Gun Control Imminent In...Vermont!?!

[Indianajonze 379]

Well now I'm ready to admit there's a gathering storm coming. Yesterday Vermont house passed s.55, a sweeping gun control bill complete with bump stock bans, expanded background checks, raising age to 21 and mag capacity bans. Full expected to pass the Senate and their governor says he'll sign.

 

I've changed my mind. This is getting bad folks...

 

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[Alex V 99]

Vermont has always puzzled me, its full of leftist hippy types but yet they were pretty good on gun laws.  This doesn't surprise me at all.  They have not voted for a Republican POTUS since 1988 (same as NJ) 

If this stupidity passed in Oklahoma or Wyoming, then it's time to worry.  Seeing a blue state fold is nothing special.

[Indianajonze 379]

Have you ever been? Vermont is not a blue state for guns. Constitutional carry there, no restrictions on anything. Guns are simply a way of life.

[CAL. .30 M1 2,101]

This is already being discussed and while it is very traumatic and a bad push it is nothing like what is going on elsewhere - VT gun folks have a handle on it i *think* and are fighting it - will they win - looks like know because they sat on their laurels...  I do not think they will do that again.

[Alex V 99]

15 minutes ago, Indianajonze said:

Have you ever been? Vermont is not a blue state for guns. Constitutional carry there, no restrictions on anything. Guns are simply a way of life.

Yes, I have, that's why I said it's always puzzled me.  They are a bunch of hippies, but yet somehow, guns everywhere.  That is why this does not surprise me. 

[Indianajonze 379]

Well I'm shocked. To me it's a perfect example of why it's a huge mistake to point and laugh if you're in a gun friendly state and you read about the nonsense in NJ, CA, NY, etc. These people are like locusts. Vt has had a huge influx of NY/,NJ gun grabbers. This is the result. All indications are it will pass the Senate. I hope they prevail, but I just don't know anymore. It's looking more and more like our only hope is going to be the courts

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[Alex V 99]

2 minutes ago, Indianajonze said:

Well I'm shocked. To me it's a perfect example of why it's a huge mistake to point and laugh if you're in a gun friendly state and you read about the nonsense in NJ, CA, NY, etc. These people are like locusts. Vt has had a huge influx of NY/,NJ gun grabbers. This is the result. All indications are it will pass the Senate. I hope they prevail, but I just don't know anymore. It's looking more and more like our only hope is going to be the courts

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The courts offer to relief.  When was the last time SCOTUS agreed to hear a 2A case? 

How can it be a shock when the state has been blue for decades?  It was an anomaly, a consistently  blue state with good gun laws.   They have flip-flopped on governors every time since the 60's.  Rep-Dem-Rep-Dem... they are all over the place. 

[Bob2222 316]

Small state (pop 624,594) with a bimodal population. Farms, logging, tourism ( tourists don't vote) and colleges/universities.

The tax foundation ranks Vermont at #11 for State-Local Tax Burdens. It's above Massachusetts. Not very conservative from the tax standpoint.

It's been almost weirdly libertarian about guns, but I guess it's mostly because they've been leaving the farmers and hunters (many from out of state) alone and the state has a homicide rate that's among the lowest of any state. Why fix a problem if you don't have a problem?

I'd start to worry if Texas does this.

[Zeke 5,504]

6 minutes ago, Bob2222 said:

Small state (pop 624,594) with a bimodal population. Farms, logging, tourism ( tourists don't vote) and colleges/universities.

The tax foundation ranks Vermont at #11 for State-Local Tax Burdens. It's above Massachusetts. Not very conservative from the tax standpoint.

It's been almost weirdly libertarian about guns, but I guess it's mostly because they've been leaving the farmers and hunters (many from out of state) alone and the state has a homicide rate that's among the lowest of any state. Why fix a problem if you don't have a problem?

I'd start to worry if Texas does this.

Unfortunately Texas has a steady stream of people leaving California. As does PA with NJ and NY residents.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

STAND AND FIGHT.  You can't always run away - there will be no place to run to anymore.

[Alex V 99]

2 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

STAND AND FIGHT.  You can't always run away - there will be no place to run to anymore.

Yes and no.  Sometimes you need to retreat in order to consolidate forces and press the fight back.  Like the Soviets did when they moved all their industry east of the Ural mountains only to come back and take the Nazi flag off of the Reichstag.

There just aren't enough people willing to fight in some places. 

[WhiskeyTangoFoxtrot 358]

Millennials....

[Krdshrk 3,877]

9 minutes ago, Alex V said:

Yes and no.  Sometimes you need to retreat in order to consolidate forces and press the fight back.  Like the Soviets did when they moved all their industry east of the Ural mountains only to come back and take the Nazi flag off of the Reichstag.

There just aren't enough people willing to fight in some places. 

Truth - We have the numbers here in NJ to stand and fiight.

Vermont, while it's my original home and where I grew up, I never considered to be one of the 2A Sanctuaries - it was always just too hippie liberal and now things are getting worse there.

[Alex V 99]

9 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

Truth - We have the numbers here in NJ to stand and fiight.

Vermont, while it's my original home and where I grew up, I never considered to be one of the 2A Sanctuaries - it was always just too hippie liberal and now things are getting worse there.

I really don't think NJ has enough of us to fight and every day the number is less and less.  Let's say it wasn't for the guns, I would still be moving out because I don't want to pay $15K in property taxes when I don't have kids and never plan on any, negating my need for public schools.  

How many people showed up to the rally?  500?  I can only go by the photos.  I didn't go, I will readily admit it, but neither did 999,500 other NJ gun owners. We don't have the numbers for a fight which involves legislative means of reversing unconstitutional practices.  

[Krdshrk 3,877]

3 minutes ago, Alex V said:

How many people showed up to the rally?  500?  I can only go by the photos.  I didn't go, I will readily admit it, but neither did 999,500 other NJ gun owners. We don't have the numbers for a fight which involves legislative means of reversing unconstitutional practices.  

NJSP said 2000.  Way more than 500.  If you had a legitimate excuse to not go, fine... But if you just plain didn't go, and are already giving up, you're not helping at all.

[Alex V 99]

2 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

NJSP said 2000.  Way more than 500.  If you had a legitimate excuse to not go, fine... But if you just plain didn't go, and are already giving up, you're not helping at all.

I'm using the rest of my vacation time this year to take two Costa training classes in Aug/Sep and to look at property and interview for jobs in NC.  ;-)  That's legit enough for me lol. 

Photos didn't look like 2,000 but lets hope it was.  

[Guest]

I think the Mag Cap ban in VT is merely smoke and mirrors because they're grandfathering 30 round mags. No way to prove when you bought them and it's only a short trip to New Hampshire or Maine to buy more.

[SW9racer 262]

39 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

Truth - We have the numbers here in NJ to stand and fiight.

 

You don’t have the governor, you don’t have the legislature, and the schools are pumping out thousands of D voters every year. 

[Guest]

 

29 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

NJSP said 2000.  Way more than 500.  If you had a legitimate excuse to not go, fine... But if you just plain didn't go, and are already giving up, you're not helping at all.

Not that I want to politicize this thread, but from my observations of the NRA as a whole, their contributions going towards law suits that more often than not don't get ruled in gun owners favor is a stretch for fighting for our rights. Politicians will pass laws with impunity regardless of our stance because at this point, it's too late for us once they're in office. I also think as a state we fucked ourselves back in the 90's when we compromised on the FID, because it's probably turned away even more law abiding citizens than criminals from the interest of owning a gun and leaving us with less support than we should.

In my opinion instead of using the money to fight for our rights, I rather see them use that money to actually preserve our rights. We can all agree the NICS system isn't perfect but to further expand background checks would infringe on other constitutional rights. There will be no way in hell that gun owners are willing to give up their other constitutional rights to own a gun. We know Illegal guns aren't want the gun grabbers are coming at us about it's that it seems like a reoccuring theme of people slipping through the cracks because doctors or law enforcement agencies aren't doing their job of reporting issues to NICS which in turn these whackos end up buying a gun when they shouldn't be. So I had an idea that either the ATF or FBI employs a force of commit-compliance officials across the country that frequently visit health clinics and law enforcement agencies, provide a training platform on how to report said issues periodically (once a year, twice a year etc.) so these people remember to do their job and on top of it, perform audits on these agencies to make sure they are reporting issues to NICS. Would it infringe on HIPAA rights and privacy rights? probably but if the gun grabbers want something done, that's the compromise they'll have to make, not us. We as gun owners have compromised time and time again for those assholes and they provide us with overly redundant laws. Now where the NRA plays a role in this is they should be the ones funding and developing said training for entrusted personnel around the country and providing the payroll for CC officials, rather than tax payer money. I'm willing to bet they would even get non gun owners to join the NRA for $40/year if their money went towards this cause, and probably get more people in to guns if they put in a physical effort to ensure that our current system works. Just an idea and i'll get off my soap box now.

I think we can all agree that the current NICS system in place works, but only works if all parties involved do their job and any other option for a serious change will be ridiculous on us as gun owners. I'm just saying if their stance is the 2nd amendment is fine as is the gun grabbers will always see cracks in that argument unless the NRA or pro-gun politicians propose some way to ensure what's in place works. *gets off soap box*

[Zeke 5,504]

31 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

NJSP said 2000.  Way more than 500.  If you had a legitimate excuse to not go, fine... But if you just plain didn't go, and are already giving up, you're not helping at all.

You are either part of the solution, or part of the problem. It’s really that simple.

[Alex V 99]

It's almost as if the powers that be WANT to let people slip through the cracks and commit these atrocities in order to provide reason to deprive the rest of us of our rights....

2 minutes ago, Zeke said:

You are either part of the solution, or part of the problem. It’s really that simple.

That only works if we all agree on what the solution is.

[Zeke 5,504]

2 minutes ago, Alex V said:

It's almost as if the powers that be WANT to let people slip through the cracks and commit these atrocities in order to provide reason to deprive the rest of us of our rights....

That only works if we all agree on what the solution is.

Lead, follow, or stfu.. it’s not a cheerocracy 

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Alex V said:

It's almost as if the powers that be WANT to let people slip through the cracks and commit these atrocities in order to provide reason to deprive the rest of us of our rights....

 

a large number of public pension's in this country their portfolios invest in the weapons industry. there was an article yesterday that New Jersey withdrew their investments in weapons companies for theirs. When they see their already struggling portfolio struggle even more, that's when they'll reinvest and also why gun control will never happen nationally.

[Zeke 5,504]

Just now, JR88USMC said:

a large number of public pension's in this country their portfolios invest in the weapons industry. there was an article yesterday that New Jersey withdrew their investments in weapons companies for theirs. When they see their already struggling portfolio struggle even more, that's when they'll reinvest and also why gun control will never happen nationally.

NJ , VT, CA are Petri dish experiments for the DNC. Gone are the days of our elected representatives looking out for the electorate. It’s agenda now. That I see in plain view.

[Guest]

California has a secession on their plate with New California. You know it's bad when 80% of the states counties feel misrepresented.

[xXxplosive 823]

We can always ask their spokesperson Ms. Clinton.....Rutgers is paying her 25K to speak today on campus.

[Alex V 99]

1 minute ago, Zeke said:

Lead, follow, or stfu.. it’s not a cheerocracy 

You can't lead if too few agree with your direction, you can't follow if you disagree with the direction others are going. 

4 minutes ago, xXxplosive said:

We can always ask their spokesperson Ms. Clinton.....Rutgers is paying her 25K to speak today on campus.

Only $25K?  Man her quote fell now that she doesn't have Uranium to sell. 

[Bob2222 316]

38 minutes ago, JR88USMC said:

a large number of public pension's in this country their portfolios invest in the weapons industry. there was an article yesterday that New Jersey withdrew their investments in weapons companies for theirs. When they see their already struggling portfolio struggle even more, that's when they'll reinvest and also why gun control will never happen nationally.

Quote

In 2017, Pfizer [manufacturer of Viagra] came to around 52.5 billion U.S. dollars of revenue. Pfizer is the world's largest company based on pure pharmaceutical (Rx drugs) revenue.

Compared to many other industries, civilian firearms don't seem to be a very large market.

For one thing, they last a very long time. 100+ year old firearms can still function as firearms.

[Zeke 5,504]

22 minutes ago, Alex V said:

You can't lead if too few agree with your direction, you can't follow if you disagree with the direction others are going. 

 

But you can stfu.. 

Constructive criticism is a dish best served whilst working hand in hand to fix the problem. Jus being a apthous stomatitis isn’t helping anyone.

[Scorpio64 5,147]

1 hour ago, Alex V said:

You can't lead if too few agree with your direction, you can't follow if you disagree with the direction others are going. 

Lead, follow or get out of the way. 

Please, if you are not going to lead or follow, well.... you know.  Whining like a child and disparaging others for their beliefs and efforts is unhelpful.  You are basically a troll.  Either get on board with some productive input or just get lost.  Your attempts at sapping morale around here is unwelcome.