Firearm transfer in family after death

[DirtFarmer 1]

My Uncle just recently passed away. He left everything he owned to my Grandmother if she was still living at his time of death, which she is. She is however unable to fulfill the duties of executor of his will so my Mom will be executor. My Uncle has a handgun and shotgun which are being given to me. I posses a FID, what is the legal process I have to take to take full ownership of these firearms and transport them from CT to NJ? I’ve read what I can but it can get confusing. My mother obviously does not have an FID and does not want these in her possession.

 

 

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[GRIZ 3,369]

Everything left to your Grandmother means the guns are hers you need a P2P and execute a COE for the long gun.  Your Grandmother would be the seller on both forms.  She does not need a FID to sell or transfer the guns.

Now if your Grandmother is not capable of handling her affairs does anyone have a power of attorney?  

[DirtFarmer 1]

Yes my mom is power of attorney. Thanks for the info. That’s what I thought I had to do but want some confirmation


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[GRIZ 3,369]

If your Mom has full power of attorney she can transfer them to you for your Grandmother.

[tjs3023 19]

7 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Everything left to your Grandmother means the guns are hers you need a P2P and execute a COE for the long gun.  Your Grandmother would be the seller on both forms.  She does not need a FID to sell or transfer the guns.

Now if your Grandmother is not capable of handling her affairs does anyone have a power of attorney?  

That answers the long gun, but what about the handgun? I would think that the op would need a handgun permit to take possession, so where is it best, or most legal to store it in the meantime - with the mother who has no fid, or the op, who does? Curious, as I an in a similar situation.

[Silence Dogood 468]

Not legal advice, only opinon -

Make sure that they are legal in NJ (likely but still check).

I'd get a really good paper trail (including serial numbers etc.) in place via your mother indicating your ownership through inheritance.  Make sure that they are legally transferred to you under CT law (see below - administered by the CT State Police like NJ - call them with procedural questions).

Then, you'll have to decide whether or not you want to drive them back to NJ through NYC or NY state.  FOPA protects you under these circumstances but New York has a very bad reputation.  Personally, I wouldn't do it but that's just me.  Once you are legally established as the owner you can mail the shotgun to yourself via USPS.  You can ship the handgun via UPS, but you have to declare it and ship next day air $$.

Connecticut law:

https://www.cga.ct.gov/2013/rpt/2013-R-0001.htm

Handgun Sale/Transfer Procedures

All handgun sales and transfers, whether by licensed dealers or unlicensed persons, must conform to specified state procedures, except those (1) between FFLs; (2) made to federal marshals, parole officers, or peace officers; or (3) involving antique handguns (CGS § 29-33).

Under the procedures, buyers must complete a DESPP firearms purchase application. DESPP must conduct a national instant criminal background check on applicants and either deny the transaction or approve it by issuing an authorization number for it.

Sellers or transferors must, among other things:

1. ensure that they know the person to whom they are providing the firearm or get appropriate identification (e.g., driver's license or passport);

2. ensure that, when transferred, handguns are unloaded and equipped with a reusable trigger lock accessible by key or electronic or mechanical accessory specific to the device to prevent unauthorized removal;

3. document the transaction with State Police and appropriate local officials within 48 hours; and

4. keep the transaction records for law enforcement inspection (application for at least 20 years and receipt for at least five years).

When a buyer takes possession of the handgun, he or she must sign a receipt for it, providing (1) his or her name, address, and occupation; (2) the firearm make, model, serial number, and caliber; (3) the transfer date and authorization number for the transfer; and (4) his or her permit or eligibility certificate number (CGS § 29-33(e)).

The law prohibits handgun transfers in violation of its procedures or to people who (1) cannot legally possess handguns under state law or (2) do not have the appropriate credentials to obtain them (CGS § 29-33(a) and (b)). Any such illegal transfer is a class D felony. It is a class B felony (see Table 2) if the person transferring the firearm knows that it is stolen or that the manufacturer's number or serial number has been removed, defaced, altered, or obliterated (CGS § 29-33(i)). The court may, in some circumstances, suspend prosecution for a first minor violation.

Long Gun Sales and Transfer Procedures

Sales and Transfers by Gun Dealers. The law regulates long gun sales by licensed gun dealers, irrespective of where the transaction occurs. With some exceptions, when gun dealers sell or transfer long guns, the transactions must conform to statutory procedures, the essential elements of which are similar to those governing handgun sales and transfers. As is the case with handguns, (1) the dealer must document the transaction with DESPP and maintain copies of the record, (2) the buyer must undergo a national instant criminal background check, and (3) DESPP must authorize or deny the sale or transfer. Unlike the case with handguns, there is no explicit requirement for the dealer to know the buyer or obtain valid identification (CGS § 29-37a).

The law contains a two-week waiting period for long gun purchases from gun dealers, unless the buyer (1) is a federal marshal, parole officer, or peace officer; (2) holds a valid hunting license, eligibility certificate, or gun permit; (3) is a member of the U.S. Armed Forces; or (4) is buying an antique firearm (CGS § 29-37a(b)). The law also exempts these people and transactions from provisions requiring (1) buyers to sign a receipt for the firearm and provide certain information on themselves and the firearm and (2) dealers to send this documentation to state and local police officials (CGS § 29-37a(b)).

Sales and Transfers by Private Sellers. Except perhaps at gun shows, Connecticut does not regulate private sales and transfer of long guns. The gun show provision is unclear. The law requires people selling or otherwise transferring firearms at gun shows to comply with CGS § 29-36l (CGS § 29-37g(c)). But CGS § 29-36l contains procedures for verifying eligibility of people seeking to buy (1) handguns from anyone and anywhere in the state and (2) long guns from gun dealers anywhere in the state. It does not appear to apply to people buying long guns from private sellers at gun shows. Thus, it is unclear if private sellers of long guns at gun shows have to seek DESPP authorization for sales or transfers and whether such buyers have to undergo criminal history record checks.

The law contains no specific penalty for transferring long guns to ineligible persons or violating the transfer procedures (CGS § 29-37a).

 

Here is ATF on the subject:

6. May I lawfully ship a firearm to myself in a different State? Any person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in the care of another person in the State where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner “in the care of” the out-of-State resident. Upon reaching its destination, persons other than the owner must not open the package or take possession of the firearm.

SD

[DirtFarmer 1]

I travel through NY all the time with my firearms, I hear you on the bad reputation but I have a few people in high places that are friends so I’m not too worried about it. I go through Westchester County also instead of through NYC. I have a 38 revolver and shotgun that I would be taking ownership of so I am good there.


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[voyager9 3,434]

14 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Everything left to your Grandmother means the guns are hers you need a P2P and execute a COE for the long gun.   

I don’t think this is correct.  Why would you need a P2P for the long gun? Should be COE only since OP stated he has a FID  

if the grandmother (who is legal owner of the firearms) is not a NJ resident then the handgun has to be transferred through a NJ FFL, right?  Op would then need P2P and  Mom would ship it to the FFL and OP would take possession after a background check /transfer fee. 

[GRIZ 3,369]

9 minutes ago, tjs3023 said:

That answers the long gun, but what about the handgun? I would think that the op would need a handgun permit to take possession, so where is it best, or most legal to store it in the meantime - with the mother who has no fid, or the op, who does?

If the OP has dual residence in NJ and CT he needs a P2P and a COE if he wants the transfer to take place in NJ.

If the OP does not have dual residence but a FID with his CT address the long gun must be transferred through a FFL.  The mother can bring the long gun to the FFL in NJ and the transfer made there. It may also be shipped to a FFL in CT and the transfer made in CT.

If the OP does not have dual residence the handgun must be shipped to a CT FFL for transfer under CT laws.

Thousands of people travel through NY every day with firearms being transported under FOPA.  I don't hear all these horror stories about traveling through NYC everyone talks about.  I wouldn't worry about it if the OP is traveling through.

[voyager9 3,434]

14 minutes ago, tjs3023 said:

That answers the long gun, but what about the handgun? I would think that the op would need a handgun permit to take possession, so where is it best, or most legal to store it in the meantime - with the mother who has no fid, or the op, who does? Curious, as I an in a similar situation.

In OPs case it sounds like Mom/grandmom aren’t in NJ.  Grandmom legally owns the firearms until they can be transferred to him. Mom is the POA and can sign the transfer/COE. 

 

[GRIZ 3,369]

1 minute ago, voyager9 said:

I don’t think this is correct.  Why would you need a P2P for the long gun? Should be COE only since OP stated he has a FID  

if the grandmother (who is legal owner of the firearms) is not a NJ resident then the handgun has to be transferred through a NJ FFL, right?  Op would then need P2P and  Mom would ship it to the FFL and OP would take possession after a background check /transfer fee. 

My error I left out "for the handgun" after P2P.

I'm not clear if the Mother and Grandmother live in CT or NJ.  That would change most of what I said.

[voyager9 3,434]

3 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

If the OP has dual residence in NJ and CT he needs a P2P and a COE if he wants the transfer to take place in NJ.

If the OP does not have dual residence but a FID with his CT address the long gun must be transferred through a FFL.  The mother can bring the long gun to the FFL in NJ and the transfer made there. It may also be shipped to a FFL in CT and the transfer made in CT.

If the OP does not have dual residence the handgun must be shipped to a CT FFL for transfer under CT laws.

It sounded like Mom/Grandmom arenjn CT but OP is a NJ resident. I could be wrong. 

You did remind me that the long gun needs to go through a FFL if the above is correct.  It can be one in CT right?  They’ll look at you cross eyed when you hand them the NJ COE though

[GRIZ 3,369]

If the Mom and Grandmother live in CT and the OP is a NJ resident with FID, long gun can be transferred through CT FFL.  Handgun would have to be shipped to NJ FFL.  Most likely be cheaper to send handgun to NJ FFL via CT FFL.

[GRIZ 3,369]

Last time I stopped at a CT FFL and was interested in buying a long gun (like 19 years ago)  they had a 2 week waiting period for all guns.  Not an issue if you're going up there on a regular basis but doesn't allow you to take gun with you after purchase.

Ithe may be easier and faster if both guns are shipped to FFL in NJ.

[DirtFarmer 1]

My grandmother has legal residence in CT. My mom is a NJ resident. So technically my grandmother can sign over the shotgun to me with my mom as POA.


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[GRIZ 3,369]

35 minutes ago, DirtFarmer said:

My grandmother has legal residence in CT. My mom is a NJ resident. So technically my grandmother can sign over the shotgun to me with my mom as POA.


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Well...no.  Your grandmother owns the shotgun.  You need a FFL in CT to do the transfer or ship the shotgun to NJ to a FFL to do the transfer.  Your mother can bring the shotgun to a FFL in CT or ship it to a FFL in NJ.  Federal law doesn't allow transfer of long guns ftf to an out of state resident, only through a FFL.  Your mother acting as POA for your grandmother is acting as a CT resident.

The handgun must be sent to a FFL in NJ to be transferred to you.

Anything else is a violation of Federal, CT, and NJ law.

[DirtFarmer 1]

Gotcha. It gets all too confusing at times.


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[Smokin .50 1,907]

14 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Well...no.  Your grandmother owns the shotgun.  You need a FFL in CT to do the transfer or ship the shotgun to NJ to a FFL to do the transfer.  Your mother can bring the shotgun to a FFL in CT or ship it to a FFL in NJ.  Federal law doesn't allow transfer of long guns ftf to an out of state resident, only through a FFL.  Your mother acting as POA for your grandmother is acting as a CT resident.

The handgun must be sent to a FFL in NJ to be transferred to you.

Anything else is a violation of Federal, CT, and NJ law.

^^^^^THIS^^^^^

Now back in the last century, my Mom put my Dad's things on the dining room table & split them evenly among us three kids.  That's how I wound-up with a Ruger Super Blackhawk .357 Sixgun & lots of other "stuff".  No papers, just tears & hugs...

[Silence Dogood 468]

Virginia law application but the situation is similar, is it not?

http://johnpierceesq.com/what-to-do-if-you-inherit-firearms-located-in-another-state/

From 

1. U.S. Code › Title 18 › Part I › Chapter 44 › § 922

18 U.S. Code § 922 

It shall be unlawful 

(3). for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section, and (C) shall not apply to the transportation of any firearm acquired in any State prior to the effective date of this chapter;

 

Nope - reading further it's a gift, not an inheritance.  Good explanation of the difference: 

 

http://johnpierceesq.com/crossing-state-lines-with-inherited-and-gifted-firearms/

[mjrfd99 88]

Silent-- good link thanks.

Lots of hand me downs in the family.