? 

 

Lol

LOL!!

Unfortunately there's no effective criteria to weed out the kind of stupidity that led to that shooting...