Looking to get an OU

[jm1827 284]

Thinking about getting an O/U for clays and some pheasant, budget is limited so I was thinking about either a CZ Teal or Mossberg Silver Reserve, leaning toward 20 ga.

Any concerns with either?  Any one stand out?

 

Thanks!

[Ms. 12 Gauge 95]

Have you had the chance to test drive either? You may like the fit or swing of one over the other.

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[W2MC 1,699]

Check with crdshrk - I think he has a Mossberg o/u

 

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Fitment is definitely a thing.  I have a Mossberg Silver Reserve II in 12ga and it's great.  Light, fits me well, swings great.  

My Beretta S686 Essential fits me just as nice and I'm actually liking it even more than my Mossberg.  It's just smoother. 

You also have to consider if you want Ejectors or Extractors.  My Mossberg SRII has Extractors.  It works fine.  My S686 has Ejectors.  If you're not careful, you can eject the shells right into your face.  

[fishnut 2,358]

What't your budget? You might want to consider a used gun. I was in the same boat 2 yrs ago and ended up with a lightly used FN made Winchester 101 and could not be happier. A few weeks layer I found a used citori for 800 bucks that my buddy bought and he is really happy with that too. 

I looked at and shot both the guns you mentioned and although there is nothing wrong with either I did not like them. The fit and finish on both could be better but that's what you get at that price point

[W2MC 1,699]

Another thought

If your goal is clays and peasants, don't discount pumps; and particularly semi autos, if you're just looking to get your feet wet.  Either will get you started at a lower price than an o/u.   

[Scorpio64 5,146]

Both the CZ and the Mossberg are Turkish guns.  The quality will be about the same.  I've heard both good and not so good about both but I would lean more towards the CZ just because I think they look a little nicer and they have a great warranty.

It kinda bothers me when people say their budget is limited.  Okay, my budget is limited too, but it does not limit what I buy, I just save longer.  If you really want a good OU, you would be better off waiting for a used Browning to pop up somewhere at a decent price.

Here's another thing (devil's advocate).  You may do just fine (or well enough) with a Turkish made gun  .A $2,000.00 Citori won't make you a better shooter, it will help good shooters hit more clays.  The difference between a Browning and a Mossberg, for an average shooter, will be hitting 16 out of 25 instead of 15 out of 25.

Here's what's going to happen if you buy a Turkish gun.  You will shoot some clays, you will have fun, and you will constantly be thinking "gee, I wish this was a Browning.".  The difference in price between a new CZ and a used Browning will be anywhere from 300 to 500 depending on the grade of the Browning.  Most folks that own Brownings take care of them, so it's not likely you will find a lemon.

As W2MC suggested, OU is not the end all be all of clay guns. Many trap shooters use semi-autos to great effect.  One nice thing about a semi-auto is you can swap barrels.  A longer 32 or 34 inch bbl for clays and a 28 inch bbl for the field.  Recoil seems to be softer in semi autos too.

12ga vs 20ga.  20ga will be a handicap shooting clays.  If you are a good shot, you will certainly break some clays with a 20ga, but you will break more with a 12ga.  You will also get more pheasant.

Lastly, My philosophy about my limited budget is that I can't afford to buy junk, so I buy used premium stuff that some rich dude paid out the ass for, and got bored with.

I don't know how much of a hurry you are in to buy an OU, but if we happen to be at a shotgun shoot at the same time, you are more than welcome to try my Citori 12GA.

[Ms. 12 Gauge 95]

Both the CZ and the Mossberg are Turkish guns.  The quality will be about the same.  I've heard both good and not so good about both but I would lean more towards the CZ just because I think they look a little nicer and they have a great warranty.
It kinda bothers me when people say their budget is limited.  Okay, my budget is limited too, but it does not limit what I buy, I just save longer.  If you really want a good OU, you would be better off waiting for a used Browning to pop up somewhere at a decent price.
Here's another thing (devil's advocate).  You may do just fine (or well enough) with a Turkish made gun  .A $2,000.00 Citori won't make you a better shooter, it will help good shooters hit more clays.  The difference between a Browning and a Mossberg, for an average shooter, will be hitting 16 out of 25 instead of 15 out of 25.
Here's what's going to happen if you buy a Turkish gun.  You will shoot some clays, you will have fun, and you will constantly be thinking "gee, I wish this was a Browning.".  The difference in price between a new CZ and a used Browning will be anywhere from 300 to 500 depending on the grade of the Browning.  Most folks that own Brownings take care of them, so it's not likely you will find a lemon.
As W2MC suggested, OU is not the end all be all of clay guns. Many trap shooters use semi-autos to great effect.  One nice thing about a semi-auto is you can swap barrels.  A longer 32 or 34 inch bbl for clays and a 28 inch bbl for the field.  Recoil seems to be softer in semi autos too.
12ga vs 20ga.  20ga will be a handicap shooting clays.  If you are a good shot, you will certainly break some clays with a 20ga, but you will break more with a 12ga.  You will also get more pheasant.
Lastly, My philosophy about my limited budget is that I can't afford to buy junk, so I buy used premium stuff that some rich dude paid out the ass for, and got bored with.
I don't know how much of a hurry you are in to buy an OU, but if we happen to be at a shotgun shoot at the same time, you are more than welcome to try my Citori 12GA.

Well said! I started clays with my pump. A Remington 870. It was like showing up to the prom in the work truck. It wasn't as pretty or fancy as the Caesar Guerini's in the group, but with enough practice my scores improved. I saved up and decided to go semi-auto: Beretta A400. Softer recoiling, quicker shooting and more versatile/ capable of holding more shells. Everyone says I NEED an O/U, but until I'm ready to invest in a pricier firearm, I've got one that can be useful in different situations.

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[fishnut 2,358]

As others have said pumps and semis are fine for clays but having 2 barrels with a mod or skeet and full choke can be an advantage when hunting pheasants. If you miss with the first shot you can reach out a little farther with the full choke or if one gets up a little farther out you can (in theory) switch quickly to the full choke. 

I still do take my old beat up mossy 500 out when it' raining and it can kill pheasents and clays no problem but the few times ive shot 5 stand with the rich guys I get a few funny looks when I break out the mossy. That goes away when I shoot better than the majority of the guys there with the cheapest beat up gun. 

[Krdshrk 3,877]

38 minutes ago, fishnut said:

As others have said pumps and semis are fine for clays but having 2 barrels with a mod or skeet and full choke can be an advantage when hunting pheasants. If you miss with the first shot you can reach out a little farther with the full choke or if one gets up a little farther out you can (in theory) switch quickly to the full choke. 

^ This.  I've taken down a Pheasant at 50+ yards with the top barrel of my O/U with semi-high brass #6 shot 1350 FPS.  Mod over IC as I like the pattern a little looser.

[fishnut 2,358]

31 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

^ This.  I've taken down a Pheasant at 50+ yards with the top barrel of my O/U with semi-high brass #6 shot 1350 FPS.  Mod over IC as I like the pattern a little looser.

Yeah the ammo make  a difference too. I've been using Prairie storm #6 2 3/4 shot. Drops em like a rock and most pellets pass through. Even if they don't pass through they are nickel or copper coated so no munching on lead.

Don't bother with the prairie storm chokes, total gimmick. My buddy bought them and factory browning chokes pattern better. 

[NJSigfan 218]

I was in the same boat last year.  Ended up with a semi auto franchi.  For me it was smoother and less recoil made the follow up shot easier to find.  

Price point was mid 600s and I couldn’t be happier.

you’re welcome to come shoot it at the Clinton WMA if your local

[T Bill 649]

CZ Teal on sale at Cabelas right now! $549.99

https://www.cabelas.com/product/shooting/firearms/shotguns/over-under-side-by-side-shotguns/pc/104792580/c/553829580/sc/105537780/i/104802480/cz-usa-teal-over-amp-under-shotgun/2289337.uts?slotId=2

[W2MC 1,699]

8 hours ago, T Bill said:

CZ Teal on sale at Cabelas right now! $549.99

https://www.cabelas.com/product/shooting/firearms/shotguns/over-under-side-by-side-shotguns/pc/104792580/c/553829580/sc/105537780/i/104802480/cz-usa-teal-over-amp-under-shotgun/2289337.uts?slotId=2

beat me to it!  Just looking at the Cabela's ad for Father's day

They also have Beretta's A300 on sale  as well as Benelli Black Eagle 3, WInchester SX4, and Browning Citoris

Would be worth a look

 

[jm1827 284]

Thanks, everyone,  for the comments, lots of great info.

I currently have a 1964 870 Wingmaster that I use for clays and pheasant, for my limited use it works fine. I just started Pheasant hunting and a few of the guys I hunt with had 20 ga Citoris.  They let me use their guns and I liked them quite a bit.  I also shot a CZ Teal and liked that as well.

The reason I am looking for an O/U is because where I will be shooting requires a break open action, which would rule out my pump and a SA.

 

 

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Seriously?!  What kinda fudd place requires break action only?!  

[Ms. 12 Gauge 95]

That's racist.

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[jm1827 284]

The range is Hudson Farm, and from what I was told it is break action only.  And of course my contact could be mistaken.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Ah yeah I think that's break action only... Not Fuddy, just hoity toity... lol

[T Bill 649]

And expensive. Paper shell only and dumb dress code.  Not my kind of place!  They are not racist, just "classists" if you know what I mean.

[W2MC 1,699]

Just looked at their web page...wow.

Like em or dislike em....they are definitely "old school" ... no blue jeans, collared shirts, breakopen shotguns only, (and they provide the shells!)  ... but no info on how to join, for example ... I guess "If you have to ask...."

 

www.hudsonfarmnj.com

 

[Ms. 12 Gauge 95]

And expensive. Paper shell only and dumb dress code.  Not my kind of place!  They are not racist, just "classists" if you know what I mean.

[emoji16] I was joking since they apparently discriminate against black synthetic stocks! Oh well, I'm probably exactly the type of riff raff they're trying to keep out. I barely wear pants while shooting. 🤣🤣🤣

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[Scorpio64 5,146]

Just now, Ms. 12 Gauge said:

I barely wear pants while shooting.

. . . . . . Okay, this has to be some form of entrapment.

[Ms. 12 Gauge 95]

. . . . . . Okay, this has to be some form of entrapment.

🤣🤣🤣

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[Scorpio64 5,146]

Just now, T Bill said:

And expensive. Paper shell only and dumb dress code.  Not my kind of place!  They are not racist, just "classists" if you know what I mean.

I just found this photo taken last week at Hudson.

[Parker 213]

On 5/30/2018 at 8:59 AM, jm1827 said:

Thinking about getting an O/U for clays and some pheasant, budget is limited so I was thinking about either a CZ Teal or Mossberg Silver Reserve, leaning toward 20 ga.

Any concerns with either?  Any one stand out?

Save your money for a quality O/U if that's your preference, and buy a used one if possible. Often you can find good deals on them as others have mentioned. 

You don't need a 12 ga. for pheasant, but it is the most versatile gauge and offers lots of different loads if you prefer store-bought ammo. Over a pointing dog for pheasant, 12 ga. is overkill, however it is the preferred gauge for any of the clay games.

I like 12's for hunting only if they are light, balanced and handy afield, and I will pick a 20 ga. or 16 ga. for upland over a 12 ga. every time. The difference between a 12 ga. with a heavy load and a 20 ga. with a heavy load gives the 12 ga. almost a 20% advantage in pattern density. The trade-off is often heavier weight to lug around and stiffer recoil with the 12. 

 

A good read: 

https://www.range365.com/why-choose-and-over-under-shotgun#page-2

 

[Scorpio64 5,146]

Just now, Parker said:

You don't need a 12 ga. for pheasant, but it is the most versatile gauge and offers lots of different loads

I should have also mentioned ammo options, that was lazy of me.  There are so many good options  available, and just like with rifle, it's a process of trial end error to figure out what will work best for a particular application.

There is no law (yet) that says you have to use a full high brass load for hunting.  A lighter 7/8ths oz load (store bought or handload) with a wad cup that holds the pellets longer before blooming will keep patterns tighter without turning your quarry into pulverized mush.  Choke will be critical too.

Unfortunately, experimenting with shotgun ammo is not as easy as it is with rifle.  Documenting performance of different loads, swapping chokes and especially setting up patterning paper is a pita.But once it's done, you are golden, no more guessing.

Another option you get with OU, albeit expensive, is sub-gauge sleeves.  Shoot your trap with 12ga and throw in your $700 20ga sleeves for upland game.

[jm1827 284]

11 hours ago, Parker said:

Save your money for a quality O/U if that's your preference, and buy a used one if possible. Often you can find good deals on them as others have mentioned. 

You don't need a 12 ga. for pheasant, but it is the most versatile gauge and offers lots of different loads if you prefer store-bought ammo. Over a pointing dog for pheasant, 12 ga. is overkill, however it is the preferred gauge for any of the clay games.

I like 12's for hunting only if they are light, balanced and handy afield, and I will pick a 20 ga. or 16 ga. for upland over a 12 ga. every time. The difference between a 12 ga. with a heavy load and a 20 ga. with a heavy load gives the 12 ga. almost a 20% advantage in pattern density. The trade-off is often heavier weight to lug around and stiffer recoil with the 12. 

 

A good read: 

https://www.range365.com/why-choose-and-over-under-shotgun#page-2

 

Thanks Parker, definitely a good read.  I have been using an older 870 Wingmaster and an O/U is definitely on my horizon.  I will need one for my son as well, as he has been getting more into shooting and hunting.  So I will probably end up with 2 O/Us in short order! 

[jm1827 284]

7 hours ago, Scorpio64 said:

I should have also mentioned ammo options, that was lazy of me.  There are so many good options  available, and just like with rifle, it's a process of trial end error to figure out what will work best for a particular application.

There is no law (yet) that says you have to use a full high brass load for hunting.  A lighter 7/8ths oz load (store bought or handload) with a wad cup that holds the pellets longer before blooming will keep patterns tighter without turning your quarry into pulverized mush.  Choke will be critical too.

Unfortunately, experimenting with shotgun ammo is not as easy as it is with rifle.  Documenting performance of different loads, swapping chokes and especially setting up patterning paper is a pita.But once it's done, you are golden, no more guessing.

Another option you get with OU, albeit expensive, is sub-gauge sleeves.  Shoot your trap with 12ga and throw in your $700 20ga sleeves for upland game.

I reload and I pattern at my range so I am good there, I will look into the 20 ga sleves, that looks interesting. 

Thanks for the info, much appreciated!

[TOMMY R 24]

I own the CZ TEAL in 12 gauge bought it when it's on sale $550 I'm North of 3500 to 4000 rounds trouble free. It's Turkish oh well for the price couldn't be happier. Mainly 5 Stand  & Sporting Clays. My next O/U will probably be a Browning CYNERGY CX priced around $1500 not super fancy but solid. Great entry level gun. Also personal preference I prefer  Mechanical Triggers vs Inertia.