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Zeke

Running red dots with magnifiers

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I have three Aimpoints... two PROs and a Comp M4s. All use the standard mounts, except the one PRO on my AR has a forward extension to push it out towards the Delta ring (height is exactly the same). The Aimpoint 3x magnifier (on a LaRue mount) works between them all.

Even though a .45 AR doesn't need it due to the effective range, I still put it on to get a more accurate zero. But whether it is my AR or Tavor, can go right on the rail and used when needed (folding system is very easy to move).

Definitely recommend the LaRue mount for the magnifier... opposed to that twist mount. Definitely doable to run behind an EOTech... just I don't like them. I originally was looking at the EXPS2, but eventually decided on my first PRO. Battery life was just too good to not go Aimpoint. With all the BS that came up with EOTech somewhat recently, I just stick by Aimpoint that much more. Does an EOTech work? I'm sure it does... but they aren't getting my money.

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If you don't want to blow the money on an Aimpoint magnifier. Vortex magnifiers are just as good. I have one paired up with my Aimpoint.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

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Tried the Aimpoint 3x magnifier in a LaRue FTS mount for quite some time. Had it behind an Aimpoint M4, a couple of T1s (2 and 4moa versions) and some PROs. Took multiple multi-day classes with it. I just couldn't warm up to it and ended up trading it for a Trijicon RMR.

It was heavy, gave the rifle a weird balance when flipped to side, hung up on stuff, I was measurably slower inside 100 yards.

Zeke, just get a PRO and call it a day.

Unless you are planning on regularly shooting people over 100 yards away or doing a lot of benchrest type shooting, you will be much better served with an Aimpoint and a pair of 8x binoculars. 

Spend the money you would have spent on the magnifier and buy ammo and take a class. You will get better results at all distances.

If you think you absolutely have to have a magnified optic, get a 1-6 variable powered scope. Vortex Strike Eagle is hard to beat for the $$.

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aimpoint t2 with aimpoint 6x magnifier in a flipmount complete is the cat's tits. the aimpoint 6x is expensive, but it's bulletproof and has outstanding glass. well worth it to me and for my money superior to an acog as it's a hell of a lot more versatile. 1-6x on demand, the flipmount flips out of the way AND you can twist the mag completely off when you just want to run an ultralight 1x red dot setup. also very useful if you have multiple red dot setups you'd like to use the magnifier with. just buy an additional twist base and off you go

i'm probably going to take advantage of the eotech sale and add one to the lineup. just need an extra twist base and i'll have that at 1-6x as well

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5 minutes ago, tattooo said:

The only thing that was a PITA for me was getting the magnifier zeroed to the dot. Its been a long time but I remember having to adjust and line them up to hit the same poi with the magnifier .

get on paper with reddot, magnify and zero, flip off magnifier and confirm zero.  never had any poi change between the two

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24 minutes ago, cabalrayz said:

i've used one but now it sits in the safe, too heavy and way slower to obtain targets, now i just run the reddot.  can't imagine taking any practical shot that a 3x magnifier would make the difference.  rather use another tool altogether for bench/longer distances.

completely agree with the 3x not making a difference. that's why i went 6x ;)

i dispute the heavy and slower comments though. before i went all in with my setup i did some extensive research. a t2 + flipmount + scalarworks mount + 6x comes in at 17.79 oz measured. for comparison, here are some pretty elite 1-6 scopes:

kahles k16i - 17.6 oz

leupold mk6 - 17 oz

uso sr6 - 22.4 oz

vortex razor hd g2 - 25.2 oz

very comparable with the best of them weight-wise, and don't forget, with the flipmount you can instantly ditch half that weight with a quick flick of the wrist if you want to go light. 

as for being slower to acquire targets, if it's flipped off, you have a standard red dot. you should obviously have no issues there, and i can hit stuff out to 100 yards without much issue with my dumb eyes. if i want to range out to 200-300 yards, just flip the mag and go for it. when i look down the mag to the red dot, it's right where i expect it to be, no having to search for it or fumble around with anything. i don't have any perceived loss of time to acquire a target at all. now, if you're doing cqb stuff i could see it taking longer, but not sure why you'd be using a 3x/6x mag for cqb anyway.

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43 minutes ago, cabalrayz said:

i've used one but now it sits in the safe, too heavy and way slower to obtain targets, now i just run the reddot.  can't imagine taking any practical shot that a 3x magnifier would make the difference.  rather use another tool altogether for bench/longer distances.

This. Your mission drives your gear. 

If your job/hobby required you to routinely switch from medium range (150-300yards) to MOUT range (25-150 yards) to CQB range (room distances) on the fly - the RDS w/magnifier was the answer for a lot of years.

Until recently (5 years or so) Your only other option was a variable power scope without a true 1x at its lowest setting that was less than ideal at FISHing distances and was extremely expensive.

Now, with so many excellent choices in the low power variable mag area - most with a true 1x - with quality options running a broad range of pricing, the FTS magnifier is really obsolete.

You can buy an excellent quality 1-6 variable power optic and mount that will suit you much better for about the same price as an Aimpoint RDS and Aimpoint Magnifier with appropriate mounts.

It is a no brainer.

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i don't disagree, and i have a nice stable of variable power scopes to prove it. i love every one of my scopes and wouldn't trade them for anything. that said, it is very, very hard to beat an aimpoint t2 or an eotech standalone rds for sheer light weight and speed of target acquisition (for me). having a removable magnifier capable of reaching way beyond typical rds range is a huge added bonus. obsolete? meh i don't think so. aimpoint glass is up there with the best optics i own imo, and it's doubled as a nice spotting scope on occasion to boot in addition to giving me serious versatility

also, speaking of costs, idk what everyone else has as far as preferences, but i subscribe to the old adage, "strong, light, cheap. pick two". hence, my optics are...not cheap. the initial cost of the 6x magnifier is steep, but it's a buy once, cry once philosophy. that magnifier is now interchangeable on any rds i have or will have for the rest of my life. atm it's mated to an aimpoint t2, but as i mentioned, i'm close to pulling the trigger on an eotech exps 3-2. after discounts and rebates, i'm looking at $478 and change. 6x mag is a sunk cost, so i have a light, rugged 1-6 holo optic for $478 is the way i see it. can't even come close to beating that with a scope. if/when i build another rifle and want a trijicon mro, a 1-6 rds optic on that will be $450 and change. for comparison, my nightforce 1-4 nxs was $1300, and weighs the same as the rds/mag setup. a vortex 1-6x weighs 8oz more and costs the same

anyway, just get all of the optics. it's the only way to be sure. rds, magnifier, fixed optic, variable optic, all. you'll never run out of rifles to put them on, and you'll have a LOT of fun shooting them and comparing strengths/weaknesses. after all, it's only money :)

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2 hours ago, Indianajonze said:

 

anyway, just get all of the optics. it's the only way to be sure. rds, magnifier, fixed optic, variable optic, all. you'll never run out of rifles to put them on, and you'll have a LOT of fun shooting them and comparing strengths/weaknesses. after all, it's only money :)

Oooohhhh you not funny. :B:):

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I have had a LaRue Tactical OBR 16 inch AR-15 (5.56) rifle for a couple of years and added an Aimpoint Comp M4s & Aimpoint 3x Magnifier. The M4s has a LaRue Tactical QD mount and the Magnifier has the LaRue swivel mount. That setup gives me the flexibility for ranges between 50-300 yards which is what I am interested in. Not cheap, but excellent optics quality and durability.

 

AVB-AMG

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

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I just spent all day on the range with some of the best carbine instructors and shooters on the planet.

I did a 4 hour block on intermediate distance Carbine (300 yards). No one had a RDS and magnifier combo. A handful of us shot with plain RDS (I ran a 2MOA T1). Everyone else had low power magnified optics.

At 300 yards I was faster with my RDS than a lot of guys with magnification. 

Those are all clues. 

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On 8/26/2017 at 10:54 PM, High Exposure said:

At 300 yards I was faster with my RDS than a lot of guys with magnification.

How much time are these guys spending behind those scopes vs how much time have you spend behind your RDS. In my experience, all training and skill being equal there is simply no comparison beyond 100-150 yards, and closer in the difference is not huge either with a quality scope. At close range the biggest issue with magnified optics is that people over aim, gun up head up keep your eyes open red on target press it. Too many people are trying to see perfect sight pictures for no good reason

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1 hour ago, Ray Ray said:

:facepalm:

 

Over 200 military, police, and citizen shooters from all across the country converged in Alliance Ohio for the 2nd annual "Friends Of Pat" memorial.

mHHmjFS.jpg

We spent all day Saturday on the range shooting. Some of the best carbine and pistol instructors out there came to participate as instructors and students. All classes were taught from a "fighting mindset". Representatives from every special unit you can think of were there - and probably a few you never heard of - to teach and learn.

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I shoot a red dot past 300 yards with no issues.  A magnifier sounds like useless weight and added complexity.  And money.  If you want the option to have some magnification you should look into a variable magnification scope, in my opinion.  But that's just me!

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4 hours ago, Vlad G said:

How much time are these guys spending behind those scopes vs how much time have you spend behind your RDS. In my experience, all training and skill being equal there is simply no comparison beyond 100-150 yards, and closer in the difference is not huge either with a quality scope. At close range the biggest issue with magnified optics is that people over aim, gun up head up keep your eyes open red on target press it. Too many people are trying to see perfect sight pictures for no good reason

I spent 4 hours on the 300 yard range engaging 1/2 size IPSC steel targets with a T1.

All shooters were fairly experienced, but obviously some more than others. 

The speed advantage of the RDS really became apparent when engaging multiple targets that were spread out. Shooting an RDS woth both eyes open let me acquire and engage targets much faster than a guy with his scope zoomed in to a higher mag.

There was also the Perfect Sight Picture syndrome that reared its ugly head.

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10 hours ago, High Exposure said:

Over 200 military, police, and citizen shooters from all across the country converged in Alliance Ohio for the 2nd annual "Friends Of Pat" memorial.

mHHmjFS.jpg

We spent all day Saturday on the range shooting. Some of the best carbine and pistol instructors out there came to participate as instructors and students. All classes were taught from a "fighting mindset". Representatives from every special unit you can think of were there - and probably a few you never heard of - to teach and learn.

You and I are both humble.  

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