German Shepherd Dog

[Sniper 6,372]

On Wednesday, February 7, 2018 at 0:09 PM, 1LtCAP said:

 as mentioned, i'd considered a zap collar for her.....but if i can avoid it, i'd rather not. i'm not rich by any stretch, but i don't mind paying a good trainer to get her at least to the point where i could then take over, and that she'd listen to mom.

 

I saw a few mentions about E-collars in the thread, so I'll touch on my feelings on them. I used one on my last Lab, as there were a few "issues" I couldn't get her to respond to. The collar did end up working, but the process wasn't all that nice. We would use it in certain situations (like when loose out front of the house) to keep her "attention". Actually, I only had to use the stimulation part very rarely. The collar would start beeping a few seconds before the stimulation, and after a few seconds, then the stimulation would come. She learned that as soon as she heard the beep, she would immediately respond, so no shock.

In hindsight, the reason I went to the E-collar was because I WAS LAZY, and didn't spend the time to teach and train her. Once again, 95% of dog behavior issues are because of the owner/handler. I was trying to go the "quick" route instead of spending the correct time to teach her. That was MY fault, not hers.

I have a brand new E-collar sitting here for my new pup, but as of right now, refuse to use it. I was once again, going to try and take the "easy way" out, instead of working with him. For right now, it stays in the box. If he's not doing what I want him to do, it's MY fault for not leading him the correct direction. Not to say it won't come out later, but for right now, I'm not recommending it for anyone. I'm going to go the time, patience and teaching route first, I think that will have the longest lasting effect, instead of taking the quick route.

Also I know, sometimes, some stubborn dogs need a little extra "persuasion", so an E-collar can be a good added tool in the tool box, if used and applied correctly.

I know some personal professional trainers use E-collars, but I believe that's because they have limited training time, so they are trying to maximize and get the quickest response for the short time they have with the dog.

[Displaced Texan 11,742]

52 minutes ago, fishnut said:

Prong collers are good but I've seen better success with muzzle collars. Generally but that was not the case with one of my own dog

Easy now, dont insult wiener dogs 

Am I right? @Displaced Texan 

Weiner dawgs RULE!!!

[fishnut 2,358]

8 hours ago, Sniper22 said:

I saw a few mentions about E-collars in the thread, so I'll touch on my feelings on them. I used one on my last Lab, as there were a few "issues" I couldn't get her to respond to. The collar did end up working, but the process wasn't all that nice. We would use it in certain situations (like when loose out front of the house) to keep her "attention". Actually, I only had to use the stimulation part very rarely. The collar would start beeping a few seconds before the stimulation, and after a few seconds, then the stimulation would come. She learned that as soon as she heard the beep, she would immediately respond, so no shock.

In hindsight, the reason I went to the E-collar was because I WAS LAZY, and didn't spend the time to teach and train her. Once again, 95% of dog behavior issues are because of the owner/handler. I was trying to go the "quick" route instead of spending the correct time to teach her. That was MY fault, not hers.

I have a brand new E-collar sitting here for my new pup, but as of right now, refuse to use it. I was once again, going to try and take the "easy way" out, instead of working with him. For right now, it stays in the box. If he's not doing what I want him to do, it's MY fault for not leading him the correct direction. Not to say it won't come out later, but for right now, I'm not recommending it for anyone. I'm going to go the time, patience and teaching route first, I think that will have the longest lasting effect, instead of taking the quick route.

Also I know, sometimes, some stubborn dogs need a little extra "persuasion", so an E-collar can be a good added tool in the tool box, if used and applied correctly.

I know some personal professional trainers use E-collars, but I believe that's because they have limited training time, so they are trying to maximize and get the quickest response for the short time they have with the dog.

I could not agree more! E-collars have their place and can be effective. My buddy keeps on his bird dog when out in the field just in case the dog takes off towards a road or something like that. It also beeps when he is pointing a bird. 

[1LtCAP 4,262]

i've been seeing little cues that she may have been abused at some point. virtually every time i grab the broom to sweep up, she gets a very wary look, and sort of cowers. if i touch her collar in any way other than to clip the leash on, she cowers and gets that wary look.

 on to this morning.......took her for a morning walk.....was just going back into the house..she was still looking 'round on the front step.....guy's walking up the street with his dog. she went bats**t crazy. she slipped the leash. thank God, all she did was get in the dogs face and bark. at one point, i thought i saw the hair on her back standing up, but i was wrong, as when i called her, she came back into the yard. at first she wouldn't come to me though. i had to chase her again, and literally pin her to the ground to get her collar back on. i'm picking up a choker collar tonight.

 the rewards are working mainly for sit, and only sometimes for stay. she'll sit for mom, but mom still has to repeat 2x. for me it's instant. i'm doing what i can when i can, but i'm feeling more and more(especially in light of this mornings episode) that i'm gonna hafta go the trainer route at least for basic obedience. i don't want to risk her getting hurt because she doesn't know how to listen. i feel like a dick as it is, 'cause of the way i had to pin her to the ground this morning. when i got her in, i gave a quick look to make sure i didn't hurt her, and she looked fine....but i still feel bad that i had to do that.

[jackandjill 683]

I am sure someone covered it, in addition to all this training, its important to understand Dogs are social creatures (duh!). 

Smarter the Dog / Breed is, the more demanding their psychological needs are. That means you cannot just leave the dog alone after training, give occasional command and expect everything to work. 

Even our untrained mutt wants to put her brain to work everyday, brings rope toys to play tug of war, wants to play hide & seek, anticipate the game of throwing ball. And she whines and complains when we dont play or sit lazy. 

Consider all this if you are placing the Dog with someone who may not be up to the challenge. 

[xXxplosive 824]

True....our boy attends scent training class once a week...by the time the hour is over he is mentally spent and usually sleeps on the way home which he never does in the truck....then it's work, work, work, until the next class.....he loves it.

[jackandjill 683]

1 hour ago, 1LtCAP said:

.....the rewards are working mainly for sit, and only sometimes for stay. she'll sit for mom, but mom still has to repeat 2x. for me it's instant. ....

Definitely get her to training. For now, the trick to "sit"is, you stand, hold treat in the fist, get really closer to her and hand up. That puts the Dog into the situation of looking up and naturally back her into "sit" position as you get very close. Takes time. 

On that episode of running outside and having to pin her,  my suggestion is to be very aware and have full control before it gets out of control. 

[Sniper 6,372]

2 hours ago, 1LtCAP said:

i've been seeing little cues that she may have been abused at some point. virtually every time i grab the broom to sweep up, she gets a very wary look, and sort of cowers. if i touch her collar in any way other than to clip the leash on, she cowers and gets that wary look.

 

That sounds like her previous owner wasn't nice to her. It's going to take some time for her to trust you and reduce her fear level. What is the actual reason why she was available to adopt? I didn't see that in your original post.

Quote

she was still looking 'round on the front step.....guy's walking up the street with his dog. she went bats**t crazy. she slipped the leash. thank God, all she did was get in the dogs face and bark.

That is definitely a (lack of) a training and socialization issue with her previous owner. It sounds like she wasn't walked and exposed to many other dogs and people. That response can be fixed with training and focus. It will take some time. You should try keeping treats/rewards with you on the walk to get her to focus on you when she gets distracted.

Quote

at first she wouldn't come to me though. i had to chase her again, and literally pin her to the ground to get her collar back on. i'm picking up a choker collar tonight.

Sounds like she didn't get much exposure to walking outside. I'm guessing you have a flat standard collar on her. I would NOT go to the choker collar at this point. You definitely don't want her pulling out of the collar, put putting her into a choke collar without understanding why, she'll just jump and pull on it, which will put a lot of unnecessary force on her trachea and possibly hurt her. The best choice in this situation walking her outside would be the prong collar (and make sure you get the original German version, not a knock-off), but like I said previously, you absolutely need to use it and fit it correctly on her. This issue you're having is a 100% (lack of) training issue, and she needs to be re-taught the correct way to walk and interact with people and other dogs.

If you don't want to train with a prong collar at this time, another choice would be the Martingale slip collar. It's not as dangerous a choke collar, but not as corrective as a prong collar. Kinda midway, it will give a correction when pulled, but if fitted correctly, won't injure her trachea like a choke.

Quote

the rewards are working mainly for sit, and only sometimes for stay. she'll sit for mom, but mom still has to repeat 2x. for me it's instant.

That sounds like she sees you as true Alpha, but still isn't sure where mom fits in. Mom might need to be more "forceful" and show more dominance. That can happen with females. My wife has a little bit of an issue sometimes with my pup, since he knows I'm the Alpha but tries to cheat with her. If wifey ramps up her "profile", mr. pup realizes she means business.

Quote

i'm doing what i can when i can, but i'm feeling more and more(especially in light of this mornings episode) that i'm gonna hafta go the trainer route at least for basic obedience.

Another HUGE point, since you're working through these new commands with her. Everyone needs to follow the procedure EXACTLY the same every time when trying to get her to sit, stay, down, etc. I can't stress that enough. You all need to use the EXACT SAME verbal commands, the same hand signal, the same positioning, the same treat, etc. Each time a member of the family asks her to follow a cue, that cue has to be a carbon copy, no matter who's doing it. This eliminates confusion, and she is confused enough from her past home.

Quote

 that i'm gonna hafta go the trainer route at least for basic obedience. i don't want to risk her getting hurt because she doesn't know how to listen.

Great point, and that's exactly the issue. She's not sure what's going on, so it's going to take time, patience, training, and love to get her to where you want her. This ISN'T going to be solved in a week or two. You recognize it, so there is definite hope, it's going to take time.

I've even got a little bent out of shape with my 8 month old pup, feeling that he's not progressing as fast as I want. Wifey had to reel me back in to remind me he's still a puppy and to chill a little.

Quote

'cause of the way i had to pin her to the ground this morning. when i got her in, i gave a quick look to make sure i didn't hurt her, and she looked fine....but i still feel bad that i had to do that.

I've been in that situation too, but this is you showing the Alpha side, which is exactly what you have to do. She has to understand bad behavior has consequences. You ALWAYS have to be the Alpha and be prepared to ramp up the correction to what ever level it takes. Problems start when bad behavior is allowed to continue, even once.

 

[Sniper 6,372]

1 hour ago, jackandjill said:

I am sure someone covered it, in addition to all this training, its important to understand Dogs are social creatures (duh!).

Smarter the Dog / Breed is, the more demanding their psychological needs are. That means you cannot just leave the dog alone after training, give occasional command and expect everything to work.

 

Really great point. When training a dog, most people don't understand the psychological side of training. We assume the dog understands things the way WE do. The problem is, he's a dog, and understands things HIS way. The key to training is to approach it how a DOG understands daily activities and cues, not how HUMANS understand them.

Dogs also learn based on repetition and constant refreshing, and this repetition has to be exactly the same way EVERY time. Dogs have extremely short attention spans, so consistency and repetition on cues is extremely important.

[Sniper 6,372]

1 hour ago, xXxplosive said:

True....our boy attends scent training class once a week...by the time the hour is over he is mentally spent and usually sleeps on the way home which he never does in the truck....then it's work, work, work, until the next class.....he loves it.

Ha ha, yep, I can relate. We go to Advanced class once a week, working towards his next certification, and I also try to burn off some energy with my pup before we go to class, to keep him calm. Once the class is over, he just crashes and burns and won't move for the rest of the night. But the next day, it's balls to wall all over again.

[Sniper 6,372]

1 hour ago, jackandjill said:

Definitely get her to training. For now, the trick to "sit"is, you stand, hold treat in the fist, get really closer to her and hand up. That puts the Dog into the situation of looking up and naturally back her into "sit" position as you get very close. Takes time.

 

Great advice with the sit!

Using the treat to point over her head forces her back into the sitting direction. This is also where adding hand signals into the training comes into play. But, like I said above, all family members have to be doing this cue EXACTLY the same way to get the desired result. Position of the dog, the approach, the verbal cue, the hand movement, all have to be carbon copies by all family member. If every one has their own system and style, it will just confuse the dog, and will take longer to master.

Oh, and time, yep, it will take plenty of practice and time. But it will work in the end.

 

 

[JackDaWack 2,895]

13 hours ago, Sniper22 said:

I saw a few mentions about E-collars in the thread, so I'll touch on my feelings on them. I used one on my last Lab, as there were a few "issues" I couldn't get her to respond to. The collar did end up working, but the process wasn't all that nice. We would use it in certain situations (like when loose out front of the house) to keep her "attention". Actually, I only had to use the stimulation part very rarely. The collar would start beeping a few seconds before the stimulation, and after a few seconds, then the stimulation would come. She learned that as soon as she heard the beep, she would immediately respond, so no shock.

In hindsight, the reason I went to the E-collar was because I WAS LAZY, and didn't spend the time to teach and train her. Once again, 95% of dog behavior issues are because of the owner/handler. I was trying to go the "quick" route instead of spending the correct time to teach her. That was MY fault, not hers.

I have a brand new E-collar sitting here for my new pup, but as of right now, refuse to use it. I was once again, going to try and take the "easy way" out, instead of working with him. For right now, it stays in the box. If he's not doing what I want him to do, it's MY fault for not leading him the correct direction. Not to say it won't come out later, but for right now, I'm not recommending it for anyone. I'm going to go the time, patience and teaching route first, I think that will have the longest lasting effect, instead of taking the quick route.

Also I know, sometimes, some stubborn dogs need a little extra "persuasion", so an E-collar can be a good added tool in the tool box, if used and applied correctly.

I know some personal professional trainers use E-collars, but I believe that's because they have limited training time, so they are trying to maximize and get the quickest response for the short time they have with the dog.

No offense, but it doesn't sound like you are using the e-collar appropriately. You should be working and training the dog equally as much with or without the use of an e-collar. 

It's a training tool, much like a leash, with the intent to control the dog. Training the dog comes after the stimulation he receives through any technique you plan to use. I don't recommend any types of negative reinforcement as training.

[xXxplosive 824]

58 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

Ha ha, yep, I can relate. We go to Advanced class once a week, working towards his next certification, and I also try to burn off some energy with my pup before we go to class, to keep him calm. Once the class is over, he just crashes and burns and won't move for the rest of the night. But the next day, it's balls to wall all over again.

Oh yeah.....he's in training for his TD1 and your right.....the energy level just peaks after his R&R.

[capt14k 2,052]

For everyone so against the collars have you ever put one around your neck and let someone shock you? This way you know what it feels like and to what level to bring it. Keep in mind dog has hair or fur depending on breed which will make shock less painful for them.

 

 

I do not recommend the cheap (under $100) level 1-10 collars sold on Amazon. I bought one for a Shih Tzu and one time level 5 wouldn't even phase her and the next she would yipe and roll over. I put to my neck and 5 was worst than 10 and then would do nothing. It was returned. Get the ones with 99 levels that cost $300 ($200 with really good sales and Slickdeals). Those pictures online of Burns on dogs from collars are not burns but irritation from being on too long and at the wrong tension. Turning collar all the way up I couldn't burn my arm with it. It didn't tickle but it wasn't torture level pain

 

 

 

[George Yetka 17]

My parents have a german shepherd and one of the most important things for them is to keep her exercised. If she gets bored she gets in trouble

[JackDaWack 2,895]

11 minutes ago, capt14k said:

For everyone so against the collars have you ever put one around your neck and let someone shock you? This way you know what it feels like and to what level to bring it. Keep in mind dog has hair or fur depending on breed which will make shock less painful for them.

 

 

I do not recommend the cheap (under $100) level 1-10 collars sold on Amazon. I bought one for a Shih Tzu and one time level 5 wouldn't even phase her and the next she would yipe and roll over. I put to my neck and 5 was worst than 10 and then would do nothing. It was returned. Get the ones with 99 levels that cost $300 ($200 with really good sales and Slickdeals). Those pictures online of Burns on dogs from collars are not burns but irritation from being on too long and at the wrong tension. Turning collar all the way up I couldn't burn my arm with it. It didn't tickle but it wasn't torture level pain

 

 

 

When we moved into the new house it came with an in ground electric fence. I refuse to use it because of the lack of control. Also believe it's a negative reinforcement training style. After reading horrible reviews of e-fences I can say I would never use one, or leave my dog alone with an e-collar on. 

I agree, if your going to use it on ur dog, test it on yourself first. There is a lot of cheap crap out there. 

 

[1LtCAP 4,262]

2 hours ago, Sniper22 said:

That sounds like her previous owner wasn't nice to her. It's going to take some time for her to trust you and reduce her fear level. What is the actual reason why she was available to adopt? I didn't see that in your original post.

That is definitely a (lack of) a training and socialization issue with her previous owner. It sounds like she wasn't walked and exposed to many other dogs and people. That response can be fixed with training and focus. It will take some time. You should try keeping treats/rewards with you on the walk to get her to focus on you when she gets distracted.

Sounds like she didn't get much exposure to walking outside. I'm guessing you have a flat standard collar on her. I would NOT go to the choker collar at this point. You definitely don't want her pulling out of the collar, put putting her into a choke collar without understanding why, she'll just jump and pull on it, which will put a lot of unnecessary force on her trachea and possibly hurt her. The best choice in this situation walking her outside would be the prong collar (and make sure you get the original German version, not a knock-off), but like I said previously, you absolutely need to use it and fit it correctly on her. This issue you're having is a 100% (lack of) training issue, and she needs to be re-taught the correct way to walk and interact with people and other dogs.

If you don't want to train with a prong collar at this time, another choice would be the Martingale slip collar. It's not as dangerous a choke collar, but not as corrective as a prong collar. Kinda midway, it will give a correction when pulled, but if fitted correctly, won't injure her trachea like a choke.

That sounds like she sees you as true Alpha, but still isn't sure where mom fits in. Mom might need to be more "forceful" and show more dominance. That can happen with females. My wife has a little bit of an issue sometimes with my pup, since he knows I'm the Alpha but tries to cheat with her. If wifey ramps up her "profile", mr. pup realizes she means business.

Another HUGE point, since you're working through these new commands with her. Everyone needs to follow the procedure EXACTLY the same every time when trying to get her to sit, stay, down, etc. I can't stress that enough. You all need to use the EXACT SAME verbal commands, the same hand signal, the same positioning, the same treat, etc. Each time a member of the family asks her to follow a cue, that cue has to be a carbon copy, no matter who's doing it. This eliminates confusion, and she is confused enough from her past home.

Great point, and that's exactly the issue. She's not sure what's going on, so it's going to take time, patience, training, and love to get her to where you want her. This ISN'T going to be solved in a week or two. You recognize it, so there is definite hope, it's going to take time.

I've even got a little bent out of shape with my 8 month old pup, feeling that he's not progressing as fast as I want. Wifey had to reel me back in to remind me he's still a puppy and to chill a little.

I've been in that situation too, but this is you showing the Alpha side, which is exactly what you have to do. She has to understand bad behavior has consequences. You ALWAYS have to be the Alpha and be prepared to ramp up the correction to what ever level it takes. Problems start when bad behavior is allowed to continue, even once.

 

according to them, she needs to be the only dog. they've got 3 others, and she didn't get along with them. they said she wants all of the attention. i'm pretty sure this is all stemming from poor parenthood(for lack of a better term). it just strikes me as weird, 'cause the woman that i'm adopting her from seemed so loving and caring of her.

 i know it's not gonna happen in just a week or two. i'm putting in the time in the mornings and as soon as i get home every night. mom's working on her a little too. mostly just brushing her(she found a wire brush that kylie loves). i called her today, told her what happened, and asked her to look her over to be sure i didn't hurt her. i also told her to grab a handful of treats and work on the sit commands with her. i figured this way, she'll realize mom's the boss when i'm not there.

[capt14k 2,052]

When we moved into the new house it came with an in ground electric fence. I refuse to use it because of the lack of control. Also believe it's a negative reinforcement training style. After reading horrible reviews of e-fences I can say I would never use one, or leave my dog alone with an e-collar on. 
I agree, if your going to use it on ur dog, test it on yourself first. There is a lot of cheap crap out there. 
 

I wouldn't trust those fences either. Same for bark collars. The training collars you have full control.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

[Sniper 6,372]

2 hours ago, JackDaWack said:

No offense, but it doesn't sound like you are using the e-collar appropriately. You should be working and training the dog equally as much with or without the use of an e-collar.

It's a training tool, much like a leash, with the intent to control the dog. Training the dog comes after the stimulation he receives through any technique you plan to use. I don't recommend any types of negative reinforcement as training.

I mentioned that earlier, when I bought the first e-collar, it was because I wanted to take a short cut, and not train my dog the correct way. Live and learn, I now see, in hindsight, it's not the correct method, but a quick, less effort way to control a dog.

I agree, it's a specialized tool that needs to be applied to training the right way. It has to be fit the correct way, and the stimulation levels have to be correct. The dog needs to know beforehand what's expected of him, and the e-collar is used when he doesn't meet the expectation.

Unfortunately, most people just buy them, slap it on the dog, and shock away until the dog finally does what they want. That's a HORRIBLE way and lazy way to train a dog. We live in the "Instant Society" where people want instant and quick results on everything. Training a dog isn't a "instant" process.

 

[Sniper 6,372]

1 hour ago, capt14k said:

For everyone so against the collars have you ever put one around your neck and let someone shock you? This way you know what it feels like and to what level to bring it. Keep in mind dog has hair or fur depending on breed which will make shock less painful for them.

 

 

I agree, before putting it on a dog, the handler needs to know what it feels like at all stimulation levels. Also, the handler needs a "plan" on how it will be implemented. Many collars have different notifications, some beep, some vibrate before a stimulation is given. The goal is to only go to stimulation very rarely, and rely on the tone or vibration as a "reminder" to the dog. This is why I've said that basic repetitive training is more important, so the dog knows what you want him to do, using a tool like a E-collar as a last resort.

One clarification, if a dog has long fur, he won't feel the stimulation, the hair acts as an insulator, so saying it will be "less painful" is incorrect. He won't feel anything. Many collars come with different probes short and long, and they get changed based on the hair level. The probes have to be in firm contact with the skin. Sometimes, with long hair dogs, the hair has to be clipped or shaved at the location of the probes to make skin contact.

[Sniper 6,372]

2 hours ago, xXxplosive said:

Oh yeah.....he's in training for his TD1 and your right.....the energy level just peaks after his R&R.

Where are you taking him for that training? I've been trying to decide what direction to go with my pup after he gets this next certification. SAR was one area I was looking at.

Once he gets that training, what are you planning on doing with him with it?

[xXxplosive 824]

PM...........

[Sniper 6,372]

52 minutes ago, 1LtCAP said:

 i also told her to grab a handful of treats and work on the sit commands with her. i figured this way, she'll realize mom's the boss when i'm not there.

Ha ha, at least she'll know mom's a good food source

I actually believe in total treat/reward training in the early stages of training to consistently get the dog to pay attention and respond. You're in a little different situation, having a older dog, but the concepts are the same.

I've been having a discussion with my trainer about the regular use of treats, as I can also see the dog will get use to receiving them, and once the treat is removed, the dog can possibly stop responding. I switch back and forth, sometimes using treats, other times using a lot of praise. I know in the long run, I can always give praise, but I might not have treats available, so I'm trying to weed my pup off of expecting the treat.

Actually, the next test session for the next certification, treats aren't allowed, so we're working/practicing as much as possible without them. There are times when he just looks at me and I can read his mind as he says "you bast*rd, where's my treat". Ha ha, and my response, so sorry, that's why I'm in charge here.

[capt14k 2,052]

I agree, before putting it on a dog, the handler needs to know what it feels like at all stimulation levels. Also, the handler needs a "plan" on how it will be implemented. Many collars have different notifications, some beep, some vibrate before a stimulation is given. The goal is to only go to stimulation very rarely, and rely on the tone or vibration as a "reminder" to the dog. This is why I've said that basic repetitive training is more important, so the dog knows what you want him to do, using a tool like a E-collar as a last resort.

One clarification, if a dog has long fur, he won't feel the stimulation, the hair acts as an insulator, so saying it will be "less painful" is incorrect. He won't feel anything. Many collars come with different probes short and long, and they get changed based on the hair level. The probes have to be in firm contact with the skin. Sometimes, with long hair dogs, the hair has to be clipped or shaved at the location of the probes to make skin contact.

Yes the prongs being at the correct adjustment is important. Yes they will feel it if it is. Yes it is less painful than on a human with no protection. Yes you need the correct size collar for the dog. I don't know if I would shave the spot the prongs are going to be in contact with because then you will likely end up causing an irritation. Clipped or cut I would say is fine.

 

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

 

 

[1LtCAP 4,262]

haven't had chance to google....getting ready to get outta here. just saw a suv drive past. guardian k9 training. anyone heard of them? gonna google em when i get home tonight.....

[capt14k 2,052]

haven't had chance to google....getting ready to get outta here. just saw a suv drive past. guardian k9 training. anyone heard of them? gonna google em when i get home tonight.....

I found recent reviews of Shelley's and they pretty miserable. He was always a weasle when it came to money IMO, but now it seems his prices are even higher and he isn't even doing the training. Personally I thought he was a douchebag as a person, but he did get good results. If I were to use him I would make sure to get everything in writing and a guarantee of who the trainer is and their experience.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

[1LtCAP 4,262]

this is why i posted in here asking for advice. there's so much good stuff here, i'm probably gonna hafta go back and re-read most of what's here to digest it all.

[Sniper 6,372]

44 minutes ago, 1LtCAP said:

haven't had chance to google....getting ready to get outta here. just saw a suv drive past. guardian k9 training. anyone heard of them? gonna google em when i get home tonight.....

Just looked at that web site. interesting, the trainer has prong collars on the dogs she's training.

[Sniper 6,372]

23 minutes ago, 1LtCAP said:

this is why i posted in here asking for advice. there's so much good stuff here, i'm probably gonna hafta go back and re-read most of what's here to digest it all.

Nothing for nothing, but I'm taking my pup to Petsmart for training classes. Some would consider that amature hour, but I really didn't go there to learn how to train a dog. I went there to expose my pup to all the adventures of the store. Much of the training takes place in the aisles of the store.

It's a great place to socialize the dog, with all the dogs and owners in class, then add in all the distraction with other shoppers and dogs, all the noise, all the store workers, and shelves of products. Try getting your dog to concentrate on what you want him to do while walking down the food aisle or toy aisle, or when a shopper and dog pass by.

Something to consider.

[virpacalis 1]

Trainers, pro or otherwise, who have proven experience changing dogs' behaviors, are worth considering. There are effective trainers at K9 Basics in Marlton too.