It's tough to buy a gun in New Jersey. So where do all the guns used in crimes come from?

[capt14k 2,052]

Full auto IS 100% legal in many (if not most) US states in 2018!
The NFA (National Firearms Act of 1934) levied a $200 tax (which was a lot of money at the time) on the manufacture or sale of machine guns and sawed-off shotguns.
So $200, requires a background check, etc. and like anything that might be fun in New Jersey, don't even think about it here.
Legal in PA, that state just across the river and visible from the NJ Capitol building in Trenton.
What the Reagan era bill (Firearm Owners' Protection Act of 1986 - FOPA) did was prohibit the sale of NEWLY MANUFACTURED fully-automatic firearms to the public (thereby making legally owned ones with paperwork an excellent investment).

You can technically own full auto in N.J. as well. Same process as CCW.


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[Bob2222 316]

Just now, capt14k said:

 

You can technically own full auto in N.J. as well. Same process as CCW.


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Exactly!

(I enjoy the guides that say the full-auto and CCW are legal in NJ! Technically true. However, the state doesn't follow its own laws and regulations. But unlike us mere citizen taxpayers, nobody can send the state to prison.)

[slickskin 11]

4 hours ago, gleninjersey said:

Florida, Virginia Tech and I believe the CA shooter all used 10 round msgs.  Newton killer murdered his mother and stole her guns.  Vegas shooter passed every background check for every purchase.  

How many mass killings and school shootings were there before the instant background check existed.  Let me give you a hint.  A lot less.

The AR platform has been around for close to 60 years.  Why were they not used in school shootings & mass shooting up until the last 20 years ago? 

Full auto used to be 100% legal not too long ago (1986).  How many mass shootings were done with full auto rifles?  None that I'm aware of.

The problem isn't the guns or "large mags".   

I guess the theory behind magazine restrictions is it means you'll have to stop to reload more often and maybe during that time someone can overpower you and take the gun away or make a run for it and escape. Whether or not this is true, I admit I don't know. But my problem with more restrictions is more follow and they chip away slightly. Before it was let's reduce magazine size to 15, and now it's 10. Maybe in a few years they'll say actually I think you only need 6. 

[Mrs. Peel 7,156]

25 minutes ago, slickskin said:

I guess the theory behind magazine restrictions is it means you'll have to stop to reload more often and maybe during that time someone can overpower you and take the gun away or make a run for it and escape. Whether or not this is true, I admit I don't know. But my problem with more restrictions is more follow and they chip away slightly. Before it was let's reduce magazine size to 15, and now it's 10. Maybe in a few years they'll say actually I think you only need 6. 

Every theory about guns can be quickly flipped on it's head... suppose 2 guys have broken into your home. There's a exchange of gunfire. According to the theory you've mentioned above... well, that could work this way >>> as YOU (innocent homeowner) attempt to swap out your now-neutered magazine which holds fewer rounds, they can overpower YOU, take YOUR gun away and then another gun goes onto the black market, where it's passed around and used to hurt other innocent people.

And this is why focusing on the "tool" rather than the "criminal intent" is always foolish.

[gleninjersey 2,139]

10 hours ago, capt14k said:

I hate to give anything to the other side but McDonald's Massacre was full auto. One of the only ones, but they used it to take away full auto while the NRA did nothing to stop it.

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Better to be truthful than appear to be hiding facts.

So one incident of full auto used in mass murder of innocent people.  Rather incredible given full auto had been available for well over half a century.  

 

[gleninjersey 2,139]

8 hours ago, Bob2222 said:

Full auto IS 100% legal in many (if not most) US states in 2018!

The NFA (National Firearms Act of 1934) levied a $200 tax (which was a lot of money at the time) on the manufacture or sale of machine guns and sawed-off shotguns.

So $200, requires a background check, etc. and like anything that might be fun in New Jersey, don't even think about it here.

Legal in PA, that state just across the river and visible from the NJ Capitol building in Trenton.

What the Reagan era bill (Firearm Owners' Protection Act of 1986 - FOPA) did was prohibit the sale of NEWLY MANUFACTURED fully-automatic firearms to the public (thereby making legally owned ones with paperwork an excellent investment).

You are correct.  I should had said widely available to anyone.

Full auto is still legal in most of the country.  Though very cost prohibitive due to the laws and scarcity of firearms.  I believe (and this is mostly a guess) that it easily costs at least $10k to legslly purchase a full auto rifle.  Probably closer to $20k.

[gleninjersey 2,139]

6 hours ago, slickskin said:

I guess the theory behind magazine restrictions is it means you'll have to stop to reload more often and maybe during that time someone can overpower you and take the gun away or make a run for it and escape. Whether or not this is true, I admit I don't know. But my problem with more restrictions is more follow and they chip away slightly. Before it was let's reduce magazine size to 15, and now it's 10. Maybe in a few years they'll say actually I think you only need 6. 

NY tried five round limit I believe and it was struck down.  I also believe NJ lawmakers had proposed 5 round limit but Christie vetoed or never made It's way out of committee.

Ultimately they would you to have no firearms.

[capt14k 2,052]

You are correct.  I should had said widely available to anyone. Full auto is still legal in most of the country.  Though very cost prohibitive due to the laws and scarcity of firearms.  I believe (and this is mostly a guess) that it easily costs at least $10k to legslly purchase a full auto rifle.  Probably closer to $20k.

 

 

Full auto AK $16k full auto M-16 $40k full auto M-60 $60k.

 

Tek9 and MAC10 are cheapest full anything at $7k

 

H&K auto sears alone were selling $30k at last RIA

 

 

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[DeerSlayer 241]

 Full auto AK $16k full auto M-16 $40k full auto M-60 $60k.
 
Tek9 and MAC10 are cheapest full anything at $7k
 
H&K auto sears alone were selling $30k at last RIA
 
 
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You can get a transferable AC556 in full auto (full auto Mini 14) for around $7k and if you shop sometimes you can find one for around $5k.

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[capt14k 2,052]

You can get a transferable AC556 in full auto (full auto Mini 14) for around $7k and if you shop sometimes you can find one for around $5k.

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I am surprised they are so cheap since there is less than 5 months worth of them that are transferable. I honestly never heard of one, but I will keep it in mind as my third purchase when I leave this hell hole.


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[JC_68Westy 1,024]

12 hours ago, capt14k said:

I hate to give anything to the other side but McDonald's Massacre was full auto. One of the only ones, but they used it to take away full auto while the NRA did nothing to stop it.

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I do not believe that the shooter in the San Ysidro McDonalds shooting used any fully auto guns.  He had a 9mm Browning HP pistol, 12GA Winchester pump and semi auto uzi carbine.

 

[DeerSlayer 241]

They were issued to slews of police departments prior to 1986. Literally thousands of them out there. They have almost all been taken out if service decades ago and sold off to class 3 dealers or traded in for more modern rifles. They're probably the cheapest way to break into the FA game in a free state. The cool part is that it's 5.56, and has triple selector, FA. 3round burst, and single semi. Definitely a cool gun.

I am surprised they are so cheap since there is less than 5 months worth of them that are transferable. I honestly never heard of one, but I will keep it in mind as my third purchase when I leave this hell hole.


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[HBecwithFn7 296]

2 hours ago, capt14k said:

 

Full auto AK $16k full auto M-16 $40k full auto M-60 $60k.

 

Tek9 and MAC10 are cheapest full anything at $7k

 

H&K auto sears alone were selling $30k at last RIA

 

 

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Just out of curiosity, what about a Thompson with drum mags (i.e. "Chicago Typewriter")?...

[capt14k 2,052]

Just out of curiosity, what about a Thompson with drum mags (i.e. "Chicago Typewriter")?...

I believe they are also in that $60k range.

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[capt14k 2,052]

They were issued to slews of police departments prior to 1986. Literally thousands of them out there. They have almost all been taken out if service decades ago and sold off to class 3 dealers or traded in for more modern rifles. They're probably the cheapest way to break into the FA game in a free state. The cool part is that it's 5.56, and has triple selector, FA. 3round burst, and single semi. Definitely a cool gun.


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Even if issued before 1986 to police how were they registered? Were they sold to dealers before May 1986?

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[capt14k 2,052]

 

Seems we have another Mandela effect. I could have sworn it was full auto. I know Ed McMahon brought the check to the door and Tank Boy was squished. Though Mandela didn't die in prison.

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[DeerSlayer 241]

Even if issued before 1986 to police how were they registered? Were they sold to dealers before May 1986?

 

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They were. They literally gave them away.

 

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[capt14k 2,052]

They were. They literally gave them away.  
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Thank you for the info. I really didn't want to spend $20k+ but I will spend $7k.

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[DeerSlayer 241]

Check gun broker and Arms list. There's usually one or two on there at any time.

Thank you for the info. I really didn't want to spend $20k+ but I will spend $7k.

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[voyager9 3,432]

3 hours ago, gleninjersey said:

NY tried five round limit I believe and it was struck down.  I also believe NJ lawmakers had proposed 5 round limit but Christie vetoed or never made It's way out of committee.

Ultimately they would you to have no firearms.

There is a 5-round bill that has been introduced already..