S.446

[1LtCAP 4,263]

6 minutes ago, SW9racer said:

While we all agree with you, what would a "jury of your peers" say?  Would you bet it all on a sanfran outcome?

they will convict him. remember? most of our "peers" are nothing more than sheep. they will believe what they're told to believe by an overly emotional prosecutor.

[voyager9 3,434]

3 hours ago, USRifle30Cal said:

 Well no...but ur 100% right

 

I am annoyed and lashing out where I shouldn't be.

 

I still believe we need to focus more on our domestic issues .....   we need to pressure and ensure that the state organizations are ready to sue sue sue sue 

 

I better go.make a coffee. 

Agree there. Unfortunately I don’t see what the individual can do. Support Rallies?  Nope, legislature don’t listen.  Support candidates?  Sure, but they’re few and far between.   Support organizations?  Sure. But unless they themselves unite they’re on the fringe.  As you said, funding lawsuits and defense cases may be the only route available to us in the short term

[raz-0 1,259]

20 hours ago, capt14k said:

Well I do have a little experience with reading laws. Spent 2 years doing it. It's not something you easily forget.

 

Ask yourself this. Why is interstate commerce mentioned?

 

 

 

 

Interstate commerce is mentioned because that is the constitutional authority they claim gives them the ability to write such a law. 

You have a person crossing state lines for travel, and you have a gun which previous law claims all firearms are part of interstate commerce as manufactured goods shipped and sold. 

The grammatical structure implies that the "State of residence" clause is modifying the scope of who is affected, and not by the movement of the firearm. 

[capt14k 2,052]

Interstate commerce is mentioned because that is the constitutional authority they claim gives them the ability to write such a law. 

You have a person crossing state lines for travel, and you have a gun which previous law claims all firearms are part of interstate commerce as manufactured goods shipped and sold. 

The grammatical structure implies that the "State of residence" clause is modifying the scope of who is affected, and not by the movement of the firearm. 

Part one of your response is correct. Part two is not. If part two was correct it would have to ignore everything written from (1) to state of residence.

 

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[Fred2 367]

this article agrees with my interpretation....

(replace Ohio with NJ)

<snip>

Still, in theory, under the proposed legislation, a person who was denied a permit in his home state could seek a permit from another state to carry in his or her own state.

 

“There’s a grain of truth in that,” Kopel said, who noted that companion legislation in the Senate sponsored by Sen. John Cornyn (R-Tex.) more clearly states that it is for carrying outside one’s state of residence. “So a Texan can’t use a Mississippi permit in Texas,” he said.

Everytown argues the Senate version is equally harmful because, for instance, an Idaho permit would allow a resident of Ohio to carry in every state except Ohio.

[capt14k 2,052]

this article agrees with my interpretation.... (replace Ohio with NJ)

Still, in theory, under the proposed legislation, a person who was denied a permit in his home state could seek a permit from another state to carry in his or her own state.

  “There’s a grain of truth in that,” Kopel said, who noted that companion legislation in the Senate sponsored by Sen. John Cornyn (R-Tex.) more clearly states that it is for carrying outside one’s state of residence. “So a Texan can’t use a Mississippi permit in Texas,” he said.

Everytown argues the Senate version is equally harmful because, for instance, an Idaho permit would allow a resident of Ohio to carry in every state except Ohio.

 

 

Who wrote that article? On second thought who cares. Neither Bill will look the same after reconciliation.

 

 

Though this is a good example of why the courts often need to have the final word on what a law means. If laws were written in common English and layman turns there would be less need for lawyers, but lawyers write the laws thus insuring the need for them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Fred2 367]

53 minutes ago, capt14k said:

Who wrote that article? On second thought who cares. Neither Bill will look the same after reconciliation.

 

 

Though this is a good example of why the courts often need to have the final word on what a law means. If laws were written in common English and layman turns there would be less need for lawyers, but lawyers write the laws thus insuring the need for them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I thought I posted the link

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2017/12/12/pelosis-claim-the-house-gop-is-inviting-violent-criminals-to-carry-concealed-weapons/?utm_term=.9ee793dd4426

 

Anyway, the article was written by Fact Checker, and says Pelosi is pretty much full of it.

Amen on the lawyer part.

 

[brucin 923]

13 hours ago, SW9racer said:

While we all agree with you, what would a "jury of your peers" say?  Would you bet it all on a sanfran outcome?

Lets say this becomes law. Highly unlikely but possible. I carry in NJ and am questioned by LE. I present my CCW with my NY address. I present a NY non drivers ID with my NY address. I present my PA non-resident LTC with my NY address. I carry nothing with me linking me to NJ. How am I a resident of NJ?

I'll be attending a few gun law seminars in the next several weeks and will certainly question the hypothetical situation with the attorneys present.

13 hours ago, SW9racer said:

 

Edited December 14, 2017 by brucin
double post

[ChrisJM981 924]

Roy Moore has lost the Senate race, but hasn't yet conceded. I'm curious if the election of Democrat Doug Jones will affect the chances of S446 passing. 

[capt14k 2,052]

How do you have a NY CCW and PA LTC? Property in both states? If not please share the secret. I wouldn't mind a PA LTC for the next time a PA AG gets a wild hair and decides to end reciprocity with NH Non Resident.

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[CAL. .30 M1 2,101]

Saw this earlier this morning. ..

 

'If you are a law-abiding citizen in your home state and you have a permit to carry a firearm in your home state, you should be able to travel anywhere in the country and have that recognized.'

 

That is a push by yhe NRA - notice how the language has changed. 

 

 

[brucin 923]

14 hours ago, capt14k said:

How do you have a NY CCW and PA LTC? Property in both states? If not please share the secret. I wouldn't mind a PA LTC for the next time a PA AG gets a wild hair and decides to end reciprocity with NH Non Resident.

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I have a residence in NY.

While I was residing in NY on my way back to residing in NJ I stopped at the Lackawanna Co Sheriffs office and picked up a PA non-resident LTC. I gave them my NY CCW and My NY Non drivers ID card and for the bargain price of $20 I was issued my LTC

[capt14k 2,052]

I have a residence in NY.
While I was residing in NY on my way back to residing in NJ I stopped at the Lackawanna Co Sheriffs office and picked up a PA non-resident LTC. I gave them my NY CCW and My NY Non drivers ID card and for the bargain price of $20 I was issued my LTC

Thank you. PA only will issue Non-Resident LTC if you have a Resident CCW correct?

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[carl_g 568]

4 minutes ago, capt14k said:

Thank you. PA only will issue Non-Resident LTC if you have a Resident CCW correct?

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correct.

[brucin 923]

On 12/14/2017 at 9:21 PM, capt14k said:

Thank you. PA only will issue Non-Resident LTC if you have a Resident CCW correct?

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That's correct but the NY permit has my NY address on it. It is a resident permit. They don't differentiate whether you're a part time resident or not. Getting the NY non drivers ID card at the insistence of the judge who issued my permit is what seals the deal.

While in NY I'm a resident of NY. When I leave NY and present my credentials to another jurisdiction I'm still a resident of NY

[capt14k 2,052]

That's correct but the NY permit has my NY address on it. It is a resident permit. They don't differentiate whether you're a part time resident or not. Getting the NY non drivers ID card at the insistence of the judge who issued my permit is what seals the deal.
While in NY I'm a resident of NY. When I leave NY and present my credentials to another jurisdiction I'm still a resident of NY

I figured it had to have the NY address, but a question came up today. How does state income tax work? Being a dual resident in two states that have a state income tax do you have to pay income taxes to both states?

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[brucin 923]

55 minutes ago, capt14k said:

I figured it had to have the NY address, but a question came up today. How does state income tax work? Being a dual resident in two states that have a state income tax do you have to pay income taxes to both states?

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Lots of variables there. My accountant says the primary is what state did you earn the income in. I pay him to handle that.

[revenger 473]

Ammoland.com ran a story about this bill,  It was written by Larry Keane of the NSSF.  Once again there was that false statement that ALL 50 states now have a method to obtain a permit so everyone will be good.

I have started to send letters to these organizations to set the record straight on that, I'm getting so god damn tired of our own national  2A organizations constantly telling the rest of the U.S. that we can get permits.    HEY AMERICA ,  NEW JERSEY RESIDENTS HAVE NO AVENUE TO OBTAIN A CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  so at best its only 49 and I know there are others.      Hey,   ANJRPC ,  How about spreading the word  since your our nra affiliate 

[brucin 923]

11 minutes ago, revenger said:

Ammoland.com ran a story about this bill,  It was written by Larry Keane of the NSSF.  Once again there was that false statement that ALL 50 states now have a method to obtain a permit so everyone will be good.

I have started to send letters to these organizations to set the record straight on that, I'm getting so god damn tired of our own national  2A organizations constantly telling the rest of the U.S. that we can get permits.    HEY AMERICA ,  NEW JERSEY RESIDENTS HAVE NO AVENUE TO OBTAIN A CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  so at best its only 49 and I know there are others.      Hey,   ANJRPC ,  How about spreading the word  since your our nra affiliate 

There is an 'avenue" It's just that very few are allowed to drive on it.

[1LtCAP 4,263]

21 minutes ago, revenger said:

Ammoland.com ran a story about this bill,  It was written by Larry Keane of the NSSF.  Once again there was that false statement that ALL 50 states now have a method to obtain a permit so everyone will be good.

I have started to send letters to these organizations to set the record straight on that, I'm getting so god damn tired of our own national  2A organizations constantly telling the rest of the U.S. that we can get permits.    HEY AMERICA ,  NEW JERSEY RESIDENTS HAVE NO AVENUE TO OBTAIN A CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  so at best its only 49 and I know there are others.      Hey,   ANJRPC ,  How about spreading the word  since your our nra affiliate 

i don't think they're saying all 50 states citizens can actually get a permit, but rather that all 50 states allow it "on paper".

[Zeke 5,504]

My Zekey senses are tingling.... possibly tied into budget? Big media press lately